1989 240sx vs 1994 Integra LS

[90gs]

Originally posted by fatninja19
That leaves you with 5g's to work with.. LSD, some tires, brake pads, shocks, struts, and springs, and some motor upgrades and you'll have what.. a mid 13 second 240 with some prowess in the twisties?

why would you spend money on tires, brake pads, shocks, struts, and springs if you were going for speed in a 1/4 mile? MAYBE tires if you had a lot of power and needed traction fast....

Originally posted by KrNxRaCer00

yes it is. integras (cept the 4 doors) are all considered hatchbacks...cuz...they have a h/b (3rd gens).

ALL generations of integras have a h/b

[fatninja19]

Originally posted by TatII
well of course i was just rambling becusae i really had no right answer to the question. hehe so i just babbled about anything that i can think off. and a red top SR is not 5 K. you can get the whole swap done in queens with a front mounted intercooler for 4K. then you got another 6 grand left over for a larger turbo and etc, then bam 12 seconds easy. becusae a red top on a stock turbo with intake, exhuast, front mounted intercooler, running on 10psi is a already a 13 second car.

WOW!!! Only 4k for the whole swap done and FMIC?? Is that including labor?? Holy shit man!! That's a good ass deal!! Last time I seriously looked into sr20det powered 240's... The cheapest shop I found around Southern CA with a good rep would end up costing me about 7g's with a FMIC!! Dang.. That's a good deal.... shoot.. then the 240 wins for sure if you live in Queens!

Originally posted by 90gs

why would you spend money on tires, brake pads, shocks, struts, and springs if you were going for speed in a 1/4 mile? MAYBE tires if you had a lot of power and needed traction fast....

First of all, you never stated if you were only referring to only 1/4 mile or an all around car. Second of all, you need suspension to help you launch... suspension exists also in drag cars, ya know? And lastly, you asnwered your own question... Does it take a lot of power to propel a 240 or a Integra into 12's or 13's, much less any car? Yes... And would you need traction FAST if you had a lot of power and would like to run a decent et?? Why of course.... Common sense, man.

[90gs]

yea.. still dont need the brake pads, LSD, or springs

[carrrnuttt]

Back to topic...

It was in an article in Sport Compact Car about 2 months ago, where they had this girl from Houston running mid-11's with her stock-looking Civic hatch.

The motor she was running in the hatch was a b18a (DOHC, non-VTEC). The motor was internally stock except for a blockguard to strengthen the cylinder walls, which doesn't change the internals mechanically.

The turbo set-up she had on there was basically a cobbled-up piece her and her boyfriend put together.

The same motor is the one running stock in the 1994 LS the original poster mentioned. There are some circles in the Honda world that believe that this motor is best for turbo-charged applications because of several things:

1) Stock, it does not have nearly as high a compression ratio as the VTEC motors have, so you can boost higher without changing internals.

2) It does not have the exhaust overlap the VTEC motors have, which in a forced-induction motor is never a good thing, because it can potentially blow the forced air right through the cylinder to the exhaust during overlap. This is why most pro/semi-pro Honda racers with all-out drag cars normally turn VTEC off on their race-cars.

3) Replacement/upgrade parts are a dime-a-dozen. This is important, especially in the volatile world of forced-induction.

I have also seen a video of a civic equipped with the same motor keeping-up with a 9-second Viper. The Civic in itself was a low 10-second, street-legal car (at least in TX).

As for the 240, I have seen sr20det motors running as low as 1800 dollars. I guess with that in mind with the 10-grand, you can potentially swap in the sr motor for about 4-grand (including labor and parts) and easily have a 14-second car without upgrades. spending about another thousand could get you low 13's/high 12's (potentially). But, with the examples I've shown above, you can also potentially find the best turbo kit and combine that with a very knowledgeable tuner for about 3-4Ks, and have potentially a 12-second car off-the-bat. That leaves about 1-2Ks for supension upgrades and other stuff.

What about the other 5000? Well, you can also use this money for upgrades like engine-management, boost controllers, stuff like that. Remember, a good turbo-kit normally comes with these things, whereas the sr20 doesn't. You can also save some of this money for parts in case anything breaks. Now, who do you think would have an advantage in parts availabilty and price? Maybe in Japan, you'd be able to find parts for the sr20 cheaper, but DEFINITELY not in the US.

That's my dissertation folks...

[BLU CIVIC]

I SAY THE INTEGRA B/C I'M SOMEWHAT BIAS TO THE HONDA FAMILY AND I KNOW THAT THESE 2 CARS ARE DIFFERENT BUT LOOK AT WHAT THE OLD ONE (LARRY) DID TO A CIVIC HATCH FOR ABOUT 6K.... CAN U SAY 11.04 @134 MPH ( http://www.hotrod.com/featuredvehicles/22838/index.html ).....THAT'S STILL WITH 4K LEFT FOR TWEEKING AND MISC

[TatII]

Originally posted by 90gs
yea.. still dont need the brake pads, LSD, or springs

of course you still need a LSD. LSD helps you launch soo much better, esp during hard shifts, it stops all the power from slipping away by elimating that tire chirp when you shift hard, and the would just thrust forward. plus if your running over 300hp, and not have a limited slip, your open diff would heat up soo much it would just self destruct. it's happend to a friend of my boy's mr2.

[90gs]

oh oops i didnt realize a LSD was a limited slip differential, someone i asked a while ago said that LSD was a type of transmission... if i had realized you were talking about limited slip differential i wouldnt have disagreed, i disagreed because i thought you were talking about a new transmission... wow things make more sense now lol

[kaoru-tochiro]

The integra driver's gonna get his ass handed to him

[fatninja19]

Aren't there drag specific springs for FWD cars? Because I know there are for RWD cars.... You may also want upgraded brakes if you're planning on doing some 12 second passes(or faster).


And I don't think I recall seeing the orginal poster specify whether the cars would be used strictly for drag racing or what....

[S14Kyle]

Alright, no one seems to have significantly touched on the costs for the 240, so I will take the awesome responsibility

SCC may have made a fast Honda, but they made a 240SX for 7k with 276 rear wheel horsepower...
the weight transfer isn't even comparable with front wheel drive. why do you think the NHRA (I think that's what the national drag thing is called) made the front wheel drive and rear wheel drive classes seperate. It's because the FWD cars would NEVER win over the RWD cars in the very final races.
Anyway, compare that 276 rwhp SR20DET with 3k extra cash in it with a honda engine... i'm not extremely familiar with honda and i'm not really into honda, but you don't see me caps locking all of my writing and incessently stating how I love nissan.
Anyway, you can pay 10k for the best, or you can pay 10k for crap...
If you get the best in both, the Nissan will come out on top always just because of the fact that it is RWD...
Until you've driven RWD and honestly have experienced the different in weight transfer, then please don't go off bantering about how it's not that much of a difference, because that's a blatant lie.
Anyway, don't hate, just accept the facts.
Also, there are 10 second 240SX's out there with the USDM engine, better than any 12 second SR20DET in the drag strip... Different purposes... I have never seen a 10 second Honda Civic, and I would like to be proved otherwise if there actually is one, but please don't just quote numbers, sent a link to a video.

[carrrnuttt]

Originally posted by S14Kyle
I have never seen a 10 second Honda Civic, and I would like to be proved otherwise if there actually is one, but please don't just quote numbers, sent a link to a video.

As you wish...

First off, the Viper he's gonna race:
http://www.house-of-power.com/images/albert.mpg

Him running this Viper:
http://www.cheesefrog.com/frog/cheezevsal.mpg

His car and mods:
http://www.vwdov.ca/forum/showthread.php?threadid=12840

Also, we have couple of resident ten-second Honda drivers on this board (hybridsol, dblovrhedcamron). As a matter of fact a while back, their CRX ran HemiGeorge's 10.1 second Hemi 'Cuda and beat it. Also hybrid's Del Sol and camron's Integra both have heavier bodies than a Civic hatch.

P.S.: I have never seen a documented ten-second, street-legal 240SX/Silvia/180SX run. Why don't you direct me to some videos?

Edit: In reference to my previous post, how much would the parts cost for the SR20DET? Since you seem willing to educate us.

[KrNxRaCer00]

Originally posted by 90gs
oh oops i didnt realize a LSD was a limited slip differential, someone i asked a while ago said that LSD was a type of transmission... if i had realized you were talking about limited slip differential i wouldnt have disagreed, i disagreed because i thought you were talking about a new transmission... wow things make more sense now lol

uh...lsd is a new transmission... an i knew they all came in a h/b form...blah blah blah :hehehe:

kyle...blu civic types in caps cuz he's at work. read his signature...its not outta ignorance...its jus wut he has to do at work i guess so thats not even a topic...

as for 10 second civics...u wanna see an 9 second vic? look up the name jojo callos or ed bergenholtz. u wanna see an 8 second vic? look up the name stephan papadakis. lets see ur 8-9 second 240's?

[carrrnuttt]

Originally posted by KrNxRaCer00

as for 10 second civics...u wanna see an 9 second vic? look up the name jojo callos or ed bergenholtz. u wanna see an 8 second vic? look up the name stephan papadakis. lets see ur 8-9 second 240's?

Easy KrN...those are all basically dedicated drag cars...I was looking for street-going cars. There is the HKS drag 180SX that run's low sevens...but wait...it's powered by a Skyline motor...

[TatII]

heres a link to jay's 240. he run's 10's
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t89763.html

[fatninja19]

I think the more relevant facts to present here are ones that cover the budget given, not high dollar track dedicated cars.


S14Kyle: Does that 7k budget for the 276 rwhp 240 cover the cost of the car itself? And can you also give the specs and parts of the 240?