support the Marine acused of murder

[Heep]

Funny how just about every debating thread starts with un-informed, blanket statements, then progresses to a few people making very valid, informed arguements in both directions, then ends with everybody agreeing to disagree

[mellowboy]

I hope that marine gets sentenced to life. Theres absolutley no excuse of what he did. If they found him not guilty...US is digging a deeper hole ...deep enough that they can never climb out of. Iraqis will seek justice, one way or another. Fuck him and i'm not signing shit for that fuck up.

[Heep]

Originally Posted by mellowboy

US is digging a deeper hole ...deep enough that they can never climb out of. Iraqis will seek justice, one way or another.

I have to agree with you there - I'm afraid the U.S. will go too far and the rest of the world will have to say "enough!" As it is right now they don't seem much different than Nazi Germany, which is a very sad thing indeed

[codycool]

Originally Posted by Heep

Funny how just about every debating thread starts with un-informed, blanket statements, then progresses to a few people making very valid, informed arguements in both directions, then ends with everybody agreeing to disagree

No it just shows how people can see the ignorance in other people's arguments. Like mellow boy calling the marine a fuck-up. Obviously neither heep nor mellow boy have been faced with a split second combat experience. We can all sit back and play arm chair generals, but nobody knows what they would have done in that situation.

And as for your bad experiences in the USA im calling BS. I live in Texas and I have never seen hatred like that towards Canada. Its funny how you bring up the situation as you are loosing your argument to
syr74! Nobody says you have to like America, just dont come back!

[2strokebloke]

I'd venture a billion in China and a billion in India are totally unconcerned

And for good reason, who'd care about a poor little country with no WMDs when you live in a giant country thousands of miles away? The only country that got a wild hair up it's ass about Iraq was the United States.

[Heep]

Originally Posted by codycool

No it just shows how people can see the ignorance in other people's arguments. Like mellow boy calling the marine a fuck-up. Obviously neither heep nor mellow boy have been faced with a split second combat experience. We can all sit back and play arm chair generals, but nobody knows what they would have done in that situation.

And as for your bad experiences in the USA im calling BS. I live in Texas and I have never seen hatred like that towards Canada. Its funny how you bring up the situation as you are loosing your argument to
syr74! Nobody says you have to like America, just dont come back!

I'm not being ignorant to your arguments, I'm just not agreeing with them. Neither of us can ever prove we are right, just some people are more open to other possibilities, while some are convinced they can never be wrong.

As for my bad experiences in the USA, call BS if you want, it doesn't change what's happened. I've never been to Texas so I have no idea what people are like there. I shouldn't be biased against the whole of the U.S. as nearly every state feels differently. I do, in fact, like the people in Florida, Alabama, and Maine, but some other states, notably New York, Mass., and Georgia are extremely rude, obnoxious, and ignorant towards Canadians, in my experience. I did not bring up that situation as a "last gasp effort" in my argument with syr74, I brought it up to explain why I have an anti-American bias, as he accused me of.

And no, nobody does say I have to like America. If it were up to me, I wouldn't come back, and I refrain from entering as much as possible. But with a sister that lives there, and a father who must often attend meetings and expos there, I often have very little choice. When there, I don't even make any reference to my nationality for fear of being hated. Interestingly enough, the people that have mocked me have been extremely pleasant until asking where I'm from, and then at that point completely changed their attitude towards me.

BTW, you continue to rant about how I cannot judge how that marine feels, since I have not been there. That is true. However, right after that you try to judge how I feel about America, even though you have not been in my shoes!

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by codycool

We can all sit back and play arm chair generals, but nobody knows what they would have done in that situation.

The point here is that we want to figure out wtheter or not the killing was pre-meditated or if he was actually doing his job. One being of "good cause" and wanting to help the world, why not ease the tension of other countries by putting this man on trial? If he truely isn't guilty, then he has nothing to fear right?
I guess they were also doing the wrong thing by taking the few found guilty of the Abu-Gharib prison incident to court after the pictures were released. I mean it's not like they found other instances where the same type of behaviour was found years afterwards

And as for your bad experiences in the USA im calling BS. I live in Texas and I have never seen hatred like that towards Canada. Its funny how you bring up the situation as you are loosing your argument to
syr74! Nobody says you have to like America, just dont come back!

Just cuz you don't see something doesn't mean it's not there. I've been to the States many times, visited New York last summer. I thought the people in Queens were very pleasant people, but there were the ignorant ones too....is that BS as well?

[lazysmurff]

while i hate to put this man on trial to appease other nations, the fact remains that appears to be lots of controvery about the topic.

what better way to settle it than with a trial?

[codycool]

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

The point here is that we want to figure out wtheter or not the killing was pre-meditated or if he was actually doing his job. One being of "good cause" and wanting to help the world, why not ease the tension of other countries by putting this man on trial? If he truely isn't guilty, then he has nothing to fear right?
I guess they were also doing the wrong thing by taking the few found guilty of the Abu-Gharib prison incident to court after the pictures were released. I mean it's not like they found other instances where the same type of behaviour was found years afterwards


Just cuz you don't see something doesn't mean it's not there. I've been to the States many times, visited New York last summer. I thought the people in Queens were very pleasant people, but there were the ignorant ones too....is that BS as well?

The abu graib* incident is an entirely different accusation. Reservist who have to take care of prisoners and have a little fun with them is totally wrong. On the other hand a marine in a combat environment that has to make life and death decisions. Its apples and oranges. The abu graib* people should and will be punished.

Anywhere you go you will find ignorant people. New York in general is filled with rude people. Come and visit Texas, im sure your opinion on Americans will change, or maybe not.

[codycool]

Originally Posted by mellowboy

Fuck you. Dont make excuses.

Now if I would have said this I would have been banned, but since you go along with Taranaki's believes you will not! And good rebuttal by the way!

[Heep]

Originally Posted by codycool

And good rebuttal by the way!

Lol I have to agree with you there - while I support his side of the debate, that was indeed a pretty useless rebuttal

[Flatrater]

Originally Posted by mellowboy

Fuck you. Dont make excuses.

Another post like that and you will get a vacation from AF.

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by codycool

The abu graib* incident is an entirely different accusation. Reservist who have to take care of prisoners and have a little fun with them is totally wrong. On the other hand a marine in a combat environment that has to make life and death decisions. Its apples and oranges. The abu graib* people should and will be punished.

LOL, actually we're both wrong about that...it's Abu Ghraib.
Anyways, I have to say this again...we don;t know for sure if this was a "life and death" thought or it was a "kill them all" type idea. That is why we need to run an investigation and see what's going on. No I'm also not saying that everytime a soldier kills someone that they have to be trialed in order to get the reasoning behind it, but this was captured on camera...so far what's on video goes against the soldier.

Anywhere you go you will find ignorant people. New York in general is filled with rude people. Come and visit Texas, im sure your opinion on Americans will change, or maybe not.

Yes!, That's the point I was trying to get across. And again, the majority of the people I met were all nice (this being in november 2002 and me being an afghan). The customs officer knew that, he was still nice...the people in the city didn't know that, they were still either nice or idiotic. Id love to visit Texas but I guarantee you that it will not change my opinion on Americans, not that I hate them though. I just think that the majority of people (people in the world) are mis-informed on a lot of issues, and I don't know who to blame when it comes to those people relying on the news as a trusted source: the news or the people?

[TexasF355F1]

Originally Posted by codycool

And as for your bad experiences in the USA im calling BS. I live in Texas and I have never seen hatred like that towards Canada. Its funny how you bring up the situation as you are loosing your argument to syr74! Nobody says you have to like America, just dont come back!

Until you said that I never thought about it. I have never seen or heard any blatant hatred against canada or really any other country. At least not openly. I'm not gonna hate any country or its citizens just the government. The only country outside of the U.S. ive visited(besides Mexico) is England. I loved every single minute of it. Definately want to go back to europe again someday. As well as a few others scattered around the globe.

Heep if you ever make your way to Texas I think you'll be pleasently surprised at the hospitality. I think that is the one thing Texans are known for. Well that and the bar-b-que. Never experienced any rudeness in other states ive been to.

[Heep]

Yeah they're great to me in Alabama, haha

I suppose I should clarify, my anti-American bias is only in part against citizens. Primarily, it is again the way the country is run, and the mindset that most Americans seem to have when it comes to their country and other countries. I'm also open to liking American citizens, but the vocal radicals have unfortunately put me in a position where individuals start off in my dislike like and must earn a place into my like list, as opposed to the opposite for other places I've been.

Edit: Haha, that just reminded me of a lady I met in Alabama who said "Yeah, we're real nice people down here, and so are you Canadians, it's just all those damn Yankees in between!"