Moderating Issues

[-GS-]

See now what i dont understand is, why the moderators are being blamed etc for whats happened. Ricochet was in the wrong and he was dealt with, it doesnt matter if he was AF's Celebrity, he did something wrong so hes paying for it. I dont even know whats happened with him or anything, but either way i dont care.

It seems as if anything that happens on the forums is allways blamed on the moderators. Sure theres some moderators that are truly to blame (no people in mind, just generally stating,) but most moderators just do what they think will benefit the community.

Now what the moderators need to understand is, is that the general public doesnt see the work you put into AF. We dont see all the deleted threads and all the work you guys do, so when one member is banned, especially a "celebrity" like Ricochet, thats the only thing the public sees. So generally speaking the public thinks that all moderators do is show power etc, but thats not true. Im a moderator at 2/3 highly successfull photoshop sites, so i know what its like to be a moderator. But seriously everyone appreciates you guys, and i'd honestly like to say Thank You for keeping AF in the shape that it is.

[G35XAndTrailBlazer]

lol i sorry for postwhoring Mr......... civicspoon.

ANYWAYS

i agree with GS. Everyone respects you guys,just somtimes they all want some proof.

[mentel]

Originally Posted by G35XAndTrailBlazer

lol i sorry for postwhoring Mr......... civicspoon.

ANYWAYS

i agree with GS. Everyone respects you guys,just somtimes they all want some proof.

Not to be crude or anything, but I thought you weren't going to post anymore after your first post after a year of lurking?

[RallyRaider]

Mentel, I understood that to be Emerge’s promise. I sincerely hope he keeps it.

[CivicSpoon]

I'm highly disappointed with the way this thread has turned. Enough of the comments back and forth. Some people here need to learn when to bite their tongue and just ignore comments. As well as others need to realize that this is supposed to be an intelligent conversation to try to work out some issues that have come up. Let the bickering stop.

The things that have been shown most in this thread in the last 2 pages is exactly what this whole topic was about. I apologise for using names, but apparently this is how it has to be to make my point.

RallyRaider and mentel - I feel your last comments were not needed in this discusssion. That issue should have just been let go. It will only push an argument to escalate further.

G35XAndTrailBlazer, whtcivic03, Emerge - With the way you chose to go about writing you comments with the tone you've used, and/or posting nothing of use to this conversation in the way that you have. I can see exactly how moderators are some times pushed to the edge and react in the manner that they do.

I'm not the best at explaining problems I see, so if anyone has an issues to talk about then clearly you can try as hard as I had. Please lets turn this thread back around into a respectful and understanding discussion.

[RallyRaider]

Originally Posted by CivicSpoon

RallyRaider and mentel - I feel your last comments were not needed in this discusssion. That issue should have just been let go. It will only push an argument to escalate further.

Alternately it will prevent escalation as it will force emerge to keep to the promise in his petulant outburst. But as you wish, I will drop it starting now.

[G35XAndTrailBlazer]

Originally Posted by mentel

Not to be crude or anything, but I thought you weren't going to post anymore after your first post after a year of lurking?

Umm, thats Emerge i think that yur talking about... i joined 3 weeks ago....

Civicspoon. I'm sorry. just trying to make conversation with people and give some thoughts.
I'm not trying to start anything. I might just stop posting in here since most of my posts are never even replied to and are ignored.... so carry on.

[youngvr4]

Originally Posted by crayzayjay

As Igor put it, RESPECT IS THE KEY. A knowledgeable, respectful member is more appreciated than a knowledgeable member with unpleasant habits.

my two cents has already been stated.


i dont know who the starter of this thread is, but i respect you

[CivicSpoon]

Thank you I respect you too

[Moppie]

Time I guess for me to throw my $2 in.
2c simply isn't enough.


All forums go through thier good times and thier bad times, like all social organisations they are continualy evolving and changing as members come and go, and thats exactly what has been happening to AF, and more speficly the Honda sub-forums.

Now please note the use of the term sub-forums.
AF was started with a vision to bring all automotive enthusiasts together in one place where they could all share thier love, passion and knowledge of cars.
Igor looked around the internet, saw a whole lot of very segregated model spefic forums, but no where were everyone could come together in one place.
And so he created automotiveforums.com

It started life with a small number of global moderators who passed through all the forums dealing with any problems they saw.
Then AF started to grow, and in the last 3 years it has gorwn beyond all expectiation and is now one of the top 100 forums in existance, and one of the longest running ever.

It has embraced many other smaller forums, and as some manufactors have proven more popular for disscussion than others it has grown extensive subforums.
As its gorwn and changed so has its moderating staff.
I used to spend lots and lots of time in the Honda forums, answering questions, helping the new guys, removing the bigots. Being a moderator.
Then my circumstances changed and I have spent less and less time in there, as have several other moderators who used to have a much greater interest in Honda.

Its pretty clear that the Honda forums as a whole suffered quite badly from under-moderation for a long period of time, at least 18 months.
In that time the knowledge base was reduced, as was the age and maturity level of the average poster.

With the exceptions of a few well moderated honda subforums the Honda forums have been going through thier own little dark ages.

Forunatly every bad time is followed by a good time.
Through the kids asking stupid questions, the flame wars and the spam several members remained strong, and worked hard to share thier knowledge and help those who needed it.
A small number of these members have over the last 6months or so been made into new moderators of the Honda section.

They are as knowledgable, as passionate, and most importantly as willing to help as I was several years ago, and they are right now working together to begin the long hard job of improving the Honda forums, returning them to thier former glory, and bringing them into line with the rest of AF.

It will take time, and it will take a lot of work, and they will need all the help than get.
Members who get all self-rightous and flame members who don't know any better do not help the situation, and niether do members who deciede that through thier own ignorance they know better than the moderators.

If you really feel pasionate about the Honda forums, and you really want to see change then don't bitch and whine about it.

Help out.

If you have lots of technical knowledge, i.e. your a mechanic, or have done a difficult swap on your own then PM a mod and offer to right a How To, or add something to a F.A.Q.
Don't be afraid to start a thread telling others of the things you have done to your car and sharing your knowledge, if its really good ask a mod to make it a sticky.

And don't flame the new younger members who are ignorant and don't know any better.
Instead politly let them know where they are wrong, and direct them to what they need to know.
Point them towards other stickied threads, the search feature etc etc.

[mentel]

Originally Posted by RallyRaider

Mentel, I understood that to be Emerge’s promise. I sincerely hope he keeps it.

Yeah I accidentaly got them mixed up

[crayzayjay]

Originally Posted by -GS-

Im a moderator at 2/3 highly successfull photoshop sites, so i know what its like to be a moderator. But seriously everyone appreciates you guys, and i'd honestly like to say Thank You for keeping AF in the shape that it is.

Thanks for recognising the effort we put it in


Moppie, that was extremely well said

A community that has a system in place to deal with repetitive issues or questions from new members and that does it in a respectable manner is what AF was always intended to be.

[aves911]

Just for everyone's peace of mind, I'll offer up the administrator point of view.

I think the key complaint in this thread is that several members feel that a fellow member, in this case Ricochet, was banned for activity that members have found moderators performing. And these members would be correct. Both members and moderators are guilty of flamming, curtness, and an ocassional bending of the AF Guidelines.

The difference, and THE REASON why some members get banned and moderators do not, lies in how the respective parties deal with the consequences of their actions.

A member is not immediately banned for flamming, or for being rude or insulting. There is a process. The member is warned first and if the activity continues they are usually warned again, and in Ricochets case multiple warnings. A ban is only instituted after a series of warnings and all of us have discussed the matter for a number of days. Members do not get banned because the bend the rules once in a while, they get banned because when they do bend or break the rules and we ask them not to do it again, they do not listen.

This is why you can find many examples of threads where members have broken rules but have not been banned. Those members heeded the moderators advice and were curteous enough to follow the guidelines in the future.

Moderators are the same way, I have yet to meet a moderator who refused to stop an innappropriate behavior when I asked them too. And when I do, they will first be demodded and then subsequently banned if the behavior continues. Its as simple as that.

So I hope that all of you in the Honda forums that are feeling like the victims of moderator hypocrisy can see that reason Ricochet was banned and not countless other members or a handful of moderators who have done similar things is because these members and moderators realize their mistakes and work to correct them. Unfortunately, members like Ricochet, while in this case respected for his knowledge and well liked by some, do not correct their behavior. And AF cannot support members who refuse to follow our guidelines. Its simple.

While this post is lengthy, its important for me to try and convey why two members can commit similar violations and one will eventually get banned and another wont. We aren't nazi's, we understand that everyone is human and that all people get mad or worked up, or just make an honest mistake or two and thats okay. As long as that member heeds the moderators warnings and shows an interest in being a well mannered participating member in our community. On the other hand, members who don't listen and continue to break the rules must be dealt with, as unpleasant as it can be at times.

Hopefully, this helps clarify some of the confusion and will allievate the sense of wrong doing that some of you have.

-Jacob

[Hiroboy]

I have a small question : Why do we have this smiley if we don't what peolpe to use the term in a none homophbic manner ?

[RallyRaider]

Maybe the same reason we have the letters "f", "u", "c", and "k" on the keyboard, but you don't use them in that order writing an email to your grandmother.