lighter audi

[RACER D12]

will doing this stuff like using the fiberglass and things compromise safty

[R1-rider]

Yes, so the next time you see a Supra, point and laugh because it is over 3000lbs and is not a sportscar anymore!

[-The Stig-]

Originally posted by R1-rider
Yes, so the next time you see a Supra, point and laugh because it is over 3000lbs and is not a sportscar anymore!

haha Yes indeed!

1995 Toyota Supra Turbo 3415 lbs
2002 Lamborghini Murcielago 3638 lbs
2001 Corvette Z06 3130 lbs
2002 Ferrari 456M 3726 lbs
2002 Porsche 911 Turbo AWD 3395 lbs
2002 Mercedes-Benz SLK32 AMG Supercharged 3220 lbs
2002 Maserati Coupe GT 3678 lbs
2002 Lotus Esprit Turbo Coupe 3043 lbs
2002 Aston Martin DB7 Vantage 3914 lbs
2002 BMW M5 4023 lbs


Yeah... I think I've proven my point.

[-The Stig-]

Im sorry, maybe I was a little harsh with my facts.

What are the American, German and Italian engineers thinking when they built these tubs?

They must take lessons from Japan with they're super light cars!

Oh wait I forgot the almighty Skyline GTR is 3395lbs.

[unconvinced]

1995 Toyota Supra Turbo 3415 lbs
2002 Lamborghini Murcielago 3638 lbs
2001 Corvette Z06 3130 lbs
2002 Ferrari 456M 3726 lbs
2002 Porsche 911 Turbo AWD 3395 lbs
2002 Mercedes-Benz SLK32 AMG Supercharged 3220 lbs
2002 Maserati Coupe GT 3678 lbs
2002 Lotus Esprit Turbo Coupe 3043 lbs
2002 Aston Martin DB7 Vantage 3914 lbs
2002 BMW M5 4023 lbs
'almighty' Skyline GTR is 3395lbs

Yes, those are all very nice, very powerful Grand Touring and luxury cars. I would be happy with one of those any day, if I was married and shopping for the wife.

Anyway, I was talking about lightweight cars, like the Lotus Elise (about 1750lbs.); Toyota MR-S (about 2200); Mazda MX-5 (2200-2400lbs), and a host of cars from the past 20 years that have weighed closer to 2000lbs, including the AE86 Toyotas, Suzuki Swift GT and pre-'90's VW GTi's - all of the above being more-or-less lighweight before stripping.

Let me include a number of specialty cars including most Lotus 7 replica derivatives, and the sub-2500lb. McLaren F1 and Ferrari F40, Shogun Fiesta, Renault 5 Turbo, BMW 2002ti and Turbo, Ultima cars, et cetera.

Lighweight. Something that may have become forgotten in the SUV era.

(Imagine. Calling an Aston lightweight...what are we teaching our kids?)

[Layla's Keeper]

Your safety question is valid, since you're replacing the sheetmetal that protects you in a collision. The unibody of the car, which absorbs the majority of the force of an impact, will be untouched. So you're as safe as you were before.

[RACER D12]

oh ok just wanted to make sure it was safe.

I was talking about lightweight cars, like the Lotus Elise (about 1750lbs.); Toyota MR-S (about 2200); Mazda MX-5 (2200-2400lbs), and a host of cars from the past 20 years that have weighed closer to 2000lbs, including the AE86 Toyotas, Suzuki Swift GT and pre-'90's VW GTi's - all of the above being more-or-less lighweight before stripping.

whats so great about having a really light car you ask me anything under 2500lbs just not safe.

[R1-rider]

"well maybe next time you should not go into how a car over 3000 pounds is not a true race car... blah blah blah"

These cars are meant to be driven daily, not just at the track, so obviously they are not gonna be shelled and stripped of anything un-neccesary. Sure the lotus elise and other cars you mentioned are nice, but besides from turning, where else do you think those cars are gonna be able to beat a car like a Vette. There are many characteristics of being a sportscar, just because maybe it doesnt fall into your category totally excludes it.

[unconvinced]

you ask me anything under 2500lbs just not safe.

Ha, I know what you mean, man. Funny how simplistic some people can be, huh?

Anyway, as we both know, safety's a much more sophisticated matter than just curb weight. A 1600lb tube-framed race car is worlds safer than grandpa's S-class, never mind the 1100lb, carbon-tub single-seaters, crashworthy at 200+MPH.

In any case, as an arbitrary example, how do a 60lb. stereo system, 10lbs. of window lifts and an 8lb. seat motor make somebody safer, anyway? They do the opposite - they affect the vehicle's inertia, making it that much less likely that a car will avoid a crash in the first place.

whats so great about having a really light car

:hehehe: Yeah, you're right. Just hold on, I'm gonna go put 800lbs. of lead ballast in my car, just to make it, well, you know, better. :hehehe:

[RACER D12]

the A4s not just heavier because of stereo system and stuff its just the way the cars built. And dont lie to yourself you would rather get in a crash in a little car rather than a big one

[unconvinced]

"well maybe next time you should not go into how a car over 3000 pounds is not a true race car... blah blah blah"

Sure they're race cars, they're just not as good as they could be if they were lighter. Show me a race engineer that doesn't want to make his car as light as the rules allow, and I'll show him the unemployment line.

Pretty much the only racers over 3000lbs. are American-style stock cars ("Worst handling cars I've ever driven" - Ron Fellows) and racing Big-Rigs.

These cars are meant to be driven daily, not just at the track, so obviously they are not gonna be shelled and stripped of anything un-neccesary sic.

My first car was 1750lbs, stripped. Daily driver. I've since owned a BMW and a Ford, and driven several 'upmarket' cars as well. The stripper was still my favourite, and I'll do the same for my next car. I'm also not alone.

Sure the lotus elise and other cars you mentioned are nice, but besides from turning, where else do you think those cars are gonna be able to beat a car like a Vette. There are many characteristics of being a sportscar, just because maybe it doesnt fall into your category totally excludes it.

Braking consistency, tire consistency, response, component reliability, fuel consumption. And I'm sure you realize that you're subtly attempting to sidestep the fact that the same car is faster in acceleration when it carries less weight, a point which has been pretty much understood throughout the discussion.

[unconvinced]

dont lie to yourself you would rather get in a crash in a little car rather than a big one

100% sincere statement #1: I'd rather be heading into a 'situation' in a 2000lb. car than a 3000lb. car, knowing that the lighter car will respond more closely and predictably to my inputs. I can say this because I've been there and 'driven through it.'

I understand that you probably haven't heard that too often. Fine.

100% sincere statement #2: I'd rather crash into whatever in a 1600lb. car with a proper safety cage than in pretty much any 'normal' passenger vehicle available. Benzo, SUV, whatever.

You can quote me on either point any day.

[Cbass]

Yeup, I know a guy who crashed his Fiero into a pickup truck with no lights on. The guy in the truck had his legs crushed, and the guy in the Fiero had minor whiplash.

Safety has little to do with weight, and weight is only an advantage when hitting something that will move, like another car. If you swerve to avoid hitting a car, as most people will, and end up hitting something like a telephone pole, highway divider, the weight will really make the accident less safe.

As was demonstrated in an earlier post, braking distances are vastly increased as your speed rises. A light sports car will have a much better time braking than a heavier one will. Try putting the downforce, tires and brakes from a Ferrari 550M on an 86 and see how well it stops. A damn sight better than the Ferrari, because it's half the weight, therefore it takes half the force to stop it, and half the traction.

And for the record, I didn't say a car over 3000 lbs isn't a sports car, I said it's too heavy.

[RACER D12]

ok so maybe the A4 would be better if it was a little lighter but its not right now so does the A4s 1.8T engine make up for the extra weight?

[flylwsi]

why isn't an a4 a good car b/c of it's weight?

what do most of the imports (hondas, mitsus, toyotas) weigh in at?
*not including the civics, as they weigh about nothing

preludes are close to 3k lbs, and so are lots of cars... more than we realize... even jettas and golfs are pushing 3300...

the a4 should have quattro. great advantage. period. even if it weighs "alot" more.

don't worry about weight, worry about power. weight is important, and i'm a preacher of power to weight... but if you have a turbo... chip and exh will get you over 200 hp. not bad.

and it's easy to make the a4 a helluva a handler, and really fast... and still be heavier... you can only get rid of so much weight, as awd is heavier...

but... as stated... cf hood.. if you get a good one you can drop 40 lbs.
light rims. important stuff
go for non power seats... the stockers have to weigh 50+ lbs easy... vs. sparcos at around 20ish...

think about this stuff... it's easy to make it light...

but make it fast too... an extra 40hp can make up for the weight, b/c you have awd...

the turbo motor does weigh less than the v6 and provides more options for modding... go that route... mod the hell out of it, then figure out where to drop weight...