Why the Camaro was Killed?

[BigJustinZ28]

i'm very dissapointed , eventhough my dreamcar is a 69 ss 396 (who's isnt ) , i hoped that when I were a little older I'd have the money to purchase a brand new camaro. Looks like i'll have to stick with my ole 84 , sure she's not the fastest of the breed , but I've driven a few and they all have the same spirit . I actually love the broad hood in front of me . It makes me feel like im driving a humongous car that is nimble like something smaller like a porsche(altho it is kind of a big car i guess) . I just hope if or when gm resurrects the f-body , it is rear wheel drive , 2doors , and a big v8 !!!!!

[Misundaztood]

Originally posted by BigJustinZ28
I just hope if or when gm resurrects the f-body , it is rear wheel drive , 2doors , and a big v8 !!!!!

Well, most likely it'll be front-wheel drive, 4 doors,(like the RX8 where it's a small door on each side)& a "strong" OHV V6. They'll just strech a Jbody chassis out & put a retro-edge Camaro body on it. Oh, & it'll come stock with altezzas just like those\/\/\/

[BlkCamaroSS]

They'd be foolish to only offer it with a V6, and put two more doors on it. No one would buy it, because there are so many other choices in the market for something like that. If it comes back, you can bet it'll have a top end model that'll compete...

[Misundaztood]

Yeah, I was just foolin'. I don't think GM would ever be that cruel.

[pennyho]

Originally posted by Misundaztood
Well, most likely it'll be front-wheel drive, 4 doors,(like the RX8 where it's a small door on each side)& a "strong" OHV V6. They'll just strech a Jbody chassis out & put a retro-edge Camaro body on it. Oh, & it'll come stock with altezzas just like those\/\/\/

AHHHHHHHHHHH! if GM did that, that would scare the shit out of me! that would fuckin ruin it, trust me usually cars with 4 doors means non sport and piece of crap(except for bently), and cmon v6 what kind of racer is that! well i hope they arent going to have 4 doors, and they better have that corvette v8, and that mustang comparison vs camaro, the camaro is totally a better car, the engine sounds alot better, more vicious looking, and the inside is more comfortable. i know this because my neighbor has a 1996 mustang(that is green) and i like my camaro a whole shit load better!

[BlkCamaroSS]

I agree to that

[DeViL]

I dunno I think the Bullitt and 01 Cobra sounded tougher then the F-bodies, they are really loud in stock form, that dual exhaust gives them quite an edge as far as noise level.

[BlkCamaroSS]

You should hear my LS1, and then judge again. I've got Mustangs in my apartment complex scrambling to buy better exhaust systems. The only way that I know this is because I was told this by a third party

[BigJustinZ28]

IMO nothing sounds better than a sbc (cept maybe a bbc) , I went up to a import gathering in va (a couple other muscle cars , 99% import tho) and my lil 305 HO with nothing but a 80 dollar flowmaster was getting noticed all around the lot , when people heard it they looked hehe. Funny how I have about as much in my entire car as alot of those guys have in thier turbo tuning setups, but to each his own. as far as if chevy bring back the camaro in a fwd 4door format , you all check the obituaries because i will be the youngest person in the world to suffer a massive coronary lol.
one other thing , anyone know what happened to the little pic of my car ? it was in my sig yesterday and now its gone !!!
oh yeah , what is with the frog head :frog: ?
edit: wait its back lol

[DVS LT1]

Originally posted by BlkCamaroSS
You should hear my LS1, and then judge again. I've got Mustangs in my apartment complex scrambling to buy better exhaust systems. The only way that I know this is because I was told this by a third party

What exhaust do you have on your LS1?

I met this dude in a black LS1 Z28 with another fellow in a black Z06 a few weeks ago at a nightime car rally (sadly, the only other F-Body besides mine among 200+ cars) and we left for a while to tear up some side streets. Buddy's LS1 sounded pretty cool and loud in the really high RPM's and especially when he got off the gas at those engine speeds and it started crackling. When we got back to the lot both boys couldn't stop saying how awesome my LT1 sounded - howling at 6000 RPM and even at idle (the "Hot Cam" makes it nice & lumpy). Thats when the other Z28 guy told me the LS1's just can't get that kind of sound and showed me how his catback didn't even have a muffler! I was like "what?" - got down under his car and couldn't believe what I saw - No muffler!!! I'd go deaf if I ever lost mine - I practically went deaf last summer for three weeks when my amp blew and had to get fixed!

Eh BigJustine, I've got a Flowmaster as well - 3" in/3" out that condense to 2 1/4 to accomodate my stock Z28 rectangular tailpipe tips - Edelbrock headers as well(not coated sadly, ugly and coroded now) - but man what a sound! Not to toot my horn but perhaps the most unique sound I've ever heard from a V8, let alone an LT1 - deep bass(but not too 5.0L Mustang/diesel schoolbus deep) and very rumbly(with just a hint of raspiness) under normal throttle, that completely changes to a scream under WOT.

[DVS LT1]

Yea, this is what we're talking about.

First of all, the Camaro is NOT dead, NEVER was, and will return as early as 2004. One needs to look at the state/direction of the automotive industry and politics to understand why the Camaro was simply put on hiatus for a brief period.

The auto market is not what it was 10 faithfull years ago when the Fourth Generation F-Bodies debuted with seemingly neverending accolades: sophisticated & refined(for a musclecar), performance bargain of the decade(even at its introduction), 1950's small block technology for the 90's that shamed other exotics three times the price(remember those gutless NSX's?), and so on, and so on... The LT1 F-Body revived a slumping, stereotypical, olde school "Sports Car" market and image back in '93 and brought it too its peak. But the car industry and market was changing even as F-body sales continued to soar in '94 and '95. The revolution was in fact fading almost from the beginning.

1996 - ram air returns - could anyone have conjured up a better marketing ploy, I mean really? (SERIOUS kudos there - I remember being in grade 12 and drooling over ram air). And hey dad, Mark's dad just bought a really cool Explorer. 1997 explodes with the new C5 & LS1. History is made in '98 when the F-Body's inherit the most technologically advaned small block V8 ever created - GM is happy but quickly starts to sweat as sales slump and prices begin to skyrocket. What do you expect, the bloody salesmen are still using the same laimo pitch "ya its got the 'Cor-vette' engine in it" (many still refer to it as the "LT1" - what the fuck do they know). The industry is becoming more cut-throat than ever. A world wide consolidation occurs where companies get bought out or merge with others. No more build what you've been good at - now its compete with everyone else in every market! Bye the way son, what are they calling those things again, S-U-V's? Hmmmm, insurance WOULD be cheaper for you.

A minor(some say major) facelift from '98 on appears to mask the true situation and fool many into feeling all is well and rolling along like never before. Well sure, the factory is now practically rating the horespower of the SS & Firehawk just 10 HP under the Corvette!(well shit they had better for their price!) Truth is even by the turn of the millennium GM had already planned to end production of the Fourth Generation F-Bodies in order to rethink and rerelease a new era of musclecars for the twentyfirst century. They really had no choice if you look at it.

One thing we must realise is that things are planned and envisioned in the industry years before they happen. We can right now say well look at the popularity of the SUV's and other import cars out - they're cool, refined, have seen a HUGE aftermarket spring up overnight, even Hollywood is cashing in with shit like Fast 'n the Furious. Teens these days don't want daddy to buy a Camaro anymore, they want to load all their buddies in a DENALI to roll around and toke up in. Not in a heatbag CAMARO "guy" - but even now that particular stereotype of getting pulled over in a Camaro is so dead as the cops can barely keep up with the millions of little punks in their rice rods. This image is so cool now that guys in rusted, different coloured scrapyard door, piece of shit 1991 Integra's and CRX's are cruisin around with a bottle of NOS, but-ugly chrome rims, and Christmas lights all over/under their car.

So of course GM pulled the plug on the Fourth Generation Camaro, its been dying for years. GM has desperately wanted to get the plant out of Quebec for years now because of political uncertainty there and for economic reasons. This factor ALONE could very well have been the reason why a replacement model was not prepared for 2003 - let the thousands of St. Theresse plant workers think they're losing their jobs because its simply the end of an era. Be Proud! Then back a year or two later by overwhelming demand!!!..........

Should GM have kept the Fourth Generation F-Bodies going a bit longer? Again, if you're GM, look ahead - can you imagine what the new Supra or RX8(just to name a few) are going look, feel, perform like? Who they are going to appeal to?? Trust me, GM can and already knows. Its taken those companies several years to redesign them! So why shit on GM for taking a few years to hit the drawing board. Thats the thing about the industry. GM probably knew about the 350Z years ago just like Ford knew/knows that GM is planning to debute an all new Camaro in 2004 or '05. Go ask anyone within Ford how good they feel now that the F-Bodies are gone and they'll be the first to tell you GM will be back with the Camaro in less than a year - they're just regrouping. Mustang will eventually have to follow suit(totally new revolutionary design), but in the meantime they will continue - and rightfully so - to milk the last of the pony car heritage with such models as the new Mach 1(awsome job Blue Boys), the former Bullet, and I'll bet you a million dollars a "BOSS" model in '04!

Its really for the best in the long run. I'm convinced even if GM had put a fire sale on the the greatest musclecars they ever made and given all the incentives in the world most people now would not have cared to even notice. Musclecars?, they're dead "guy." (Me - I would have bought at least 2 more). Fear not. The Camaro is practically around the corner. Will it be radically different - yes. It will be built to compete with(and hopefully rout once again) the new generation of performance cars in every way - speed, image, sophistication - the trick will be to have maintained a bit of heritage. So take a year or two off to get it right. After all, this will be the Camaro for the next generation. And NO, it will not be a cheesy FWD, 3.0L turbo-intercooled little car like many of you speculate. Images will pop up and rumours will persist, but GM will unleash the new Camaro when they're good and ready. And it WILL be a Camaro, true to the name. Unfortunately I hear that Firebird and Trans-Am will continue to be disco, replaced by the new GTO. But they too will be back.

I will apologize now for all my cracks about punks 'n rice rods 'n shit - there are just as many young losers out there in F-Bodies (Hey, I'm only 25, I can be a punk sometimes too - but seldom get punked!). I have many friends who own very nice Accords, WRXs, Integra's - and even though I may not like other ones as much as mine, to each his & her own! I just get very passionate about this subject. Its hard to watch the IROC's you loved as a kid evolve into the undisputed King of the street - and to sadly see them fade away at the height of their might. We are a Cult right now, the last of a dying breed. We are still many strong, but not like before. Whatever the future brings, my Camaro will always be buffed and ready to rumble - the very same kind that first swept me away ten years ago. I sound like the fucker from The Road Warrior - "The Last of the V8 interceptors, EH?"

PEACE

[AirAllen01]

Being how the Mustang is basically the Camaro's biggest competition, Ford came out with all new designs one right after the other. More people wanted something new and so they went for the Mustang, because it was the newest thing on the market. I also believe that GM will produce another Camaro, somewhere around a 05 model, cuz if you look at the market, Ford has already produced and shown off it's completely new design for the 05 Mustang. They know that GM is coming back, and coming back with a bang. Camaro's also had more power than the Mustang when stock, giving it a rougher appearance and ride, so more people bought the Mustang wanting a smoother car.

[BigJustinZ28]

Originally posted by DVS LT1
Yea, this is what we're talking about.

First of all, the Camaro is NOT dead, NEVER was, and will return as early as 2004. One needs to look at the state/direction of the automotive industry and politics to understand why the Camaro was simply put on hiatus for a brief period.

The auto market is not what it was 10 faithfull years ago when the Fourth Generation F-Bodies debuted with seemingly neverending accolades: sophisticated & refined(for a musclecar), performance bargain of the decade(even at its introduction), 1950's small block technology for the 90's that shamed other exotics three times the price(remember those gutless NSX's?), and so on, and so on... The LT1 F-Body revived a slumping, stereotypical, olde school "Sports Car" market and image back in '93 and brought it too its peak. But the car industry and market was changing even as F-body sales continued to soar in '94 and '95. The revolution was in fact fading almost from the beginning.

1996 - ram air returns - could anyone have conjured up a better marketing ploy, I mean really? (SERIOUS kudos there - I remember being in grade 12 and drooling over ram air). And hey dad, Mark's dad just bought a really cool Explorer. 1997 explodes with the new C5 & LS1. History is made in '98 when the F-Body's inherit the most technologically advaned small block V8 ever created - GM is happy but quickly starts to sweat as sales slump and prices begin to skyrocket. What do you expect, the bloody salesmen are still using the same laimo pitch "ya its got the 'Cor-vette' engine in it" (many still refer to it as the "LT1" - what the fuck do they know). The industry is becoming more cut-throat than ever. A world wide consolidation occurs where companies get bought out or merge with others. No more build what you've been good at - now its compete with everyone else in every market! Bye the way son, what are they calling those things again, S-U-V's? Hmmmm, insurance WOULD be cheaper for you.

A minor(some say major) facelift from '98 on appears to mask the true situation and fool many into feeling all is well and rolling along like never before. Well sure, the factory is now practically rating the horespower of the SS & Firehawk just 10 HP under the Corvette!(well shit they had better for their price!) Truth is even by the turn of the millennium GM had already planned to end production of the Fourth Generation F-Bodies in order to rethink and rerelease a new era of musclecars for the twentyfirst century. They really had no choice if you look at it.

One thing we must realise is that things are planned and envisioned in the industry years before they happen. We can right now say well look at the popularity of the SUV's and other import cars out - they're cool, refined, have seen a HUGE aftermarket spring up overnight, even Hollywood is cashing in with shit like Fast 'n the Furious. Teens these days don't want daddy to buy a Camaro anymore, they want to load all their buddies in a DENALI to roll around and toke up in. Not in a heatbag CAMARO "guy" - but even now that particular stereotype of getting pulled over in a Camaro is so dead as the cops can barely keep up with the millions of little punks in their rice rods. This image is so cool now that guys in rusted, different coloured scrapyard door, piece of shit 1991 Integra's and CRX's are cruisin around with a bottle of NOS, but-ugly chrome rims, and Christmas lights all over/under their car.

So of course GM pulled the plug on the Fourth Generation Camaro, its been dying for years. GM has desperately wanted to get the plant out of Quebec for years now because of political uncertainty there and for economic reasons. This factor ALONE could very well have been the reason why a replacement model was not prepared for 2003 - let the thousands of St. Theresse plant workers think they're losing their jobs because its simply the end of an era. Be Proud! Then back a year or two later by overwhelming demand!!!..........

Should GM have kept the Fourth Generation F-Bodies going a bit longer? Again, if you're GM, look ahead - can you imagine what the new Supra or RX8(just to name a few) are going look, feel, perform like? Who they are going to appeal to?? Trust me, GM can and already knows. Its taken those companies several years to redesign them! So why shit on GM for taking a few years to hit the drawing board. Thats the thing about the industry. GM probably knew about the 350Z years ago just like Ford knew/knows that GM is planning to debute an all new Camaro in 2004 or '05. Go ask anyone within Ford how good they feel now that the F-Bodies are gone and they'll be the first to tell you GM will be back with the Camaro in less than a year - they're just regrouping. Mustang will eventually have to follow suit(totally new revolutionary design), but in the meantime they will continue - and rightfully so - to milk the last of the pony car heritage with such models as the new Mach 1(awsome job Blue Boys), the former Bullet, and I'll bet you a million dollars a "BOSS" model in '04!

Its really for the best in the long run. I'm convinced even if GM had put a fire sale on the the greatest musclecars they ever made and given all the incentives in the world most people now would not have cared to even notice. Musclecars?, they're dead "guy." (Me - I would have bought at least 2 more). Fear not. The Camaro is practically around the corner. Will it be radically different - yes. It will be built to compete with(and hopefully rout once again) the new generation of performance cars in every way - speed, image, sophistication - the trick will be to have maintained a bit of heritage. So take a year or two off to get it right. After all, this will be the Camaro for the next generation. And NO, it will not be a cheesy FWD, 3.0L turbo-intercooled little car like many of you speculate. Images will pop up and rumours will persist, but GM will unleash the new Camaro when they're good and ready. And it WILL be a Camaro, true to the name. Unfortunately I hear that Firebird and Trans-Am will continue to be disco, replaced by the new GTO. But they too will be back.

I will apologize now for all my cracks about punks 'n rice rods 'n shit - there are just as many young losers out there in F-Bodies (Hey, I'm only 25, I can be a punk sometimes too - but seldom get punked!). I have many friends who own very nice Accords, WRXs, Integra's - and even though I may not like other ones as much as mine, to each his & her own! I just get very passionate about this subject. Its hard to watch the IROC's you loved as a kid evolve into the undisputed King of the street - and to sadly see them fade away at the height of their might. We are a Cult right now, the last of a dying breed. We are still many strong, but not like before. Whatever the future brings, my Camaro will always be buffed and ready to rumble - the very same kind that first swept me away ten years ago. I sound like the fucker from The Road Warrior - "The Last of the V8 interceptors, EH?"

PEACE

*wipes tear from his eye* "bravo , bravo"

[razeak]

Gee, thanks for making me cry

[stangvette1]

The reason that the camaro went under is because ford sold more mustangs than GM sold camaros and firebirds combined.