Suspension Tech Part 1

[piscorpio]

Oh, and about the Helms specs, it says within .2 degrees, but it also says plus or minus 1 degree....so thats a little closer (1.2) to the 2 degree figure you gave, by the way, where exactly did you get that number from?

[Dezoris]

Honda.

[Dezoris]

ah yes

[accord90]

Nice post, i feel greatly educated in the shock/strut/tire department now.
~bows~ to Dezoris . Maybe someday you can help me find a good combo for my RSX
:smoker:

[Rapidito]

wow, great post!! i learned more than i was interested in but thats cool. nothing wrong with knowing more.

[zaphanathpaneah]

:smoka:
Dezoris
that was a very educational post. THANK YOU!!! You have helped me make sense of alot. I read the entire post (for almost 35 min) and I have a few questions.

1) the tire size 205/65/15. if the 1st figure is the tire width. There are tire sizes ranges from 185 to 285. If I increase my tire with it means I run the risk of my tire rubbing against the wheel well. Does this affect alignment.

2) The back of my car sits low noticably. Is this a problem with the shocks or springs?

3) I want to purchase a coil over-spring and shock combo to try and fix the problem, which is better, koni, kyb, TOKICO or Bilstein ?

4) are there any manufacturers that sell doouble adjustable besides Tein?

Sorry for all the questions but after I read your post you fueled lots of questions. These are just a few.


:sun:

[CivicSiRacer]

[quote]Originally posted by zaphanathpaneah
[b]:smoka:
Dezoris
that was a very educational post. THANK YOU!!! You have helped me make sense of alot. I read the entire post (for almost 35 min) and I have a few questions.

1) the tire size 205/65/15. if the 1st figure is the tire width. There are tire sizes ranges from 185 to 285. If I increase my tire with it means I run the risk of my tire rubbing against the wheel well. Does this affect alignment.

If you increase the tire width you should decrease the section diameter (or the sidewall height) to keep the overall diameter the same or your speedo and odometer will be off. But no tire sizes will not change alignment.

2) The back of my car sits low noticably. Is this a problem with the shocks or springs?

Most-likely sagging springs, blown shocks or you have something heavy in the trunk.

3) I want to purchase a coil over-spring and shock combo to try and fix the problem, which is better, koni, kyb, TOKICO or Bilstein ?

Well it depends what you are planning for the car. If you are competitive (autocross or road racing) Konis are the best. Next I would say Tokico Illuminas, then Bilstein then KYBs.

4) are there any manufacturers that sell doouble adjustable besides Tein?

You can get Konis revalved to be double adjustables, but most people have no use for a double adjustables. I was thinking of getting my Konis revalved to get an edge for autocross, but cost wise it wouldn't be worth it.

Plus Nice of you to revive a 1.5 month old thread

[zaphanathpaneah]

:smoka:
Dude tanks for t he info. To reply to your post:

2) The only thing I have inthe trunk is a full spare and a 10" sub in a box. Or and sme tools. I will try to empty the trunk and see if it makes a difference. If the average rate of shocks is a 300lb i don't have 300 lbs of stuff in the trunk to cause my back to sag 2 - 4 inches.

3) I don't intend to race the max. I just want to dress it a bit. So I want stiffer shocks to prevent all the bounce I get now but still want a smooth ride. Any suggestions? I like koni's but should I get the special or sport? Are there coil overs setups that keep the car at stock height, then if I decide to lower it later I can?

4) Perhaps I don't need the double adjustable after all. So for my street car that will never make it to a track or race you suggest stock springs with after market shocks?

:bandit:

[CivicSiRacer]

2) The only thing I have inthe trunk is a full spare and a 10" sub in a box. Or and sme tools. I will try to empty the trunk and see if it makes a difference. If the average rate of shocks is a 300lb i don't have 300 lbs of stuff in the trunk to cause my back to sag 2 - 4 inches.

Well I know my 10" subwoofer in the box might lower my car about 1/4". And depending on how many tools you have back there can also lower it. HOw old is the car? I would say the springs and/or shocks are blown.

3) I don't intend to race the max. I just want to dress it a bit. So I want stiffer shocks to prevent all the bounce I get now but still want a smooth ride. Any suggestions? I like koni's but should I get the special or sport? Are there coil overs setups that keep the car at stock height, then if I decide to lower it later I can?

You cannot have the best of both worlds (I wish). If you lower the car you are going to get a stiffer ride, because you have to increase the spring rates if you lower your ride. And if you get stiffer spring rates you need better shocks to control the springs.

4) Perhaps I don't need the double adjustable after all. So for my street car that will never make it to a track or race you suggest stock springs with after market shocks?

:bandit:

I know plenty of people with stock springs and aftermarket shocks (since I autocross). You will see better handling with stock springs on aftermarket shocks, than aftermarket springs on stock shocks.

[zaphanathpaneah]

:smoka:
thanks for the reply. You know i was thinking of what you said. i took the book out and the little tools I had......not much difference. The only thing I did not tak out was the spare which is a FULL 15" tire (not the donut). Perhaps the shocks are gone or the springs. If I attempt to do anything I want the back and front to be the same so I will go with all new springs and shocks. However back to my original question......which setup. I want a spring and shock match from the same manufacturer. I like koni but they don't make coil overs. I want the stock height for now and when summer comes I will lower it 1.5 - 2 inches. Pleeeeeeeeeease someone tell me which is the best or what is working for them. I know this is a honda forum and I don't own a honder.....yet :sun: but I will post this to the Nissan forum later. thanks dude.
You guys rock.
Z - :bandit:

[CivicSiRacer]

Originally posted by zaphanathpaneah
:smoka:
thanks for the reply. You know i was thinking of what you said. i took the book out and the little tools I had......not much difference. The only thing I did not tak out was the spare which is a FULL 15" tire (not the donut). Perhaps the shocks are gone or the springs. If I attempt to do anything I want the back and front to be the same so I will go with all new springs and shocks. However back to my original question......which setup. I want a spring and shock match from the same manufacturer. I like koni but they don't make coil overs. I want the stock height for now and when summer comes I will lower it 1.5 - 2 inches. Pleeeeeeeeeease someone tell me which is the best or what is working for them. I know this is a honda forum and I don't own a honder.....yet :sun: but I will post this to the Nissan forum later. thanks dude.
You guys rock.
Z - :bandit:

Konis don't make coilovers but you can match them with coilovers. I've been using custom rates from Ground Control or you can order their special edition coilovers.

[ordnance77]

im looking at coilover kits for my saturn sc, and i was reading some threads that say "make sure you get a true kit and not just coilover spring sleeves" what is the difference, cus i saw some Arospeed coilover kits for 239 on jc whitney. please help before i mess up my car.

[CivicSiRacer]

Originally Posted by ordnance77

im looking at coilover kits for my saturn sc, and i was reading some threads that say "make sure you get a true kit and not just coilover spring sleeves" what is the difference, cus i saw some Arospeed coilover kits for 239 on jc whitney. please help before i mess up my car.

Coilover spring sleeves are what it basically is. A separate part of the shock. Whereas a "TRUE" coilover system the shock and coilover are integrated togther.

This is a sleeve:


THis is a complete kit:


In my personal opinion there is no real difference except price. I've been running Ground Control coilover sleeves on Koni Yellows and i know plenty of other competitors in my class who do the same.

[93DXon18s]

ok, i have a 93 DX coupe with 18" inch rims, a camber kit, and cheap ass APC coilovers (which i think seized up on me this winter) and i want to lower it as much as it can be while still being drivable with such large rims. what i would like to know is...since it was posted that stock springs with aftermarket struts would be a good combo, would this work for the 18s or should i get both aftermarket springs and struts? what would be best for me to choose? i am just going for the lowered look and i dont want the tires (Kumho Ecsta Supra 225/40/ZR18's) to be slamming into the fender every time i go over a bump. i know that with the 18s, the tires probably will rub a bit anyways but i dont want to ride the fenders ya know? also, in alot of magazines and shows, ive seen civics with 18s and 19s that are lowered and either have the wheels 'tucked' or lowered enough so that there is really no space between the tire and the fender. is this drivable or just for show and since i have a camber kit, what is a good setting, if any, so that i can have just the top of the wheel (negative camber i think?) tuck a little into the fender so that it doesnt rub on the tires and wear them down? LOL ok ok one last question and then im done............since the coilovers i have now have seized, how do i prevent new ones from doing the same? also just in case this info helps......i removed my back seats and the spare tire and jack for weight reduction and i plan on leaving them out so i can redo the interior (didnt know if a weight reduction would alter the spring/stut setup cause of less weight) and i also plann on shaving the lip on the inside of the fenders so maybe that will reduced the tires from rubbing as much and damaging the rubber thankx ahead of time for help