B20 myths.

[8PSiB16EF9]

O.K. I'm not putting down the B20 at all.... They are good JDM's are good but I have heard that the USDM B20's compression is not as good as the JDM's. If you look at the honda tunning AWD integra project they were running a B20/VTec and they also stated the same... JDM B20's are better. Now as far as B20's beating B16... I don't know what B16's you guys run but I have a B16 in my EF and have yet to loose to a B20. Last one I ran was a B20 in a EG HB and I'm not one of those EF's that are gutted or a bunch of weight BS. DRIVER...... driver makes a big difference. A two of my other friends are running B16's in EG's and both have also beaten B20's. Until I see the point especially converting over intake mani.'s and such I'll stick with B16's... heck I'll put my old JDM DOHC turbo ZC at 2 PSI against a B20. B20/VTec on the other hand I can't speak for since I have only heard the myths and have yet to race one or drive one. A kid at the local races where I'm at is running a Built B20/VTec running TEC 3 and I hear it goes but it's just came out last week and have yet to see it run.

[8PSiB16EF9]

Oh and you can run any B series trans EXCEPT the CR-V trans... DUH but I just had to put that in. Cable hydro LS B16 B18 not difference just if you run a cable in a hydro car or a hydro in a cable car you need to buy the converter from HASport.

[andera]

Originally Posted by Carnivore

1.54 rod stroke ratio?.....Correct me if im wrong but that is kinda bad, how does one get the ration higher?

you could get a b16a crank and that'll make it a near perfect 1.77:1.... however you lose .3L......... question is spin to 10k or 7.5k heh. if you could get 130fp/tq at 10k rpm that'd be almost 250hp... just some food for thought hehe.

[crxtacy]

you could get a b16a crank and that'll make it a near perfect 1.77:1.... however you lose .3L......... question is spin to 10k or 7.5k heh. if you could get 130fp/tq at 10k rpm that'd be almost 250hp... just some food for thought hehe


are you speaking of experience or just what you have heard. do you have any info on this or any links to sites? are u talking about a b16 crank in a b20 block?? there is no way the rods or the head would take that kinda rpms without some serious modifications. but that is some really intersting info.

[andera]

Originally Posted by crxtacy

you could get a b16a crank and that'll make it a near perfect 1.77:1.... however you lose .3L......... question is spin to 10k or 7.5k heh. if you could get 130fp/tq at 10k rpm that'd be almost 250hp... just some food for thought hehe


are you speaking of experience or just what you have heard. do you have any info on this or any links to sites? are u talking about a b16 crank in a b20 block?? there is no way the rods or the head would take that kinda rpms without some serious modifications. but that is some really intersting info.

a b16a crank WILL fit into a b20 block with no problems watsoever. they're the same block, except the bore on the b20 is 84 and the bore on the b16 is 81, and the crank is different. the only difference between a b20 and a b16 is the stroke (because the cranks are different). the b18/20 stroke is 89 and the b16 stroke is 77.4

84*84*89*3.1416 = 1972874.5344 (ie 2.0L)...
81*81*89*3.1416 = 1834471.3464 (ie 1.8L)...
81*81*77.4*3.1416 = 1595371.71024 (ie 1.6L)...


ok... so now for clearance...

deck height on a b20 = 211.84 mm
rod height on a b20 = 137mm
b20 piston comp height = 29.59
b20 piston dome height = .89mm
deck clearance = .76mm

do the math...

Block Deck Height = (Stroke/2) + Rod Length + Compression Height + Stock Deck Clearance

so.... (77.4/2) + 137 + (29.59+.89) + .76 = 206.94 which is less tahn 211.8 .. so it'll all fit.

just an fyi, i got most of this off the team-integra website (www.team-integra.net)... its a good site, but you have to register. here's a quote off an article there...

If you don't have your heart set on more displacement, the permutations and combinations are numerous. You just need to make sure the rods fit the piston and the crank, check that everything will fit in the deck height of the block you choose, and calculate the resultant displacement and rod ratio. As a popular recent example, many people try a B16A crank (77.4 mm) with LS rods (137 mm rod length) in a CRV block (84.5 mm bore when honed) to give 1736 cc, an oversquare layout, and a 1.77 rod ratio. You essentially build a 1.7 L Civic Type R Plus engine in your LS Integra that can rev like a bike.

add a b16 head to that.... oh my gosh, talk about a fun engine!!!

EDIT: on the 250hp thing... IF you're engine is pulling 130 lbs of torque at 10k rpm.... (130*10000)/5252 = 247.5hp... thats where i got that, it was all theoretical. Also... you would probably wanna replace the internals if you wanted it to last long....

[kris]

ALL B20B's have the same compression, regardless if they are JDM, or USDM motors. B20Z's are the higher compression motor, which are rarer, and cost more to get.

But if you end up resleaving, and stuffing new pistons in. Go with the B20B, its still cheaper.

[andera]

Originally Posted by kris

ALL B20B's have the same compression, regardless if they are JDM, or USDM motors. B20Z's are the higher compression motor, which are rarer, and cost more to get.

But if you end up resleaving, and stuffing new pistons in. Go with the B20B, its still cheaper.

its pointless to get the Z if you're rebuilding, for sure. more $ for crap you're gonna throw aawy.

[96Civ]

Ok, reading all the posts, I have a few questions about the B20.

Would you aim for more RPM's, hence a near perfect R/S Ratio because more RPM's is more work done, right? Would that mean we all should be aiming for a motor that can rev higher because there will be more power gains? I.E. More torque and horsepower at 10k than 5k?

How would setting up a turbo to boost at 5k compair to 10k? What are the advantages and disadvantages?

[andera]

Originally Posted by 96Civ

Ok, reading all the posts, I have a few questions about the B20.

Would you aim for more RPM's, hence a near perfect R/S Ratio because more RPM's is more work done, right? Would that mean we all should be aiming for a motor that can rev higher because there will be more power gains? I.E. More torque and horsepower at 10k than 5k?

How would setting up a turbo to boost at 5k compair to 10k? What are the advantages and disadvantages?

if you're gonna boost get as close to 1.75:1 rs ratio as possible (less stress on the cylinders).... all motor keep the b20 crank. it would be hella cool having an engine that made power through 10k rpm, but the power band would be too narrow to use it with any stock tranny.... might as well keep the torque i guess.

[96Civ]

Wait, you lose torque? Well forget that!

So, what kind of crank would I need to get close to 1.75 but without suffering too much power or liter loss?

Also, does a better R/S ratio make more power, or just prevent stress on the engine? Can you just decrease this 'stress' with really strong eternals?

[andera]

Originally Posted by 96Civ

Wait, you lose torque? Well forget that!

So, what kind of crank would I need to get close to 1.75 but without suffering too much power or liter loss?

Also, does a better R/S ratio make more power, or just prevent stress on the engine? Can you just decrease this 'stress' with really strong eternals?

if you're going turbo, the loss in CC's can easily be made up.... you cant really get a better r/s w/out losing CC's unless you really bore out the engine... if you used a b16 crank you'd have to bore out to 89mm on each cylinder to get 1.9L.... thats a ton, i dont even think thats possible... having the 1.7L "LS/Vtec" with the 1.77:1 would be hell acool but not very practical i think.... i d k, havent found any real-world results

[96Civ]

So why would the R/S really matter if you dont even plan using stock internals?

[andera]

Originally Posted by 96Civ

So why would the R/S really matter if you dont even plan using stock internals?

huge redline... and unless you got the block sleeved you're sideloading would become a problem...

[96Civ]

I'm thinking, resleeved block w/ forged pistons boosted, with b16 head and why do you need a high redline when you will be making power at about 4k-5.5k? Unless the R/S is robbing me power I don't really see why it would matter that much if I don't plan to rev that high.

[andera]

Originally Posted by 96Civ

I'm thinking, resleeved block w/ forged pistons boosted, with b16 head and why do you need a high redline when you will be making power at about 4k-5.5k? Unless the R/S is robbing me power I don't really see why it would matter that much if I don't plan to rev that high.

hmm well if you did it right you wouldnt be making your power at 4k-5.5k

DUH thats the whole f*ing point. you can make your power band whever you want it (if you know enough to match all the parts together...), however if you were really smart you'd match your power band to your transmissions gearings so that you'd fall into the power band every shift.....