Beyond The Ultimate: The Definitive McLaren F1 LM Archive

[Peloton25]

Fixed both instances of the link and of course you can.

>8^)
ER

[Peloton25]

Wasn't sure of a better place to stick this but some of you might be interested in purchasing a print of this image I found on Tumblr:



http://salmanorguk.tumblr.com/post/3...ased-in-europe

No affiliation - just thought it was cool.

>8^)
ER

[SD F1]

Originally Posted by Peloton25

Interesting photo I just stumbled on of LM3 below. The album it's in claims the photo is from July 11th, 1996 which means it was probably taken as they were completing the original build of this car. Strangely the front license plate is already fitted and even more strange it was left exposed while inside the factory which is pretty rare to see.



Click the pic to access the album for a larger version of this shot and another image of a random silver F1.

>8^)
ER

Hey Erik- Just browsing and noticed something maybe no one else has noticed. Look at the green protective tape on the fromt of the car. Notice it is the same protective tape that currently resides on the Black Brunei photo. Those cars were never driven quite possibly! Anyway just a thought.

WFG

[hurstg01]

LM3 certainly has been driven, by all 3 owners. It looks like protective transport tape

[SD F1]

Originally Posted by hurstg01

LM3 certainly has been driven, by all 3 owners. It looks like protective transport tape

Yeah I was referring to that exact same tape on the Brunei LM1 or LM4 (whichever it is) earlier in this post as still having that same tape in place in Brunei. Meaning it may have never been driven! What a shame that it is sitting still.

W

[Peloton25]

This photo and the ones like it were taken inside the Genesis factory prior to the car being shipped to Brunei.



>8^)
ER

[HansGruber]

Hello,

Don't know if this has been brought up before.

I noticed in the picture below (its massive so I won't embed it) that this LM (is this one LM3?) is using Michelin Pilot Sport tires. However, in the photos that I see of XP1LM it is using Michelin SX tires, which are listed as the the factory spec tires on many websites. My question is, did the 5 production LMs come with Pilot Sport tires, or did they come with SX tires and the owner of the LM pictured put on the Pilot Sport? I know Pilot Sports are a newer tire and probably weren't around in 1995 (guess I just answered my own question...) but I am just looking for confirmation. Do the other 4 production LMs now have Pilot Sports? Can someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I am guessing the Pilot Sport tires perform better than the SX tires? Did the factory offer the Pilot Sports tires as a factory upgrade from the SX?



http://jessicamichault.com/wp-conten...-f3q-light.jpg

Secondly, in the picture I posted the rear tire appears to be 345 55/ZR18. I thought the the rear tire tread height was 35 not 55? Maybe I just have bad eyes, but it kind of looks like a 55.

Lastly, in the 0-100-0 test, was that car using SX tires or Pilot Sport tires. If it was using the SX tires, I wonder what times it would have pulled off with the Pilot Sport tires if they are higher performance than the SX tires?

Is the photo above the only picture of its kind, or did it come in a set? I would really like other super high res photos such as this because I can really appreciate all the fine details. It looks like this one has a clear bra on it.

Thanks,

[Sami Aaltonen]

Originally Posted by HansGruber

Hello,

Lastly, in the 0-100-0 test, was that car using SX tires or Pilot Sport tires. If it was using the SX tires, I wonder what times it would have pulled off with the Pilot Sport tires if they are higher performance than the SX tires?

Thanks,

Fantastic questions!!! I don't know facts but I think LM3 has new tyre set after it left from factory. It has been driven "quite much" I think, so no wonder if there has been need to new tyre set. This is what I think, don't know for sure.

I went to my collection box to get out the magazine where this test was. CAR Magazine December 1999. First they tryed with Pirelli P Zeroes. With the cool Pirellis, without any satisfying set up at the car Wallace puts 11,6s time to the table. The record has been done allready but they wanted to continue.
After that they changed tyres to Michelin Pilot's. The story doesn't tell were they Sport Pilots or not. Second run aborted and the third run they did was 11,9s.

Story goes:

..." Wallace discuss tyre pressures and corner weights with the team, trying to sort out an apparent loss of grip at the front left wheel. A 19kg adjustment corner to corner is agreed, while crew lets air out of the Michelins (droping from 34psi to 25psi) in a bid to put a wider spread of tyre tread onto the ground. Wallace guns the LM for run four, giving no quarter. Despite getting wheelsping in all three gears, he posts the quickest 0-100-0 time in hostry, arriving back at a standstill just 11,5s after leaving the line."

Hope this gaved some answers to you.

[Peloton25]

Yes - that's LM3.

That is one of the pictures taken for the book and to promote the exhibition of Ralph's collection at Musee d'Art in Paris in 2011. I'd not seen it previously at that resolution or anything close to it, so thanks for sharing.

As for the tires, it is a strange 3 on the side of the Michelin Pilot Sport for the aspect ratio, but they are indeed the standard sized 345/35's.

Recent photos taken inside the MTC show the tires on XP1 LM are still the earlier Pilot SX's. Since that LM is not being driven, there would be no reason to incur the costs to change them. The only other LM I can confirm wears the newer Pilot Sports today is LM2.

I would not expect the Brunei LMs to have had their tires changed at all from new. It's not even known whether the tires have air left inside them but tires are not really at the top of my list for questions about the cars left in Brunei, that's for sure.

Fair to speculate that there was a running change in tire spec by McLaren for the cars fitted with 18" wheels and any car that has needed tires since that change would have received the Pilot Sports. There are several of the road cars with High Downforce kits fitted and road-going GTRs that also wear 18" wheels paired with the Pilot Sport tires presently. I don't believe any of the ones that are actively used have the Pilot SX's on them but I have not checked each one. Unfortunately I can't tell you when that spec change would have been - maybe our friend from M.S.O. will see the question and provide more detail?

There was also a switch very early on from Goodyear Eagle F1s to Michelin Pilot Sport FX SZ's on the 17" wheels, but it is unclear when that took place or even whether the Goodyears are still available. There are a couple of F1s around that I've noticed still have the Goodyears fitted (chassis #012 is one) but they are not cars that see very much use, if any.

>8^)
ER

[M.S.O]

Next time I have a spare few minutes I'll have a look at the tyre testing files and see what there is about the change in the 18s, it was only a few years ago we had the 18s completely re-tooled as the originals were lost... that was cheap, not.

12 no longer has Goodyears, any car that still has them should not be driven as they are so old, witnessed a few years ago why really old tyres on an F1 are not sensible

[Sami Aaltonen]

It would be very interesting to see what you find there.

Of course allways forget the time effect to the tyres. Couple years ago heard exactly same thing one of the Lamborghini owner, which had it's an orginal 80's tyres still on the car. Told them to be "a bit slipery, a bit..."

[Peloton25]

Originally Posted by M.S.O

Next time I have a spare few minutes I'll have a look at the tyre testing files and see what there is about the change in the 18s, it was only a few years ago we had the 18s completely re-tooled as the originals were lost... that was cheap, not.

Would be an interesting thing to know, but save it for a really boring moment maybe.

12 no longer has Goodyears

Good to know that - perhaps that means good things for its potential for future use.

I had noticed the Eagle F1s were still on the car in the recent set of detailer's photos and appeared again in the shots that were released by Kidston, including this one where it seemed a liberal amount of tire dressing had been applied to mask their age.



Clickable for close inspection in case anyone cares.

#021 in Singapore still has the Goodyear's fitted, but it has been pretty clear for a decade now that it is not being used.

>8^)
ER

[M.S.O]

it had been in the workshop for less than an hour in that picture (close call on the delivery timeframe!) having come pretty much straight from the detailers. It is now being properly looked after

[Peloton25]

Pleased to hear that. I consider that one a very special car.

#029 is another with the Goodyears still on, but again that's another car that's not going anywhere quick.

>8^)
ER

[HansGruber]

Thanks for the answers guys. I wonder if McLaren will be making the switch to Pilot Super Sports for the 18s in the near future.

I'll try and contact the author of the website of that high res picture I posted and see where she got it and if there are more. If she does share I'll post them. Believe it or not that photo came from a fashion blog.