whats the easiest car to go fast in under $30,000?

[CassiesMan]

Originally Posted by nissanfanatic

And as a car enthusiast, if you buy a car and leave it stock, you are not an enthusiast. You are a hobbyist. Performance cars are designed to be a platform for you to build on, therefore, any one car is designed to be run in whatever condition you build it to be run in.

So, say I buy an Enzo, and I leave it stock, I'm not an enthusiast? Or what if I take a classic muscle car, and want to return it to a state to exactly as it was when it left the factory (stock), then I'm not an enthusiast? This is like that argument that if you go for an SMG/DSG/Semi Auto gear box, you aren't a true car guy. Its bull shit. If thats the argument, then I say if your car doesn't have a choke and has any form of convience/comfort/non racing part on it at all, then you aren't a true enthusiast.

[vectorspecialist]

i like cars, i'm an enthusiast, a hobbyist is just someone who take's care of their car, does oil, washes it and waxes it.
a person who buys a car other than a sport car is more likley to b a person who just needs a car to get from a to b, not an enthusiast and not a hobbiest, just a normal everyday driver.
i bought a dodge neon for my first car, i was excited and washed it every wk, but left everything on it stock, does that mean i'm just a person who owns a car, no it just that i relize with only having 21k on it, i'm going to resell it, and by modding it, ur taking away from the possible buyers market, no 80yr old trying to go to church on sunday is going to want it, only the 18-25yr old that wants to come up to a stop lite and race that vette sitting next to him/her(that's right girls race just as much as guys, and get away with it too)
o and no i'm not going to change how i type so u can read it better, use phonics u'll figure it out, or have u forgotten the basics of reading

[drunken monkey]

learn to spell properly please; it makes you look less of an idiot.

besides, all of your definitions are wrong.
Freddie Hunt, son of James Hunt drives a Daewoo Matiz.
It's not a sports car by anyone's definition but he is more of a car+driving enthusiast than any of you.
The thing that defines what you are is your passion for cars and for driving and the related.

[nissanfanatic]

So he became such an enthusiast by only ever owning that car?

.....

Yea, because if you never switch to better tires to improve your driving abilities, or switch to a better flowing air filter, or adjust the car to support your driving style, then you probably aren't using the Enzo to pursue your interest in cars or driving. Same applies for the muscle car. You bought/built a show car. Being able to drive what you own and being able to improve on is part of being a car enthusiast. Pursuing improvement in driving/performance of the machine and yourself.

[drunken monkey]

as far as i know, freddie hunt who is only 19 has only ever owned the matiz.
he does race a lot though.
The point is, he hasn't done a single thing to that car but i'm pretty sure there aren't many people who can drive one like he does.
You mention modifiying a car to get the best out of it.
My point is, how about taking any car, be it a shopping car or a super car and getting the best out of it unmolested?

Extreme example time:
guy 1 who buys an integra type-r but can't drive for shit. Buys a shitload of mods that make it potentially super race car and because it has more power he wins most races by out powering them
guy 2 has a bog standard IT-R but races it regularly and knows it like the back of his hand.
Who is the enthusiast or whatever you want to label them?

[CassiesMan]

Originally Posted by nissanfanatic

So he became such an enthusiast by only ever owning that car?

.....

Yea, because if you never switch to better tires to improve your driving abilities, or switch to a better flowing air filter, or adjust the car to support your driving style, then you probably aren't using the Enzo to pursue your interest in cars or driving. Same applies for the muscle car. You bought/built a show car. Being able to drive what you own and being able to improve on is part of being a car enthusiast. Pursuing improvement in driving/performance of the machine and yourself.

99.9% of all vehicle improvment comes from the driver, not what ever turbo kit you decided to buy, or the tires you use. An enthusisast is someone who gets excited over cars, who has a passion for them in a form that is appealing to them. It doesn't make them a non enthusiast, it makes them an enthusiast in a different field. But hey, next time you run into Schumacher or one of those guys lucky enough to lay claim to an FXX, tell them they aren't really enthusiasts because they didn't modify it

Oh, and verctorspecialist...hooked on fonix wurked fore mi!
Type like a normal human being, you look like a fucking retard.

[nissanfanatic]

Yea.. If you drive a car at the limit, parts break. You are left no option but to upgrade them if you don't want them to break again.

I guess if you intend on keeping a car stock the entire time you own it and bragging about how quick you can make it go, then you are more of a driving enthusiast than a car enthusiast. Either way, you are going to lose to people that have shittier driving abilities than you, and I don't know many people that care to do that. At the end of the day, you are comparing your abilities in your car to somebody else's vehicular package, run what you brung. What you drive and how you drive both make you the car enthusiast you are.

[drunken monkey]

ok... I guess it is pretty fair to say that I am a driving enthusiast as much of my driving when it's quiet at night is about how many secondss I can shave off a drive home or how fast i can take a particular corner on my journey.

On the other hand I love cars as complete/finished objects.
To me, there is something amazing about how a lotus elise is put together just as there is something strangely fun about how a Yaris seems to be lean so much onto it's springs and not topple over just as there is something amazing how you can just keep going higher and higher in an S2000 just as there is something that makes me smile in how you feel a TVR cerbera is nearby before you see it.
In my mind, there is something almost sacraligious in changing something in certain cars.
On the other hand, I can also see that there is something about knowing your car so well that you know exactly what needs to be done to make it better.

If I had the money, time and skill, I'd have two of every car I like:
one for keeping absolutely stock and the the other for making as good as I can (without turning it into something else entirely)

[nissanfanatic]

I'll agree to that.

But I would put money that after you owned any car long enough, you can think of at least one thing that you will, or be forced to change from stock.

Cars are just tools for transportation. You should make the tool work for you and change/adjust it as necessary for the job.

[vectorspecialist]

o didnt know u guys were english teachers, i thought this was the internet, somewhere i can type however the hell i want to without being told how to.
as for enthusiast, i'm a driving one, i enjoy the feel of the car and sound of the engine and the gear changes as i go around turns on the back roads, or cruise at 80mph on the highway.
for me a car is wat it is, a supercar(enzo or wat have u) is more for people that like the car and the idea of everyone turning their heads and looking, the small dicked people of this world

[Gotian]

My RX-8 is completely stock, but i dont think of myself as just a normal person with the car, I've been in love with the car since it came out and I've spent alot of time researching the car to know as much as possible about it. Took me a few years but I finally bought it last year and now I'm autocrossing it, so I would consider myself an enthusiast about cars/ driving.

[drunken monkey]

Originally Posted by vectorspecialist

o didnt know u guys were english teachers, i thought this was the internet, somewhere i can type however the hell i want to without being told how to.

This is a public forum owned by an individual.
As such, there are rules which are in turn enforced by certain members of the forum. I would've thought that you, someone who hs been warned 3 times previously regarding your posting methods, would've understood this by know.

[CivRacer95]

Originally Posted by drunken monkey

This is a public forum owned by an individual.
As such, there are rules which are in turn enforced by certain members of the forum. I would've thought that you, someone who hs been warned 3 times previously regarding your posting methods, would've understood this by know.

Taken from the AF Guidelines:

POSTING EDIQUETTE:
AutomotiveForums.com is a professional community where members expect to read posts with correct grammar and practical sentence structure. Any posts in all caps, and or funny mixed case such as "hey can u c thiz? L8r!" will not be tolerated. The same goes for language. AF is an English language based site. All discussions should be conducted in English. If you cannot post clearly, coherently, and in English, you will be given notice to do so. If you ignore this notice and continue to post incoherently, your posting rights will be removed.

Sorry vector. It's not like some of the fellow Moderators are trying to harrass you or keep you from being yourself, but these are the rules provided by the owner of this very site. Like most members, I'm sure you may have skimmed or even skipped these guidelines, but please, for your stay here at AF just take a moment to read over them.

We're only here to enforce the rules. Not to be dicks to the guys that don't pay attention to them. With that said, carry on. And please, just clean up your posts and make them more readable for our "less intelligent" members .

[-Josh-]

Can you find a used Lotus Elise for under 30k?

[AMGalltheway]

Originally Posted by CivRacer95

... make them more readable for our "less intelligent" members .

was that personal?
And i like Josh's idea! A Lotus would be great around corners and you might find a used one for 30 if your lucky.Throw a turbo or super charger on there and, BOOM! you got plenty of power!