A.C. Problems

[Figaros]

MT-2500-
I used a dual gauge setup from Autozone and monitored both high & low side pressures. Did I say to put the death sealer in? NO
I simply bought the 134a from walmart. Should have said by it from dealer but why recommend to pay for acdelco 134a?
You are the one who helped me through my thread last summer & I followed YOUR advise. Ya, and maybe I will need to recharge again this summer, but for $10 a summer, I can deal with that.
refresh your memory, here is the link
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=727088

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by Figaro's

MT-2500-
I used a dual gauge setup from Autozone and monitored both high & low side pressures. Did I say to put the death sealer in? NO
I simply bought the 134a from walmart. Should have said by it from dealer but why recommend to pay for acdelco 134a?
You are the one who helped me through my thread last summer & I followed YOUR advise. Ya, and maybe I will need to recharge again this summer, but for $10 a summer, I can deal with that.
refresh your memory, here is the link
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=727088

I stand correctected on the R-134a

But beware Walmart pushes the one hose one can stop leaked any all oil fit all cans.
Beware of them.
The straight can of R-134a is correct to use and always install with the low and high gauge set up.

The newer systems a sensitive to the correct R-134a charge and correct amount oil and right kind of oil.
When a system leaks off they leak oil and get moisture and air in the system.
If they have leaked off it is best to pump them down with a vacuum pump and a add the correct R-134a charge and the right amount and kind of oil.

From the link you posted you got yours cooling and working again by recharging it.
If it leaks off again I would suggest you find the leak and fix it and get the system vacuumed down and the proper charge of R-134a and oil in it for a long compresser life.
Good Luck MT

[j cAT]

Originally Posted by brcidd

It was normal to leak at the shaft seal- maybe 20 years ago but not in today's competitive markets- No current OEM car manufacturer would ever accept that outdated philosophy- shaft seals have come a long way- the double and triple lips don't leak- I have spent years studying this.

All compressors enter the assembly plant with the entire system oil charge in the compressor- if there is an oil loss, it is due to a leak- plus to determine system oil amounts- the entire system must be flushed and the oil trapped and accumulated and measured. I have done numerous oil retention by component studies. Noisy compressors are almost always the result of loss of charge- which does not circulate the oil properly- whether the entire oil amount is in there or not....

this explanation may be true for other manufactures as i don't work on non GM vehicles...

GM vehicles use compressors that leak at the shaft seal....this is a fact....


since you are experienced in the research of this device, and i am an experienced tech with a license to repair these devices. explain how adding refrigerent oil to an automotive a/c system fixed the leak as it has been 5years since refrigerent was required.... remember vehicles were 1.5 years old and refrigerent leaked out, nothing was done except to add oil/refrigerent to proper levels....also on the a/c system where there is oil residue you have a leak at that point so if the compressor pulley in coated in oil this is usually the problem insuffient oil..


I find your explaination of noisy compressor somewhat correct as if you don't have a proper charge and the low pressure cut out switch is working correctly you in most cases will not get a noisy compressor operation as the compressor will be shut down, oil can only be circulated by the refrigerent, and the compressor can only run if the correct amount is in the system..



so how did these leaks heal themselves ?????? your the expert !

[f.p.]

Thanks to everyone for the great advise. I finally broke down and went to an A/C specialist, it was low in coolant. They filled it and added a dye to find the leak. They could not find the leak so I will have to bring it back in a few days. But for now its nice and cold.

[brcidd]

I measure refrigerant charge weight every time I extract refrigerant from a system- I determine leaks by how much is in the system- I don't use the reclaim machine when I am doing crucial studies- I extract into a precision vessel buried in an immersion cooler (minus 125 degf)- the gages read 25 in-hg when all refrigerant is pulled out- so I know it is accurate- If I get exactly what i put in out of the system (within reason) I have no noticeable/findable leak-- If there is anything less- then there is a fixable leak-- all depends on the time frame and how much is missing..

So- I have never seen oil alone seal a system- You may still have a leak- just at a lesser rate- most systems will run and cool at a half charge- and are not noticeable until it gets really hot. But the noise present- a/c pumping noise heard inside the cabin is--hence the a/c noisy compressor complaint- the entire key to the diagnostics- is "how much refrigerant is in the system?" then I go from there.

I have lined up twenty or thirty used compressors on a bench- pressurized them with 134a and dye- and put balloons over the pulley hubs- to capture any refrigerant losses- then go home for the weekend-- come in on Monday morning and half of the balloons are sticking up....these were compressors that I was told do not leak- come to find out that the leaks are like farts- a bubble forms and pops about every 20 minutes- the leak detector goes wild for 1 minute- then quiet for twenty- the goes wild- then quiet-- that is why I "ballooned" the compressors.. to prove the leak path. When I replace these old single lips with the new style (1994 vintage) double lip seals- the leaks stops- there is no oil residue- no dye evidence- I install these on a test fleet of vehicles- bring them back every year or so - and the clutch, pulley, and front head snout internals are all dry- and system charge is up to spec.....

I feel that you still have a leak- just not noticeable-- if you have oil evidence- you have also lost refrigerant- you can't lose only oil-- the refrigerant carries the oil out the leak path-- I proved this with one photo-- a balloon I used had a pinhole in it- up high- the oil leak path climbed up the inside of the balloon- to the pinhole- and out and drooled down the front of the balloon on the outside-- so how else can oil climb a vertical wall?- the refrigerant took it out..Refrigerant leaks out and expands so much that you cannot "weigh" the remainder to see the loss- my leaky compressor weighed the same before and after the experiment (grams to 2 places)-- but I knew I lost refrigerant because the balloon was about to burst......It is all relative- and to say the leak is fixed is always questionable.....

[j cAT]

Originally Posted by brcidd

I measure refrigerant charge weight every time I extract refrigerant from a system- I determine leaks by how much is in the system- I don't use the reclaim machine when I am doing crucial studies- I extract into a precision vessel buried in an immersion cooler (minus 125 degf)- the gages read 25 in-hg when all refrigerant is pulled out- so I know it is accurate- If I get exactly what i put in out of the system (within reason) I have no noticeable/findable leak-- If there is anything less- then there is a fixable leak-- all depends on the time frame and how much is missing..

So- I have never seen oil alone seal a system- You may still have a leak- just at a lesser rate- most systems will run and cool at a half charge- and are not noticeable until it gets really hot. But the noise present- a/c pumping noise heard inside the cabin is--hence the a/c noisy compressor complaint- the entire key to the diagnostics- is "how much refrigerant is in the system?" then I go from there.

I have lined up twenty or thirty used compressors on a bench- pressurized them with 134a and dye- and put balloons over the pulley hubs- to capture any refrigerant losses- then go home for the weekend-- come in on Monday morning and half of the balloons are sticking up....these were compressors that I was told do not leak- come to find out that the leaks are like farts- a bubble forms and pops about every 20 minutes- the leak detector goes wild for 1 minute- then quiet for twenty- the goes wild- then quiet-- that is why I "ballooned" the compressors.. to prove the leak path. When I replace these old single lips with the new style (1994 vintage) double lip seals- the leaks stops- there is no oil residue- no dye evidence- I install these on a test fleet of vehicles- bring them back every year or so - and the clutch, pulley, and front head snout internals are all dry- and system charge is up to spec.....

I feel that you still have a leak- just not noticeable-- if you have oil evidence- you have also lost refrigerant- you can't lose only oil-- the refrigerant carries the oil out the leak path-- I proved this with one photo-- a balloon I used had a pinhole in it- up high- the oil leak path climbed up the inside of the balloon- to the pinhole- and out and drooled down the front of the balloon on the outside-- so how else can oil climb a vertical wall?- the refrigerant took it out..Refrigerant leaks out and expands so much that you cannot "weigh" the remainder to see the loss- my leaky compressor weighed the same before and after the experiment (grams to 2 places)-- but I knew I lost refrigerant because the balloon was about to burst......It is all relative- and to say the leak is fixed is always questionable.....

thanks for that ballon trick, i am going to use that ....


on the compressor oil i would rather have slightly more than less than the proper amount.... i know that too much oil reduces efficiency but in the cold of winter the aluminum is moving and the rubber is stiff this is when the gas leaks out so i will use this ballon method to see when the seal if venting..