Aoshima,Fujimi,Hasegawa

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Originally Posted by bvia

Tamiya has made far more mistakes than the simple Mustang (something the NA companies should have and did get right)...but remember that these are simply 1 modeler's opinions and should be taken as such.

As for passion to an industry and it's participants...don't confuse industriousness with passion. 300-400 part count is worthless if the parts don't fit and the engineering is unsound.

You can certainly call it "passion"...but I'll beg to differ and do so with my wallet.

Bill

And where does "industriousness" arise, if not from passion?



So we should only consider passion as a measure of a company's proclivity to nail the details? Then why does Tamiya get a pass for their mistakes while Revell's on the pillory for theirs? Is it because Revell lags behind in processing and ergonomics? Because they're closing the gap with each successive new release at a fraction of the typical Tamiya price point.

Though I'm trying to include all that "passion" should imply here, I have, as a matter of fact, used the word "passion" within the confines of your exact context - in print, describing a Tamiya kit, interestingly enough.

Unsound engineering and parts that don't fit? I have built and reported on every new domestic automotive glue kit release for the last eight years; and all the imports I can find, for the last three. I have found the engineering and parts fit quite sound in the more ambitious domestic projects I've covered, and that has a great deal to do with why I'm making this argument.

Now as for opinions, it's not that I don't appreciate the reminder, but opinions are what these forums are all about. It's a given that applies to my posts as much as it does to anyone else's. What interests me is how people articulate why they have the opinions they do.

[Layla's Keeper]

Good point about how in recent years the detail and fit gap has closed dramatically. The best example I can think of, off the top of my head, has to be AMT/Ertl's 1957 Chrysler 300C.

Just the engine is a work of art. A perfect 392 Firepower Hemi (save for valve covers missing the delicate Firepower markings). Look at the cylinder heads and you'll see accurately engraved rocker detail for under the valve covers. Leave off the two piece carbs with their linkage and fuel lines and you can see the intake manifold's perfectly rendered venturis and runners.

The frame is separate from the floorboards, and the suspension is rendered 100% authentically with the proper shock mounts and all.

And let's not forget about the body. Setting aside the 1:24th versus 1:25th debate (and let's be honest folks, do you want a car this friggin MASSIVE in 1:24th scale?) it's a wonderful and accurate depiction of this brutish beaut. Very few mold lines, and all of those massive heavy bumpers have huge locator pins for sturdy attachment and correct alignment.

And this was a bog standard kit for the generation.

[bvia]

Originally Posted by Chuck Kourouklis

And where does "industriousness" arise, if not from passion?



So we should only consider passion as a measure of a company's proclivity to nail the details? Then why does Tamiya get a pass for their mistakes while Revell's on the pillory for theirs? Is it because Revell lags behind in processing and ergonomics? Because they're closing the gap with each successive new release at a fraction of the typical Tamiya price point.

Though I'm trying to include all that "passion" should imply here, I have, as a matter of fact, used the word "passion" within the confines of your exact context - in print, describing a Tamiya kit, interestingly enough.

Unsound engineering and parts that don't fit? I have built and reported on every new domestic automotive glue kit release for the last eight years; and all the imports I can find, for the last three. I have found the engineering and parts fit quite sound in the more ambitious domestic projects I've covered, and that has a great deal to do with why I'm making this argument.

Now as for opinions, it's not that I don't appreciate the reminder, but opinions are what these forums are all about. It's a given that applies to my posts as much as it does to anyone else's. What interests me is how people articulate why they have the opinions they do.

Good point. Let me rephrase. Passion for the product, not for the bottom line is, to me, more important.

I can articulate my opinion by looking at 2 specific models side by side...

The Tamiya Ferrari 1/12th kit verses the recent Revell Ferrari 1/12th kit. The Tamiya was produced what?...15/20+ years ago? vs the 1-2 year old tooling for the F2002. If you have either of these kits (I have both) you'll see there is little to no comparison and yet the price of each is now almost parallel (give or take 20%). What's in the box clearly shows that Tamiya has a PASSION for the subject and that trickles down to me, the consumer. What is in Revell's box takes a $200.00 Scale Motorsport Detail set to simply bring it to the level Tamiya achieved so long ago.

Having said that, I DID buy the Revell (paid for it 4 months before it was released) and will buy any more they chose to release. That's not hypocritical on my part, but rather doing what we all do...voting with my wallet.

Bill

p.s. Chuck, and just one last question, just for my interest...how many of those review products you did for the magazines were paid for by either the model companies themselves, or the magazine and how many were "review model compliments of my wallet"?

[freakmech]

Ive mentioned this a thousand times but i collect models as well as build them and ive got my own slant on all the companies.

Revell: 1/25th scale is annoying but they costently retool there kits and most originals were from when 1/25th was standard so i can get over it. Generally i dont care for there selection. Im not big into American cars but it seems the ones i like they dont make or wont make (05' Stang, LHD imports?, a decent VW Bug... etc...). on the other hand they all have engines, good enough but fitment is no good, detail can be sparce, tuner and lowrider series are not intresting etc.... to be honest, the only time i open a Revell kit is to steal parts for other kits. thats why i like them... there diverse in parts and you can find something close enough to work for another kit.

Tamiya: Good and bad. some kits are fantastic, others are OK, but for the price they should be retooling these kits more like Revell does. if you got the molds use them. Tamiya does so much business i feel they shouldnt even have OOP kits. but there good for trouble free builds but some times they make really dumb mistakes or leave out crucial details just so they can use it for another kit.

Aoshima: Im getting more and more into there kits. i like the suspension factor cuz you can really dial in the ride height. decent quality molds but they leave out stupid stufff like stock side mirrors and give you all this extra stuff that doesnt fit. but there good, i love the Historic series!!!

Fujimi: this is the most hit or miss company ever. thats all ill say. i probably wouldnt even buy there stuff if it were not for the fact that they offer so much stuff other companies dont.

Hasegawa: I love these kits, or at least most of them though they arent to availible in US. i did get a 67 Impala that was like 5 parts but generally they are excellent, accurate, and full of great stuff like PE and other multi-media. wish more companies would follow there steps!

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Bill -

I received a final round test shot of AMT's '57 Chevrolet and used it for a Building Impressions Review. I examined a production version for the yearly ranking article I write.

I received a test shot of the 1/6 283 small block from AMT, but reviewed a production version for the ranking article.

Anything besides those two test shots, I bought at retail from hobby shops. For a couple of years, I submitted a stipend request for the expense of the kits, but ultimately decided that it would be better to write off the expense of the kits against my earnings from Scale Auto. That didn't work out particularly well last year, because I didn't earn enough on magazine articles to report the income - so that one at least, as well as maybe the first three or four ranking articles, came courtesy of my wallet.

In fact, I do have both of the 1:12 F1 kits you mention. And while there's no disputing the superiority of the Tamiya kit, I seem to recall paying something well over 100 1992 dollars for the 641/2, where I only paid 76 2004 dollars for Revell's - I'll have to check and see if I still have the wrap on the Tamiya kit. Neither here nor there, I guess, but while the wheels are wrong, the rest of the Revell's kit, particularly the decals, seems reasonably impressive to me - certainly better than the curbsides I took to pretty savage task in 2001.

As to passion for the bottom line, I've already addressed that and continue to maintain that Revell's parts options, increasing accuracy, and steady processing improvements demonstrate a clear passion for the product; right now, it seems more like the bottom line is a matter of survival than passion for U S manufacturers, anyway. But while AMT and now Polar Lights are getting gutted, Revell is slowly trending back from those limited, simplified releases of the great post-millennium hangover to something like their old form, and that's why I'll continue to pull for them.

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Originally Posted by Layla's Keeper

Good point about how in recent years the detail and fit gap has closed dramatically. The best example I can think of, off the top of my head, has to be AMT/Ertl's 1957 Chrysler 300C.

Just the engine is a work of art. A perfect 392 Firepower Hemi (save for valve covers missing the delicate Firepower markings). Look at the cylinder heads and you'll see accurately engraved rocker detail for under the valve covers. Leave off the two piece carbs with their linkage and fuel lines and you can see the intake manifold's perfectly rendered venturis and runners.

The frame is separate from the floorboards, and the suspension is rendered 100% authentically with the proper shock mounts and all.

And let's not forget about the body. Setting aside the 1:24th versus 1:25th debate (and let's be honest folks, do you want a car this friggin MASSIVE in 1:24th scale?) it's a wonderful and accurate depiction of this brutish beaut. Very few mold lines, and all of those massive heavy bumpers have huge locator pins for sturdy attachment and correct alignment.

And this was a bog standard kit for the generation.

Yeah. What a pity we're not getting anything more from that particular combination of designers and tooling engineers, huh? I'm a Monogram devotee from way back, but I was cheering AMT so hard at this point - for finally matching Revell standards of crispness and detail - that some folks with reading comprehension problems figured me to have an AMT bias!

The 300 was a very passionate project. Look at the price that team paid for their passion.