Is a header worth it??

I currently have intake and exhaust and was wondering if a header really is worth $300. I heard from some people that the Si's need backpressure and that a header won't help it that much. I was thinking about later going with a turbo and nitrous so please any opinions would be appreciated. Thanx.

I think you should save your money and go turbo...that 300 dollars can come in handy if you want turbo.

no engine needs backpressure, so getting a better flowing header will be a good idea....check out a JDM ITR header with a 2.5" collector..they are good

If you're looking for the most actual gains from your dollar, you'd be better served to save that money until you can get a turbo. You're almost guaranteed to get less than 10hp from a header, even in combination with the intake and exhaust you can't expect more than about 15hp above stock, at most. You can run low boost on the stock manifold if you want to, but ideally you'd probably be best to keep saving money until you can get the turbo put in right, and just have the header installed at the same time. Unfortunately, the concept of "cheap power" is one that isn't supported by most import cars, at least compared to say an american car with a 4.0L block or something.

hey civic SiR, do you seriously have an SiR or just do the swap? or is it just a canadian?

It's the canadian version of the US Si and has the Sir silver badge on the back.

not everybody wants to go turbo...but if you do, it's not worth getting a header in the first place....if you want to go all motor, you'll want to get a header...sounds simple enough

i agree with madtown plus if u are going turbo later like u said you might u wont need the header cuz the tubo replaces it

Originally posted by madtownhonda
not everybody wants to go turbo...but if you do, it's not worth getting a header in the first place....if you want to go all motor, you'll want to get a header...sounds simple enough

Good call. :flash:

If you look at it by ho wmuch power per HP it will give you, then no....

I/H/E gives about 15 TOTAL, AT MOST.

BUT......... the stock header is pretty inefficient. In order to get the most out of ALL of the internals, as well as the CAI and exhaust, you need to have all the parts working together...

Yes, a header IS worth the $$, not so much for massive HP, but t improve the overall performanc eof the engine and allow for larger HP gains with other mods...
Cams/stock header-tuned? 14hp or so
Cams/DC header-tuned? 20hp or so...

see what I mean?

Originally posted by madtownhonda
no engine needs backpressure, so getting a better flowing header will be a good idea....check out a JDM ITR header with a 2.5" collector..they are good

No engine needs backpressure huh? Ever ride around with no exhaust?



Yes, ALL Hondas need backpressure, or they completely LOSE low end power. Simple as that....

And no, a header will not adversley affect your performance, they are tested and designed for optimal HP and backpressure needed...... why do you think you pay up to 500 bucks for one?

Originally posted by Phatwhippin_CRX
why do you think you pay up to 500 bucks for one?

How about $1300 for a Hytech? Yikes! :eek:

Originally posted by Phatwhippin_CRX


No engine needs backpressure huh? Ever ride around with no exhaust?



Yes, ALL Hondas need backpressure, or they completely LOSE low end power. Simple as that....

And no, a header will not adversley affect your performance, they are tested and designed for optimal HP and backpressure needed...... why do you think you pay up to 500 bucks for one?

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t13199.html

^^Read up my friend :D

Anyways, I think a header is very much worth it. Just as long as you don't plan on going turbo.

peace
boi

Originally posted by VTEC_boi


http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t13199.html

^^Read up my friend :D

Anyways, I think a header is very much worth it. Just as long as you don't plan on going turbo.

peace
boi

yep, that thread explains the entire thing..thanks for posting that link:lol2:

Originally posted by madtownhonda
no engine needs backpressure, so getting a better flowing header will be a good idea....check out a JDM ITR header with a 2.5" collector..they are good
That is a blanket statemnt.
No race engine needs it, our 4 bangers with little or no tourqe do.

If you are going forced induction then it won't matter, don't bother.
If you have 300$ to blow do it, the increase won't blow you away.

Originally posted by VTEC_boi


http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t13199.html

^^Read up my friend :D

Anyways, I think a header is very much worth it. Just as long as you don't plan on going turbo.

peace
boi

Like Dez said, it's a blanket statement that does NOT apply to all cars...


ESPECIALLY small displacement, no torque Hondas that need to rev HIGH to make any power. Our small economy cars NEED backpressure to produce any kind of low end torque.......... which is what makes cars move, HP is what makes them fast.......

Originally posted by madtownhonda


yep, that thread explains the entire thing..thanks for posting that link:lol2:


Un-bolt your exhaust at the header and drive around for a week like that, then tell me where your low-end power goes. Trust me, I drove around like that for a week and the car couldnt move out of its own damn way until 4800 rpms when it just pulled like a bat out of hell.

For a full out drag car, backpressure = bad

Daily driven? you need it.....

That just doesn't go for 4 bangers. I frequently check out the windsor (5.0L and 5.8L found in mustangs) forum at corral.net and they also say you need backpressure. There are some really intellegent people there that could explain to you why you need it.
Anyway,
Ktulu

backpressure on any car is bad no matter what the condition period.

Q. do you know why you loose low end power when you remove your exhaust at the header?

A. an exhaust system doesnt exist soley to provide sex appeal my friends and nor does it exist to provide backpressure. what it does exist for is its scavanging capabilities. at a low rpm the cat back section is necessary for keeping the egts up and creating a path for exhaust to travel so the velocity remains high and it can scavange the exhaust behind it and pull it forward towards the muffler where at that point it will be expelled. the cat back is in essence a suction pump for exhaust gas in the lower rpm range because it doesnt have the velocity on its own to move freely out of the system. take the header off at low rpm and you are actually creating backpressure from the turbulance of not having a controlled flow or not having any suction to pull recently expelled gases out of the header. all this leads to reversion which is why you have shit for power if you take it off at the header.

you need the catback not to create backpressure, you need it to help scavange your header in the low rpm range. after a given point in the rpm scale a catback or any exhaust becomes a restriction because the rapidly increasing rpm which means rapidly increasing flow volume of exhaust gas has enough velocity of its own to push gas out of the header. a perfect system would have the whole exhaust on untill a switchover point where it would switch to an open header. unfortunatly noise and emissions laws and general stupidity prvent that from happening.

if ya dont believe it then i can let you talk to some mechanical engineers that are friends of mine and they can get way more technical to clarify anything for you.

thanks for the backup Rick hehehe

Apparently the new JG Header pumps out 13 hp to a B18C1??? I guess Import Tuner dyno'd it at that much. That's a lot of power, the draw-back is it cost around $600. I think if I get a header, I'll get a 2.5" collector'd Type-R Header... Better dyno results than DC, and its HONDA OEM.

if not planning on going turbo get the header.

Originally posted by i like naked girls
backpressure on any car is bad no matter what the condition period.

Q. do you know why you loose low end power when you remove your exhaust at the header?

A. an exhaust system doesnt exist soley to provide sex appeal my friends and nor does it exist to provide backpressure. what it does exist for is its scavanging capabilities. at a low rpm the cat back section is necessary for keeping the egts up and creating a path for exhaust to travel so the velocity remains high and it can scavange the exhaust behind it and pull it forward towards the muffler where at that point it will be expelled. the cat back is in essence a suction pump for exhaust gas in the lower rpm range because it doesnt have the velocity on its own to move freely out of the system. take the header off at low rpm and you are actually creating backpressure from the turbulance of not having a controlled flow or not having any suction to pull recently expelled gases out of the header. all this leads to reversion which is why you have shit for power if you take it off at the header.

you need the catback not to create backpressure, you need it to help scavange your header in the low rpm range. after a given point in the rpm scale a catback or any exhaust becomes a restriction because the rapidly increasing rpm which means rapidly increasing flow volume of exhaust gas has enough velocity of its own to push gas out of the header. a perfect system would have the whole exhaust on untill a switchover point where it would switch to an open header. unfortunatly noise and emissions laws and general stupidity prvent that from happening.

if ya dont believe it then i can let you talk to some mechanical engineers that are friends of mine and they can get way more technical to clarify anything for you.
Bla bla, the point is dynos show they don't do shit on civics , you can get as technical as you want, including moisture levels in the atmosphere, tempereature, atmoization of fuel in the combustion process. But is still does not take away the fact on a stock motor, especially the SOHC civics lose power using 4-1 headers on 70% of the rev band and 4-2-1s produce minor gains, when combined with an exaust you'd be lucky to get 6 HP at the wheels and that is not noticable.

Originally posted by Dezoris

Bla bla, the point is dynos show they don't do shit on civics , you can get as technical as you want, including moisture levels in the atmosphere, tempereature, atmoization of fuel in the combustion process. But is still does not take away the fact on a stock motor, especially the SOHC civics lose power using 4-1 headers on 70% of the rev band and 4-2-1s produce minor gains, when combined with an exaust you'd be lucky to get 6 HP at the wheels and that is not noticable.



agreed on for a civic (unless its supercharged). but larger motors can greatly benefit from them.

Originally posted by Si2000 Vtec
I'll get a 2.5" collector'd Type-R Header... Better dyno results than DC

http://www.automotiveperformanceengineering.com/header.html

Might wanna compare the graphs....