Supra Turbo vs. Corvette Z06

[Chris]

I read everything again, and JD is right. You have to be careful about efficiency, though. Usually, the factory should have it very good (with comprimeses, of course). For instance, there is a device called a Tornado, which is supposed to make the air flow better, but it doesn't work. It may work in a modded engine, but not always. So you have to be VERY careful.
The best solution: Cram in as much air and gas, get it out quickly, and use it wisely, just like a funny car (top fuelers, not really, they aren't to meticulus)
And BANG, power!!!! (The room erupts in cheers )

[JD@af]

I too was thinking about my argument after I posted it, and I realized that Chris, you are right as well. Establishing engines as not just being air pumps is not contradictory to what you are saying, just sort of parallel. Both need to be done together. And, while I personally feel that the quest for more efficiency coupled with more power is more a question of tweaking and improving upon combustion technique at this point, say we perfect that someday (because there is a 100% theoretical ceiling to this), than the remaining factor to turn to will be increasing aspiration rates, once again.

(Now picture that scene at the end of the Naked Gun when all the baseball players are beating each other up, and when they see Leslie Nielson and Priscilla Presley on-screen they stop, and all start crying and hugging each other... well that's us right now)

[Chris]

tear (of mushyness)

[flylwsi]

you guys make me sick...

[Chris]

Group hug? Of course, with flylwsi at the center

[JD@af]

Right on.

[danmangt40]

I am wasting so much time on here these days... ok, so I didn't go back far enough to read about anything pertaining to supra turbo vs corvette z06, so I'll start it up again. I'm a Z06 fan, but its not the vette I'd get. Ligenfelter just came out with a 427 package for the vette, and if you put on the z06 cylinder heads, its worth 50 more hp, the kit is good for either 500 hp or 550 hp (with z06 heads), I can't remember, its in this month's C&D. So, thats an instance of both better internal and exernal flow and air/fuel mods. Z06 heads allow for greater "breathing" but the bore and stroke job on the block itself is about as internal as it gets, short of completely remodeling an engine for direct injection... Now, for the Supra. I'm also a Supra Turbo fan, but for fewer reasons. The Vette is the best Vette yet, I'm not sure that the Supra does justice to "supra" its an entirely new animal relative to its crappy heritage of nice celicas. Even though its dead, and its "successor" won't be called the supra, most likely, the Supra is basically as good as Japanese cars available in the US have gotten, unless you are counting the NSX, which we won't b/c an all-aluminum mid-engined structure that can't in any way be traced back to a sedan platform isn't normal japanese stuff. (3000gt from galant, eclipse from galant, 4 degrees of camry: camry-->lexus es300-->lexus sc400-->supra... hell, anything Toyota can in some way be traced to the camry....). I have heard nutty stories of people getting insane hp levels out of supras, I think HKS has a mass-produced supra program that offers up to 650... anything up from there is someone's backyard creation. Its at the top of the tuner craze, but its roots are humble (it starts out with 320 hp, whereas eclipses and civics and crx are no higher than around 200 to begin with), so I don't know how to judge the lat supra turbo. However, if you want to use the z06 as a vantage point, then the supra is a bit mainstream (this is in comparison to a vette. obviously, a supra is not an accord), and a standard model that pulled out all the stops and didn't have a backseat would be a better competitor. The Z06 is the factory hot rod version of the vette. The Supra Turbo was a doctor's car, with a backseat when picking up the kids from his x-wife's, and plenty of grunt for the fun stuff. My Dad drives a Jag, even though I begged him to get a viper. it was the right decision for him, because in this argument, he's closer to the supra guy. A Viper driver, if he'd had less cash, would have been more likely to get the vette, right?

[JD@af]

Bravo. Another interesting and inspired post. I too read about the Lingenfelter 427 (428?) Vette. I just can't help my overwhelming fascination with that ever-so-versatile MKIV Supra TT. And I am amazed by the power their engines can put out with stock internals (I've heard they're good for 700 hp with stock bottom ends!). However, I know that Supras can't hold a candle (so I've found) to Z06's on a race track. The Z06 bites at the heels of the Ferrari 360 Modena, in terms of handling, balance, stability, and good manners under a variety of conditions.

Besides that, I think with cars of this nature, it becomes a question of which technology captures your imagination better. Either one is faster than sin. I don't think that many (any?) decisive arguments can be made to declare one the superior car over the other.

I will agree that I think part of my fascination with Toyotas, Hondas, and other go-fast imports is their "underdog" economy-car heritage (the NSX of course being a few and far between exception to this rule).

[flylwsi]

i am scared by all this kindness i am getting here...

back to the point at hand then...
if we r talkin bout both cars and mods...

the zo6 STOCK has way better handling, and it can only be increased when you add some more power...
the supra disadvantage is the suspension then, not the motor, as the zo6 is practically a racer susp... whereas the supra needs mods that cost money... that money could go into zo6 motor upgrades for more power...
so the supra needs money to make it handle like the zo6, and money to get the power up there... all this on top of a not cheap price already... if you really like the car, go for it...

if you like a racer out the box, zo6 is it... susp worthy of cars twice and thrice its price, and hella power.... and relatively cheap mods...

but, on the other side, if you gots the dough to buy either one and mod it for hella power, it doesnt matter, and as previously stated, it comes down to the tech you wanna go with, and where you wanna start...
if you buy a supra and make it outhandle a zo6, im impressed... not as much with the zo6... know what i mean?
its like makin my lude outhandle the zo6...
that would raise eyebrows, just like the supra

oh, and on the internals, i am sure the vette internals can handle a shietload of hp stock also... im sure that the 750 # is easily attainable on stock innards...

[Chris]

Apparently, a stock Supra can generate awesome numbers, but isn't a good track guy. If you have enough money for either car, but want something a bit more and have, say, 10 grand for mods, the Z06 will always emerge the victor. If you have tons of money, then go for what you want.
Again, I'll take the Z06, what a car (and far better than Cobra R, heah,new thread!):silly2:

[igor@af]

yep, if you're gonna compare them stock then Z06 wins hands down, but if you're gonna modify both of them, the things might turn around, considering I just saw a video of an 870hp++ Supra being dynoed last night again....

[Chris]

And I just saw a dragster with 1300 hp in a chevy 350 on tv. I also saw a lingenfelter with a 427 vette motor with 550 hp. Put on his twin turbo package and theres 900+hp. HA

[VTEC V6]

Originally posted by Chris
And I just saw a dragster with 1300 hp in a chevy 350 on tv. I also saw a lingenfelter with a 427 vette motor with 550 hp. Put on his twin turbo package and theres 900+hp. HA

and are they also street legal?

[vettemaan]

cmon people ive seen ls1 blocks with over 3000 hp

[VTEC V6]

Originally posted by vettemaan
cmon people ive seen ls1 blocks with over 3000 hp

man, u guys talk like these super horsepower engines are an everyday thing!

an LS1 block with 3000hp is a race engine, not street

u see drag cars and such with super high hp engines all the time but theyre not street legal, ppl dont drive them on the street

this supra is street legal!! thats seems like quite a bit of horsepower to put down on the street if u ask me