S2000 vs. STi

[Mtang36]

kurtdg19, how much are the S2000s over at your place?

[kfoote]

Originally Posted by Mtang36

...
kfoote- sorry bout my mistake 50/50... it was a round of figure. Mazda speed 2005 miata turbo 1.8. you're right.. prob about 54 in the front. Finally... a miata that stands out! U like miatas? And my... you're a detailed person! Judging by your experiments and stuff.

Well, I own a Miata and am fairly involved in SCCA racing, both in my own car (SSB) and in the Spec Miata scene in the Northeast US. I've been working on them and doing suspension setup on them since about 2000. I race a Miata because it's fun to drive, there's lots of competition, they're inexpensive, and for the most part they're pretty reliable if you keep up with the known problem areas. That having been said, they're underpowered and not very fast. I've also worked in a couple of major pro road recing series (the last SPEED World Challenge race that both TC and GT were at was Sebring 2001). Suspension and chassis setup are my specialties, and the Miata is among the cars I have the most experience with.

[crayzayjay]

Originally Posted by kfoote

If you think that performance hard topped vehicles don't have much chassis flex, try this experiment:

Find an E36 BMW (318, 325, 328, M3, it doesn't really matter which one)
Measure the height from the side skirt to the ground in 3 places: just in front of the rear wheel, in the middle, and just behind the front wheel
Jack the car up at the middle measurement point and repeat all 3 measurements.

The changes in the front and rear points relative to the center will show how much chassis flex these cars really have.

Fair point, but we're talking about a car designed around 15 years ago. Besides, it would still be stiffer than the convertible version, which is all i was saying

[Mtang36]

kfoote, glad to see someone as passionate about racing as well! *shakes hand* I'm into motorsports myself. Rallies (which is my favourite), Karting, Speedfest...and...well... if it's motorsports, you have my attention.
I've raced NAs like the Suzuki Swift and Ignis Sport, a number of Honda models and higher performance vehicles such as the Mazda RX7, Nissan 200SX (S13-14), Subaru WRX, Mitsubishi Evo 6.5TM,7,8,8MR...
Most of ....well actually all of the cars i use for race purposes are Japanese. Don't ask me... They come, i drive.
Tell me more about your car's setup. I'd like to know more about how others set up their miatas. I've always looked past miatas, maybe now's the time to take a closer look!

[kfoote]

For Spec Miata, the rules basically require 15x7 wheels, Eibach sway bars, 700 lbs/in frontand 325 lbs/in rear Eibach springs, Bilstein shocks, and a sleeve type coil over kit that you can buy for about $1200. In most divisions in the US, the Toyo Proxes RA-1 tire is required. They are definitely not the fastest cars to drive, but we're seeing fields of 35+ cars in the northeast US, and the racing is very close, and relatively inexpensive.

My Miata is basically completely stock except for a roll cage, fire system, brake pads, tires, and exhaust. It's very restrictive on what you can do.

[Mtang36]

well, you don't need to a fast car to enjoy motorsports! I first got my sponsors while doing stunts on a MPV! But anyhow, you thinking of doing up the suspension on the car? And does your roll cage play a big part in your chassis performance?

[kfoote]

The cage is a fully custom welded cage that I aided in the design of. Though there are restrictions on how the cage can be built, it definitely does stiffen the chassis some. At this point, I am not planning on doing any suspension work until the 1999+ Miatas become legal for Spec Miata and Spec Miata becomes an SCCA National class. Once those things happen, I'll probably convert the car to SM. If I didn't have fun driving hte car, I wouldn't be doing it

My project this winter will be trying to get the 944 back up and running. I have a place to do it and I've sourced a spare parts car with a working engine. It's prepared to SCCA ITS specs and is quicker than my Miata. It has a full cage, stiffer springs and torsion bars, and a few other chassis stiffening tweeks. The big problem is that the "P" word triples the cost of parts over the Miata, and general maintenance is much more difficult on the Porsche.

[Kurtdg19]

Originally Posted by Mtang36

kurtdg19, how much are the S2000s over at your place?

The only one I've ever seen was at a Dodge/Chrysler dealership as odd as it sounds. It was yellow 02 which isn't my color of choice, but it was listed at 26k. They had it back to back with a 04 SRT4 which listed at a little over 20k. Thats the only one I've yet to see at a car dealer, but there are (all in all) about 4 that I have seen in town (70mi. North/West of Indianapolis). The strange thing is that it just so happens that my closest friends next car is going to be an S2000 as soon as he can find one thats he's looking for.

[Mtang36]

Kfoote, yeah i guess you're probably gonna have to deal with a larger whole in your wallet with the Porsche! But for your miata, wouldn't the roll cage create a higher centre of gravity? Suspension should be a greater concern... but then again, you're a detailed person.. you probably had that figured out before the installation!

[Mtang36]

Kurtdg19, oh cool then. You'd be able to borrow it and live your dreams! 26k second hand? You guys should check out my post, on the most expensive cars in the world. check out this site on cars in my country. www.aas.com.sg Then go to COE and car prices. check new car prices. Then check on any make you reckon would be the cheapest.

[kfoote]

Originally Posted by Mtang36

Kfoote, yeah i guess you're probably gonna have to deal with a larger whole in your wallet with the Porsche! But for your miata, wouldn't the roll cage create a higher centre of gravity? Suspension should be a greater concern... but then again, you're a detailed person.. you probably had that figured out before the installation!

The cage may raise the CG a bit, and it definitely adds weight, but the net result it that the added stiffness makes up for it even if it wasn't required. I ran the Porsche both with and without the cage, and figure that with the cage it ws about 0.5 sec/lap faster on a track with about a 1:20 lap time. The Miata also has a hardtop as required by the rules of the class it runs in, but a good portion of the cage is actually below the CG of the car.

[Kurtdg19]

Originally Posted by Mtang36

Kurtdg19, oh cool then. You'd be able to borrow it and live your dreams! 26k second hand? You guys should check out my post, on the most expensive cars in the world. check out this site on cars in my country. www.aas.com.sg Then go to COE and car prices. check new car prices. Then check on any make you reckon would be the cheapest.

haha, as much as I respect the car I would much rather be in my car of choice which would be a new C6 (preferably Z51 but time will tell). I thought the 26k was high, but I suspected they were taking advantage of its rarity and low milage to make a little more from it.