Fast 4 door sedans worthy of street racing

[Fliquer]

Its going to take a lot more than a chip, a intake, and a full exhaust to get a 1.8t Jetta auto into the 13s. Either his slip is fake or hes not mentioning all his mods.

But GJ putting street_racer in his place for making an ass of himself.

[DSMJim]

Originally posted by Fliquer
Its going to take a lot more than a chip, a intake, and a full exhaust to get a 1.8t Jetta auto into the 13s. Either his slip is fake or hes not mentioning all his mods.

But GJ putting street_racer in his place for making an ass of himself.

AHHHHH!!!!.. Yes it can. All you have to do is put a chip on a 1.8T and they run 14.2's. I have done them myself and see it at the track. Hell I installed one at the track for a guy. It's easy to put a 1.8T into 13's. The chips on the new one's are even better. They are 180hp to start with, the GIAC chip adds 45-50hp and 55-60ft/lbs of torque. I don't even have one and I have seen and done it myself on cars, so yes it is easy to put a jetta auto into 13's.

http://www.giacusa.com/golf18t.htm

1 thing you gotta remember tho is they are triptronic which is that manual shifting auto tranny. They can shift at 7300 redline like a manual and the drive line loss on them is only slightly higher than a 5speed. They are acctually remarkable transmissions. It's also a K03 turbo which is a half descent (for stock) sized turbo so they can move a lot of air on that motor. Hate to break it to you but yeah, they do run 13's with the mods listed.

That 3" downpipe made 16hp at the wheels on my buddies GTI 1.8T and it's the 150hp version. He still had the stock 2 inch exhaust too and made a coupler to attach it to a test pipe. When he gets his 3" exhaust it will make another 15 wheel hp. Those cars can make the HP no problem. Getting it to the ground is a whole other story.

[street_racer_00]

Yes, yes, chips, chips make your car invincible! Hey look wanna-be eclipse boy, almost anyone can dump N20 into their car and run high 12's. It would have made the story a little bit more believable if you would have mentioned that in the first place.

[Atariallstar]

ive never seen a 1.8t at the track, but am sure they got good speed just cause a friend of mine has a 1.8t and its sounds like it means biz ...but then again sounds arent everything

[street_racer_00]

Nice accord, love the color.

[MadZ]

Originally posted by street_racer_00
Yes, yes, chips, chips make your car invincible! Hey look wanna-be eclipse boy, almost anyone can dump N20 into their car and run high 12's. It would have made the story a little bit more believable if you would have mentioned that in the first place.

wannabe? hmmmm.... go find yourself a tsi awd to race against out where you live and then you'll see who the wannabe is

[street_racer_00]

Originally posted by MadZ


wannabe? hmmmm.... go find yourself a tsi awd to race against out where you live and then you'll see who the wannabe is

hmmm you know I would but they are kinda hard to find because the talon falls into the same category as the wonderful geo metro and the AMC eagle......you know....cars that don't exist anymore.

[CAptynCrunch]

Ok, I'm not trying to start a war here, but theres a VERY big difference between a car that doesn't exist anymore, and a car that stopped production like 3 or 4 years ago. and was in production for like 8 or 9 years.

[|Banchi1O5|]

dont let him get to you

he seems to cause mucho trouble everywhere he posts

[Layla's Keeper]

Damn straight, Crunch. A car that's been out of of production for a few years isn't a big deal, especially if it's a deriviative make like Eagle. Now, try a make that has been spiritually out of existence for nearly twenty years like MG. (The new MG, while very stellar, is basically a dressed up Rover)

[Fliquer]

Ok so how much does this +50hp +50 lbs/ft chip cost? How many engine management/internal mods must be done to accomodatie it? If its less than $1000, then why hasnt it cause a huge commotion in the euro-tuner world? Why doesnt VW offer it as a factory option?

[street_racer_00]

oh wow, excuse me for QUESTIONING the fact that a CHIP and an EXHAUST could turn a viciously-fast( ) VOLKSWAGEN JETTA into a MID 12-SECOND CAR. God knows what the HELL I was THINKING!

[Cbass]

Hey Street_Racer, I'm gonna break something to you. This isn't going to be easy, so I'm going to build up to it, and subtly say

THE GERMANS MAKE BETTER ENGINES THAN THE JAPANESE!"

The Volkswagen/Audi 1.8 turbo is a direct descendant of the Audi 5 cylinder! It has the same technology, and concepts. Like 9.3:1 compression, which allows for excellent offboost performance. Since it has knock sensors tied in to the turbocharger and ignition controls, it can virtually eliminate knock. Not only that, but the Motronic ECU is a "smart" ECU, it learns where the engine starts to detonate, on certain fuels, and automatically programs different maps for them!

The turbochargers, while they are no K27 or Garrett T4, are fairly robust units, spool up quite quickly, and can deliver about 20 lbs of boost stock. With minor upgrades, a 1.8T makes 300hp. That's enough to put a 2900lb Jetta into the 13s. Add 50 hp of nitrous, you're dipping into the 12s...

Sorry everyone, and the Japanese make some very good engines(RB26, SR20, 13B, 2JZ-GTE), but the 1.8T is a motor they put in economy cars...

[Layla's Keeper]

I'd agree there, Cbass. At least, for the most part.

The Germans are very good at building engines that are all-around performing engines. I've never heard a 1st gen Golf GTI owner complain about lack of torque. Torque steer is a whole other issue, though. The Germans' turbo technology is unsurpassed, mostly because they've been turbocharging engines longer than anyone else. (Auto Union, anyone? Hey wait a second, that's Audi!) The crank driven supercharger is an Anglo/Yankee piece, for the most part. Auburn's had them, to be specific, though they were on the infamous Blower Bentleys, even before that.
Also, German engines are assembled, for the most part, with incredible precision. But they're also very well engineered so that there are few faults and that any repairs needed can be done quickly. Case in point, the Audi R8's. A perfect example of Germanic logistics. "We have tested this car to the point of destruction and have built and rebuilt it to the point where any chance of parts failure is likely to be minor, but becasue there is still that chance we designed the car so that it could be rebuilt by ten men from a bare monocoque in less than three hours."

Now, the thing that the Germans do not usually do well with engines is build around a higher rev range. Most VW fours and Audi fives and sixes are long stroke small bore engines which gives good torque at lower RPM, but costs horsepower at the top end and limits the rev capabilities of the engine. By contrast, most Japanese engines, and for that matter most Italian engines, are short stroke, large bore, in order to make lots of power up high in the rev range. There's a certain logic to each design, in tight corners, you'll get a lot more out of the German engine and you won't have to shift as often on track, but you tend to run out of wind on long straights or sweepers. Plus, there's the added difficulty of continuous corners. A car with out sufficient rev capability, at least in my experience, has many problems with sustaining momentum as the complex winds on.

Not that it is limited to Japan/German steadfastly.
Example: WRC- Rally Germany- On the third leg, which was fairly wide open, we saw short stroke, big bore, small displacement engines like the Peugeot 206 and the Citroen Xsara dominate becuase they could keep high engine revs, which in turn leads to high wheel speed, on long complexs of corners. A long stroke engine like the boxer 4 in the Subaru WRX couldn't match the wheel speed of the Peugeot or Citroen. Though they try to compensate with smaller diameter wheels and steeper gearing. (check the wheels out for yourself. I base this on a comparison of two tarmac Tamiya rally kits, so it may be wrong)

So, there you have my exposition on the argument. Which I'd say leads me to believe that there are 350hp turbo Golfs and Jettas. But I wouldn't choose one (a Jetta) because of the nasty tendency of VW's to lift the outside rear wheel under hard cornering. And it's a matter of suspension componentry and geometry, not weak sway bars and springs.

[Cbass]

Those are some very good points. However, Audi does not run a long enough stroke to keep it from revving, the 1.8T can do 8000rpm happily all day long. Unlike most motors, it doesn't make it's peak hp at it's redline, but it's hp curve is still very high at redline. The Germans, Audi/VW/Porsche in particular, hit on the perfect formula for strong low end torque, and lots of high end horsepower. Most German turbo motors follow this formula, and are incredibly flexible, and also highly reliable.