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Old 10-31-2006, 08:36 AM   #46
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

A little OT, but related...

I got Osram Silverstars for my motorcycle and they are definitely a different bulb than the Sylvania Silverstars.

While I would not claim to be an expert, I have played with many different bulbs and unless you are running an illegal bulb, there is not LOTS of difference.

The Osrams provide noticeably more beam length, but again, it's not a huge difference.

Many times those high watt illegal bulbs do put out lots of light, but that does not necessarily make it useful. What good is a bunch of extra light it most of it just adds extra glare? Besides, many of them cost a small fortune and burn out rather quickly. The Silverstars, GE Nighthawks, and Phillips VisionPlus are the best combination of light, life, and cost, IMO.

If you want significantly more, then as mentioned, add some auxillary lighting.

To avoid deer in my truck, I have added relays to better supply the factory headlights (reduced voltage drop) and also added some (approximately) 8" round Bosch pencil beam driving lights with 100W H3 bulbs and some rectangular Bosch driving lights also with 100W H3 bulbs.

Then, the problem is, you can't see a darn thing when you turn them off meeting another car because your eyes are so use to the bright illumination.
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:16 AM   #47
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

I've updated the spec list to include Nighthawks, but couldn't find info for Visionplus. If someone sees the specs please let me know and I'll add them.



Low Beams/9006

Type Watts (power consumption) Hours (life span) Kelvin (color) Lumens (light output)
Stock55100032001000
GE Nighthawk5585035701000
Silverstar5515040001000
Silverstar Ultra551504000 1200
Toshiba HIR 90125580036001700







High Beams/9005

Type Watts (power consumption) Hours (life span) Kelvin (color) Lumens (light output)
Stock6532032001700
GE Nighthawk6572037001695
Silverstar6513540001700
Silverstar Ultra651354000 2040
Toshiba HIR 90116530036002300
HID3530004100-100003200
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:24 AM   #48
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

Quote:
Originally Posted by alphalanos
Just wanted to say that Im using Silverstars on my Civic and Im pretty happy with them. Replacing your housings at the same time makes a good difference. I wanted to try the Ultras but they dont make them in my type. I would love to have HID but a decent set is $450, a little out of my budget.

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Old 10-31-2006, 09:41 AM   #49
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

Quote:
Originally Posted by muzzy1maniac
Curious. I'm thinking it's different in the states. I don't have any statutes but factory fog/driving lights turn off automatically when you switch to high beams so I'll stick with what I posted earlier.
Looks like the difference is the way they are aimed, Florida law states that drivers must be able to switch between different elevations of light distribution. Since most of the oem auxiliary lights are driving/fog lights and aimed below the eyeline of other drivers they are classified as the lower most distribution of light and must be turned off when the uppermost (high beams) distrubution of light is selected.

The opposite would be true for driving lights aimed in the uppermost distribution of light. Which appear to be the type that riptide is talking about.

It also appears that in florida, you can have a shitload of lights on the front of your car as long as you call them different names.




316.233 Spot lamps and auxiliary lamps.--
(1) SPOT LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two spot lamps and every lighted spot lamp shall be so aimed and used that no part of the high intensity portion of the beam will strike the windshield, or any windows, mirror, or occupant of another vehicle in use.
(2) FOG LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two fog lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 12 inches nor more than 30 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands and so aimed that when the vehicle is not loaded none of the high intensity portion of the light to the left of the center of the vehicle shall at a distance of 25 feet ahead project higher than a level of 4 inches below the level of the center of the lamp from which it comes. Lighted fog lamps meeting the above requirements may be used with lower headlamp beams as specified in s. 316.237(1)(b).
(3) AUXILIARY PASSING LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary passing lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 24 inches nor more than 42 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands. The provisions of s. 316.237 shall apply to any combination of headlamps and auxiliary passing lamps.
(4) AUXILIARY DRIVING LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary driving lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 16 inches nor more than 42 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands. The provisions of s. 316.237 shall apply to any combination of headlamps and auxiliary driving lamps.
(5) VIOLATIONS.--A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a nonmoving violation as provided in chapter 318.




316.237 Multiple-beam road-lighting equipment.--
(1) Except as hereinafter provided, the headlamps or the auxiliary driving lamp or the auxiliary passing lamp or combination thereof on motor vehicles shall be so arranged that the driver may select at will between distributions of light projected to different elevations and such lamps may, in addition, be so arranged that such selection can be made automatically, subject to the following limitations:
(a) There shall be an uppermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of such intensity as to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 450 feet ahead for all conditions of loading.
(b) There shall be a lowermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of sufficient intensity to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 150 feet ahead; and on a straight level road under any condition of loading none of the high intensity portion of the beam shall be directed to strike the eyes of an approaching driver.

An object, material, or covering that alters the headlamp's visibility from at least 450 feet for an uppermost distribution of light or at least 150 feet for a lowermost distribution of light may not be placed, displayed, installed, affixed, or applied over a headlamp.

(2) Every new motor vehicle registered in this state shall be equipped with a beam indicator, which shall be lighted whenever the uppermost distribution of light from the headlamps is in use, and shall not otherwise be lighted. Said indicator shall be so designed and located that when lighted it will be readily visible without glare to the driver of the vehicle so equipped.
(3) A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a nonmoving violation as provided in chapter 318.
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:43 AM   #50
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

I don't think they are driving lights on new cars, the are fog lights and go off when you turn on the high beams.
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:47 AM   #51
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

Quote:
Originally Posted by blazee
Looks like the difference is the way they are aimed, Florida law states that drivers must be able to switch between different elevations of light distribution. Since most of the oem auxiliary lights are driving/fog lights and aimed below the eyeline of other drivers they are classified as the lower most distribution of light and must be turned off when the uppermost (high beams) distrubution of light is selected.

The opposite would be true for driving lights aimed in the uppermost distribution of light. Which appear to be the type that riptide is talking about.

It also appears that in florida, you can have a shitload of lights on the front of your car as long as you call them different names.




316.233 Spot lamps and auxiliary lamps.--
(1) SPOT LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two spot lamps and every lighted spot lamp shall be so aimed and used that no part of the high intensity portion of the beam will strike the windshield, or any windows, mirror, or occupant of another vehicle in use.
(2) FOG LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two fog lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 12 inches nor more than 30 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands and so aimed that when the vehicle is not loaded none of the high intensity portion of the light to the left of the center of the vehicle shall at a distance of 25 feet ahead project higher than a level of 4 inches below the level of the center of the lamp from which it comes. Lighted fog lamps meeting the above requirements may be used with lower headlamp beams as specified in s. 316.237(1)(b).
(3) AUXILIARY PASSING LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary passing lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 24 inches nor more than 42 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands. The provisions of s. 316.237 shall apply to any combination of headlamps and auxiliary passing lamps.
(4) AUXILIARY DRIVING LAMPS.--Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary driving lamps mounted on the front at a height not less than 16 inches nor more than 42 inches above the level surface upon which the vehicle stands. The provisions of s. 316.237 shall apply to any combination of headlamps and auxiliary driving lamps.
(5) VIOLATIONS.--A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a nonmoving violation as provided in chapter 318.




316.237 Multiple-beam road-lighting equipment.--
(1) Except as hereinafter provided, the headlamps or the auxiliary driving lamp or the auxiliary passing lamp or combination thereof on motor vehicles shall be so arranged that the driver may select at will between distributions of light projected to different elevations and such lamps may, in addition, be so arranged that such selection can be made automatically, subject to the following limitations:
(a) There shall be an uppermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of such intensity as to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 450 feet ahead for all conditions of loading.
(b) There shall be a lowermost distribution of light, or composite beam, so aimed and of sufficient intensity to reveal persons and vehicles at a distance of at least 150 feet ahead; and on a straight level road under any condition of loading none of the high intensity portion of the beam shall be directed to strike the eyes of an approaching driver.

An object, material, or covering that alters the headlamp's visibility from at least 450 feet for an uppermost distribution of light or at least 150 feet for a lowermost distribution of light may not be placed, displayed, installed, affixed, or applied over a headlamp.

(2) Every new motor vehicle registered in this state shall be equipped with a beam indicator, which shall be lighted whenever the uppermost distribution of light from the headlamps is in use, and shall not otherwise be lighted. Said indicator shall be so designed and located that when lighted it will be readily visible without glare to the driver of the vehicle so equipped.
(3) A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a nonmoving violation as provided in chapter 318.

Great - all that reading - now I need a nap.
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:54 AM   #52
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

Consumer Reports
Not all bright ideas are the most economical

By the editors of Consumer Reports

Premium replacement-headlight bulbs are marketed as a functional and cosmetic improvement over the conventional bulbs found in most cars. But are they? Consumer Reports recently tested five top-selling models to find out.

Bulbs such as the APC Plasma Ultra White, GE Nighthawk, Philips CrystalVision, Sylvania SilverStar, and Wagner TruView try to mimic the whiter, brighter light of the high-intensity-discharge (HID) lamps that are standard equipment on some pricey vehicles.

HID lights can be brighter than conventional halogen bulbs, but illuminated distances are often just comparable. One clear advantage of conventional halogen lighting over HID is that, when the former requires replacement, you need only change the bulb — usually a simple task for most backyard mechanics. With high-intensity-discharge lights, the entire assembly must be replaced.

Premium halogen-replacement bulbs attempt to offer some of the benefits of HID lights while fitting into the vehicle's original headlight assembly.

The five bulbs Consumer Reports tested are priced between $26 and $40 a pair (two to three times the price of standard halogen bulbs) and are sold in discount or auto-parts stores. The test bulbs claimed Department of Transportation-standard compliance. Noncompliant bulbs may be marked as "for off-road use only."

CR's tests were designed to be both subjective (to determine how well distant objects could be seen by the human eye) and objective (measuring bulb illuminance, or brightness). Three test vehicles — a Chrysler Sebring, a Toyota Camry and a Honda Ridgeline — were used to provide a variety of bulb sizes and original equipment (OE) performance. (The Wagner TruView was not available for the Honda.)

To test claims of increased brightness, CR moved inside a dark building and placed a light sensor 50 feet in front of each vehicle — at different heights, both on center and to the right to simulate a shoulder.

Subjectively, all five bulbs emitted a whiter light than OE bulbs. That could prove attractive to buyers seeking the look of HID lights: Studies show that some drivers prefer driving behind whiter light than the more yellow light of most OE halogen bulbs. But that doesn't mean you can see farther.

In the distance tests, only the GE Nighthawk improved low-beam sight distance, and then just for the Honda Ridgeline. Generally, low- and high-beam distance either remained the same or decreased with the premium replacement bulbs.

Meanwhile, results of CR's brightness tests showed some localized improvements, but no one replacement bulb scored consistently better than OE. The Nighthawk and APC Plasma Ultra White improved illuminance in more tests than the other bulbs, some of which did not perform as well as stock bulbs.

Premium replacement bulbs may be cosmetically pleasing — CR's tests showed that they do yield whiter-looking light than original-equipment bulbs — but they don't offer a consistent performance advantage. In fact, they can perform worse than OE bulbs.

Bottom line: Outfitting your car with these dazzling premium bulbs may not be such a bright idea.

2005, Consumers Union

Copyright © 2006 The Seattle Times Company
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Old 10-31-2006, 10:05 AM   #53
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

A bit different article with some more info:

Sorry, but for some reason, I'm not allowed to edit my post anymore, or start new threads!?

A Consumer Reports Study

Replacement headlight bulbs: A bright idea?

Premium replacement headlight bulbs are marketed as a functional and cosmetic improvement over the conventional bulbs found in most cars. The bulbs try to mimic the whiter, brighter light of the high-intensity-discharge (HID) lights found on some pricey vehicles. However, while these bulbs emit whiter-looking light, they don’t provide a consistent performance improvement in our tests.

Changes in lighting regulations in the mid-1980s allowed automobile designers to create aerodynamic headlight assemblies. These assemblies use a replaceable halogen bulb rather than an entire replaceable assembly. Headlight performance varies considerably depending on the assembly’s design, including reflector design and lens shape.

Expensive HID lights are a more recent innovation. CR’s tests have shown that HID lights can be brighter, but illuminated distances are often comparable to those of halogen bulbs. Premium halogen replacement bulbs attempt to offer some of the benefits of HID lights while retaining the vehicle’s original headlight assembly.

Bulb replacement is usually a simple task for most backyard mechanics.


MEASURING THE LIGHTS

CR tested five premium replacement bulbs, one from each of the top-selling brands: the APC Plasma Ultra White, GE Nighthawk, Philips CrystalVision, Sylvania SilverStar, and Wagner TruView. The bulbs are priced between $26 and $40 a pair (two to three times more than standard bulbs) and are sold in discount or auto-parts stores. All tested bulbs claim Department of Transportation-standard compliance; noncompliant bulbs may be marked as “for off-road use only.”

Tests were both subjective, to determine how well distant objects could be seen by the human eye, and objective, measuring bulb illuminance, or brightness.

Three test vehicles, a Chrysler Sebring, a Toyota Camry, and a Honda Ridgeline, were used to provide a variety of bulb sizes and original equipment (OE) performance.

Headlight distance is vital because the sooner an object is illuminated, the better the chance of avoiding it. Distance is measured outdoors on a moonless night, from a stationary vehicle. Black, unlighted signs were set up at various distances, and engineers recorded which were visible from each vehicle with each set of bulbs. Only one set of bulbs, the Nighthawk, improved low-beam sight distance for one tested vehicle, the Ridgeline. However, they reduced distance on the Camry. Generally, low- and high-beam distance either remained the same or decreased with replacement bulbs.

To test claims of increased brightness, CR measured illuminance, the quantity of light that reaches a particular area. Inside a dark building, a light sensor was placed at a distance 50 feet in front of each vehicle at different heights both on center and 8 feet to the right to simulate a roadway shoulder. Results showed some localized improvements, but no one bulb scored consistently better than OE. The Nighthawk and Plasma Ultra White improved illuminance in more tests than the other bulbs, some of which did not perform as well as stock bulbs.

Subjectively, all five bulbs emitted a whiter light than OE bulbs, which could appeal to buyers seeking the look of HID lights. Studies show that some drivers prefer driving behind whiter light than the more yellow light of most OE halogen bulbs, but that doesn’t mean you can see farther.

Some manufacturers claim that their premium halogen bulbs improve brightness without causing oncoming glare, a common complaint about HID lights. Oncoming glare is caused by a combination of bright lights and an inherent sharp light cutoff. This combination can exist in HID or halogen lights. Most of the tested bulb-vehicle combinations did not cause high levels of oncoming glare. But using whiter premium bulbs in the Honda Ridgeline increased glare to where it could be a discomfort for oncoming drivers.


BOTTOM LINE

Our tests showed that while they do yield whiter-looking light, premium aftermarket halogen bulbs don’t offer a consistent performance advantage over original equipment bulbs, and they can perform worse. Much of a headlight’s distribution of light is dictated by its reflector and lens, factors that remain unaffected by changing the bulb. And the combination of higher cost and some manufacturer specifications of a shorter life span than standard replacement bulbs add up to increased costs.


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Old 10-31-2006, 10:06 AM   #54
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

Yeah the cat's been out of the bag a while about the bulbs that use a blue coating to make the bulbs appear whiter. The majority produce less light. And those that manage to produce equal or slightly more light have a color further up in the spectrum that can't be fully utilized by the human eye. So even by producing more light, they still give you less vision.

There's a lot of info about bulbs at http://www.danielsternlighting.com/
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Old 10-31-2006, 05:53 PM   #55
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

wow i didnt even know there was report about headlights - good to know though and it confirms exactly what i have seen for myself - and it is true the ge nighthawks ( which i got rid of becuase of glare to other drivers and to my eye a loss of long distance performance) did give somewhat better low beam performance - they would light up the sides of road either side of you - but only out to about 50 yards - that does make you feel better about whats waiting in the ditch to jump out in front of you - if they could just reduce the glare and improve the long distance visual they'd have a good light .


someone said something about depending on what you called them - you could have any lights you want on the front -- i know what you're saying - there is a difference between a spotlamp and an off road lamp even though most people ( including myself until i knew ) call them all off road or 4x4 lights- a spot light has an intense focused straight line beam and even here where i live you can have up to 2 of those on a vehicle legally without covers and use them ,even though they are 100 watts - if you look at a real off road light - equally 100 watts - they are illegal uncovered on the highway because they are actually a flood light ( no focus just emmits light everywhere ) - i have both spots and floods on my jimmy for off roading - ( the floods get covered before i hit the highway - and it always gets a good chuckle from the local cop who asks why aren't they all covered - but his reg book always lets me go .....even when they are on you can see the difference in how the light is focused - or in the case of the floods - not focused .
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Old 10-31-2006, 06:18 PM   #56
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

I have to cover the 8" Bosch lights I have - for off-road use only. Technically, the rectangular ones are illegal too since they are fitted OEM with 55w bulbs but I have replaced them with 100w.

I don't turn any of them on unless there are no cars for a LONG distance ahead and or off on some real desolate roads.
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Old 12-27-2006, 11:27 PM   #57
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

good info
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Old 12-28-2006, 01:13 AM   #58
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

What I find to be interesting is the hour rating of the Silver Star bulbs (150 hours) ...

I installed a set of Silver Stars on my car oh, almost three years ago now. I extensively drive the car at night time, and I'm pretty sure that I've put orders of magnitude more time on my bulbs than 150 hours ... almost half of my 15-20k/yr driving is at night - that's up to 30k miles on these bulbs.
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:18 PM   #59
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

any thing new ????
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Old 08-11-2007, 02:25 AM   #60
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Re: Brightest NON HID bulbs

just wanted to chime in that daniel stern does have a great resource if you end up going non hid
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