Turbo: GS-R or LS

[tran_nsx]

Originally Posted by GScivic7

dude, i know that the GSR can't handle as much boost in stock form as the LS, but anyone who is really serious about making power should really consider the GSR. I just believe it's a better platform to begin with. Also, it's all about tuning. You can just as well have an LS only set at 8 psi, and run like a complete piece of shit and eventually die on you if it isn't tuned properly. Anyone really serious about making power is going to end up upgrading the internals on the motor whether it be GSR or LS making the GSR a better platform to begin with. But, stock form, I will agree with you LS is better to boost.

this was what this whole debate was about if im not mistaken, teggy didn't say anything about modifying it to it's max capabilities. even if he did, the answer would be in a very gray area, what i do know is the winner is the one with the deepest pockets. if your saying the gsr is the best after all that mods then i hope u have some proof to back that up, im not say either one since like i said earlier that is a gray subject and how much a person is willing to spend.

yes tuning does have a lot to do with the results, that is part of the process with f/i so there was no bother mention it, well i thought there was no reason for me to mention it.

heres a dyno of an ls with some really extreme mods u might just as well call it a monster. if u multiply that by 15% and add that to the dyno whp, this would be around 770 at the crank!!!!!!!!!!!

[GScivic7]

Oil squirters, block girdle, plus a better flowing IM and head are the reasons I say the GSR is a better platform to start out with if you are serious about tuning. If a GSR motor was bored out with internal work to handle 32 psi, plus the little extra kick that VTEC will give it, I will bet it will out perform that LS engine. It is all about how much money you have to spend. But mod for mod, I don't think an LS will produce the same numbers as a GSR.

[Neutrino]

Well I believe tran_nsx eckoman and polygon made their case pretty well. So I will not add to that.


However I would like to point out that saying that torque doesn’t matter as much is a big NO NO. The torque curves across the rpm band its all that matters. Hp is just an arbitrary derivative of that.


Here is an article ilustrating that:

http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

[Polygon]

Originally Posted by Neutrino

Well I believe tran_nsx eckoman and polygon made their case pretty well. So I will not add to that.


However I would like to point out that saying that torque doesn’t matter as much is a big NO NO. The torque curves across the rpm band its all that matters. Hp is just an arbitrary derivative of that.


Here is an article ilustrating that:

http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

Oh, thanks, I was looking for that link to post it.

[eckoman_pdx]

Originally Posted by Polygon

Oh, thanks, I was looking for that link to post it.

Yeah, I was trying to find it again too. I erased the link from the computer awhile back on accident without saving it. This time I'll make sure not to erase it, lol.

[Teggy Pwnage]

Originally Posted by tran_nsx

if this is your first kit then my advice would be to just get a preassembled kit from rev hard, fmax, drag or greddy. everything is there waiting to be installed by their authorized dealer and if something goes wrong, you have the peace of mind that its warrantied. plus if you think that the kit is not powerful enough all you got to do is upgrades the parts and boost away just like what maxspeedhonda did. after fully understanding everything about turbos, its neccesary parts, and the installation then the next step up is too build your own custom kit. again this is what i would do, i rather be safe then sorry.

This is my first turbo kit, but i think im pretty confident on what to get, and the other thing is that I live in minnesota. I don't think there are any dealers around here, or none that I know of anyway. I could save a $1000 on a costom kit and use that to have it tuned, and then I wouldn't need to upgrade parts either, so I would save $2000, thats a hondata with good tuning.

I could get an LS for $7k and a turbo setup with tunning and hondata for under $4k. and then a year later i could upgrade the internals. Thats what im shooting for, but i still need to get a job.

So i figure for $15k, i could beat my friends 3000gt vr4 and my other friends neon srt-4, and have spent less money than both of them.

[XixGenuinexiX]

but, there cars are brand new.

[eckoman_pdx]

Originally Posted by XixGenuinexiX

but, there cars are brand new.

The Dodge SRT-4 Neon may be brand new, but the Mitsubishi 3000gt vr4 is not brand new by any means.

[XixGenuinexiX]

yea, my bad i don't know what i was thinking.

[Neutrino]

just be careful with that srt4. those answer to small mods like nothing. less than 2k and he will be in the mid 12's

[tran_nsx]

Originally Posted by GScivic7

Oil squirters, block girdle, plus a better flowing IM and head are the reasons I say the GSR is a better platform to start out with if you are serious about tuning. If a GSR motor was bored out with internal work to handle 32 psi, plus the little extra kick that VTEC will give it, I will bet it will out perform that LS engine. It is all about how much money you have to spend. But mod for mod, I don't think an LS will produce the same numbers as a GSR.

im not trying to be a dick here but lets really think about this for a sec., if the gsr is was modded like the ls shown, theorectically it should make more power, correct? one thing u forgot which was vital was the compression ratio, for the gsr to run at 32 psi, lowering the ratio to an ideal turbo c/r is definately a must. so now the the actual hp will decrease somewhat similar to the ls and what it boils down to is tq, which again is what the gsr doesn't have enough of over an ls. unless someone have found a way to run a high c/r on a turbo i would love to see some proof.

[GScivic7]

Give me a little time. There is a guy with an ITR that is looking for 600+ hp and 10 second time slips on a boosted B18C5 engine. I pmed him asking for compression numbers, engine internal mods and his turbo setup

[tran_nsx]

heres one, check the c/r:

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/fe...2scc_uscc2_05/

[Polygon]

Originally Posted by GScivic7

Give me a little time. There is a guy with an ITR that is looking for 600+ hp and 10 second time slips on a boosted B18C5 engine. I pmed him asking for compression numbers, engine internal mods and his turbo setup

I am sure he is. However, I am sure that it is a race only setup. I am also sure that he will spend a lot of time rebuilding his engine. I knew a guy with a Civic hatch running 32PSI on a 10:1 compression ratio. The car was not even close to being able to run on the street and the only thing stock about the engine was the block. He spent a lot of time and money keeping that car running.

Hell, my GTC's engine and internals can handle 30PSI stock, but at an 8:1 compression ratio and it is an extreemely over built engine.

[GScivic7]

this guy was pushing 400 hp and his car was daily driven...i'm not sure about the streetability of his new setup, but you guys never said anything about streetability. I thought this was just a debate of whether these high compression motors can handle boost.