Evo VIII or STi?

[90gs]

sti

[Steiner]

I'm test driving an '05 RS tomorrow. I'll have to see how it goes. I didn't wanna get out of the car after my STi test drive. I thought about backing over the sales guy and heading for the hills. We'll see if I can hold myself back with this car.

[Steiner]

Well I truly appreciate all the input you guys have given me. Especially carrrnuttt and neutrino because you gave me more than just your opinions.

I test drove the RS and I've pretty much decided that's the direction I wanna go...incognito, AWD, amazing handling, great modding platform. I've had an offer for one at about $30k OTD. That's $500 over invoice. I'll probably make the deal right after Christmas when things aren't so nuts.

Carrrnuttt...In the end the side impact airbags were the only reason I could justify spending more money for the STi. However the dealer I'm buying the Evo from apparently subcontracts a local shop to retrofit the recarros w/side airbags. Of course it costs some money but the car will still be close to $4k cheaper than a base model STi even after I get that work done. He's going to give some more specifics when we meet. He also mentioned that all '05 Evo models now have aluminum side-guard door beams.

I can honestly tell anybody else out there contemplating the "STi vs. Evo" decision that the only way to decide is to drive both cars. In my opinion the Evo is more of a driver's car. It does EXACTLY what you tell it to, whereas the STi has some play in the driver/vehicle interface.

If creature comforts like climate control and cruise control are important to you than the Evo is not for you...much less the RS which has no power windows, power locks, or stereo.

If all those things don't mean that much to you, like me, then the Evo RS might be for you. It's the best performing Evo on the market...yes...it outperforms both the MR and GSR. It also can be had for about the same price as a well equipped Subaru WRX...a car it effortlessly man-handles in every performance category except sticker price.

Hopefully I'll have some pics up early next month. Now I just gotta sell my SRT-4.

[drftk1d]

msrp for the evo rs is 26800, around me i could pick up a new 04 sti for like 29k

[Steiner]

Originally Posted by drftk1d

msrp for the evo rs is 26800, around me i could pick up a new 04 sti for like 29k

The '05 STi has many improvements over the '04. The biggest one...especially for Californians...is a reflashed ECU that won't cause the car to ping on our craptastic 91 octane.

If you wanna compare '04 STI to '04 Evo RS then we're still talking about a 5k difference in MSRP too.

[Neutrino]

Steiner i'm glad you are getting closed to owning a new car. Sounds like you enjoyed both the STI and the EVO but you were won over by the EVOS quick reflexes. Just remember to be careful when you drive that 13:0 ratio rack will respond very fast.


BTW also be careful with that company installing side airbags. I wasn't even aware that could be done in the aftermarket. Airbags are very serious tools (remember they rather explode than inflate), so make sure those guys know what they are doing.


PS. Sice you tried the EVO and STI back to back could you give us some more detailed impressions of their compared performance. Like power delivery, braking, steering overall feel etc...

[Steiner]

Originally Posted by Neutrino

PS. Since you tried the EVO and STI back to back could you give us some more detailed impressions of their compared performance. Like power delivery, braking, steering overall feel etc...

I started to type out a big review of the 2 cars this afternoon but decided against it. I just don't have enough time behind the wheel of either car to be credible. Both cars can easily outhandle their drivers and that's the first thing anybody needs to know when deciding between the two. The second thing they need to know is that a test drive is only as good as you make it. Hopefully a friend, coworker or relative will allow you to drive their STi or Evo the way it was meant to because most dealerships won't even allow you take an '05 STi or '05 Evo off the lot. I had to be creative.

I got lucky because the STi I test drove was used and the salesguy encouraged me push it. He was a younger guy. The poor bastard actually thought I was interested in buying an '04 for $32k that smelled like a fricken ash tray. Yeah right. Thanks for the test drive though dude.

On the other hand the Evo I drove was a used '03 because apparently Mitsu doesn't allow any test drives on their new Evos. I found a local Honda dealership selling a used '03 they took as a trade and then drove up in the SRT-4 with my wife so they knew 1.) I was serious about fast cars and 2.) I wasn't just a kid looking for an afternoon joyride. Both the salesguy and my wife were in the car so I couldn't exactly push the car the way I'd hoped to. Just the same the Evo felt TIGHTER. There was absolutely zero play in the steering or shifting. Everything was very polished, very tight, and consequently very solid feeling. On top of that it was raining a little bit...which IMHO is the perfect time to test drive an AWD car. The roads might as well have been bone dry because it didn't make a damn difference. That car seriously owns the road like a Humvee w/a .50 cruising the streets of Fallujah. Other cars on the road might as well have been cones because I was easily and SAFELY going around them. I think "effortlessly" is the word I'm looking for.

That's really as much as I car to critique the 2 cars because I'm really not in any position to say one is better than the other. Except for the steering ratio and better feel of the shifter in the Evo IMHO they might as well have been the same car. Here's 2 great threads I started on the STi and Evo forums. Both threads ask the same question: name 5 things you DON'T like about your STi or Evo. I recommend everybody do the same thing before buying a car.

5 things you don't like about your Evo...

5 things you don't like about your STi...

BTW...tonight I was outhandled by an SVT Focus on a twisty mountain road I drive every day to work and back. I'd catch up on the straight-aways, but I could hang with that thing in the turns. Sure wish PVO would have met the SRT-4 a better handling car from the factory. It's definately the car's achilles heel IMHO and it's not exactly cheap to fix. Just one more reason to buy the Evo.

[Neutrino]

Cool thanks for the info, i'll check up on those links.

Originally Posted by Steiner

BTW...tonight I was outhandled by an SVT Focus on a twisty mountain road I drive every day to work and back. I'd catch up on the straight-aways, but I could hang with that thing in the turns. Sure wish PVO would have met the SRT-4 a better handling car from the factory. It's definately the car's achilles heel IMHO and it's not exactly cheap to fix. Just one more reason to buy the Evo.

And SVT focus is a very good handling FWD car, one of the best. Better than the srt4 stock. That being said, don't take this as an insult since its not but IMO you went the wrong way with that einbach pro kit. True their quelity is very high but they very likelly don't match the rebound and compression curves of your stock suspension and you also modified the ration between the roll center and gravity center of the car without tuning the chassis to compensate. So its very likelly that you made it handle worse. Even it it does probably feel more planted due to less body roll it still probably handles worse.

Road Race Engineering actually warnes about that, just because it feels like it handles better it does not mean it does.

The proper way to go would've been to get the stage 3 coilovers and have them tune by a chassis expert. Or acr struts like the one lap car.


So be careful if you ever plan to upgrade the suspension on the evo, don't just slap on some coilovers or even worse some drop springs. Even it those coilovers are top quality ohlins they will be only as good as their tuning.

[Steiner]

Originally Posted by Neutrino

Cool thanks for the info, i'll check up on those links.




And SVT focus is a very good handling FWD car, one of the best. Better than the srt4 stock. That being said, don't take this as an insult since its not but IMO you went the wrong way with that einbach pro kit. True their quelity is very high but they very likelly don't match the rebound and compression curves of your stock suspension and you also modified the ration between the roll center and gravity center of the car without tuning the chassis to compensate. So its very likelly that you made it handle worse. Even it it does probably feel more planted due to less body roll it still probably handles worse.

Road Race Engineering actually warnes about that, just because it feels like it handles better it does not mean it does.

The proper way to go would've been to get the stage 3 coilovers and have them tune by a chassis expert. Or acr struts like the one lap car.


So be careful if you ever plan to upgrade the suspension on the evo, don't just slap on some coilovers or even worse some drop springs. Even it those coilovers are top quality ohlins they will be only as good as their tuning.

You're right about the Eibachs. I lowered my car less than 3 weeks after I bought it. At the time Mopar hadn't released their S2 and S3 coilovers yet. I shoulda waited a few months and done it right. I hated that raked look from the factory though. It really bugged me. The Evo has an outstanding stance from the factory though.

[Neutrino]

Originally Posted by Steiner

You're right about the Eibachs. I lowered my car less than 3 weeks after I bought it. At the time Mopar hadn't released their S2 and S3 coilovers yet. I shoulda waited a few months and done it right. I hated that raked look from the factory though. It really bugged me. The Evo has an outstanding stance from the factory though.

I see, and its true the srt4 is far from being setup perfectly for handling from the factory.


The EVO on the other hand has an amazing setup, which is probably better left alone unless you plan to do some serious upgrades for track use. Otherwise probably the only suspension mod you should do would be the adjustable rear sway from Road Race.

[mason_RsX]

A detuned rally car is expected to still have awesome handling, if it didn't handle well that would be outrageous...the srt 4 which is more of a modified economy car (I know the evos a lancer, but it shares more with the rally car) wouldn't have the same suspension and would require upgrades