2 14.598v amps in a stock civic?

[GSteg]

Originally posted by Devedander
Hmmm, that sounds so much easier. I am beginning to think that because my speakers are mostly RMS ~50 watts and my HU puts out 50x4 watts I might not need that 4 channel amp after all. Seems a shame not to have it though since, well, since I dunno, just seems a shame. Thanks for the info though.

Still wondering what all happens when you listen to the system with the car off though.

your headunit will not put out a true 50x4. chances are your headunit will put out about 20watts RMSx4. no headunit will come close to 50x4 rms. but you shouldn't have a problem running the speakers though.

when you're listening to the system while the car is off, you will drain your battery FAST. not a good idea unless you have a second battery with an upgrade alternator. but a 15 minute track shouldn't be a problem. just as long as you're not running it TOO long while the car is off.

[Devedander]

My what a predicament. I don't like the idea of 20x4 watts of power running my stereo. The speakers can take up to 160 watts or so But new alt + install new amp + another cap + God knows what other problems will pop up... maybe I will just buy a walkman and forget the whole car audio thing

Since I don't see a lot of space for another batter in my car I guess it's just a matter of no radio if the car isn't running, which will suck if you are just sitting there waiting for someone or something. If you turn down the sub amp manually does it draw less power? I just hate the idea of a dead battery.

[GSteg]

Originally posted by Devedander
My what a predicament. I don't like the idea of 20x4 watts of power running my stereo. The speakers can take up to 160 watts or so But new alt + install new amp + another cap + God knows what other problems will pop up... maybe I will just buy a walkman and forget the whole car audio thing

Since I don't see a lot of space for another batter in my car I guess it's just a matter of no radio if the car isn't running, which will suck if you are just sitting there waiting for someone or something. If you turn down the sub amp manually does it draw less power? I just hate the idea of a dead battery.

yea...car audio can be expensive once everything is racked up. you don't have to run the speakers off an amp. your headunit will do just fine. what kind of headunit do you have?

[Devedander]

It's a pioneer DEH P6400, the one with the big face and no mp3 ability (I hopefully will upgrade to MP3 soon, which means wiring in anothe HU, the fun never ends ) and it is supposedly 50x4 watts MOSFET (I still don't know what MOSFET means). So far it powers my speakers ok. In back I have Boston RX67 and in front I have some kind of eclipse speakers which I forgot to figure out eactly what were last time I pulled them. They play pretty loud but they do distort when they get loud, I figured an amp would fix that distortion at high levels.

The subs I will be driving are a pair of 12 inch DEH2 RF subs in a sealed box. They are 400watt RMS and 800 watt max. So actually I don't have enough juice to really run them right, oh well I don't think I will need to have them cranked up full juice, I am maily doing this becuase I like to have my music clear and loud enough to hear while driving down the freeway, I am really picky about road noise (hence a wad more cash which went to dynamat, which I also have to figure out how best to utilize). Also I was told that a seperate amp will make things sound better at low levels too since I tend to listen to talk shows and music pretty quite while I am just rolling around town.

[GSteg]

yea..an amp will surely run your speakers to its full potential.

by the way...MOSFET means Metal Oxide Semiconductor Field Effect Transistor. they have faster swithcing speeds than bopolar transistors and generate less heat. they are used in some headunits and amps to give better response and higher efficiency.

[starkfu]

remember too that an amplifier of the same rating will always do a better job then a head unit.

for example, an amp that provides 40 x 4 will out perform a head unit of 40 x 4 or even 50 x 4, this is because the amp is dedicated to this one task, power and stability. A head unit has so much more to worry about. Also most head units use "stepper" circuits to produce that extra output. reason-an ideal situation gives a head unit 13.8 volts on average. the old head units would take this voltage and run it through a basic IC amp circuit, usually an op amp, and produce a 25 x 4 or 30 x 4, granted this is at 4 ohms ONLY!!!

these new head units throw in a circuit before that that jumps the 13.8 to an average of 17 to 18 volts, creating that higher output. also only at 4 ohms.

An amplifier will produce a strong 40 x 4 at 12 volts (varies from amp to amp) any way my point being that your 50 x 4 from the head unit will in no way compare to the output of your dedicated amplifier.

My advice is to hook it all up. Buy a 1 farad capacitor, make sure you use at least 4 gauge wire for all power and ground wiring, upgrade the battery ground. Now depending on what kind of car this is will dictate whether the alternator will hold up or not. Keep in mind that your amps are not drawing the max rating all the time, of course this is obvious or the fuse would blow all the time, fuse ratings are double the average current draw. So on average you will be using 45-50 amps of power. So theorhetically you will need at least a 100 amp or so alternator.

Another not so technical way is to power it on, play it at the loudest volume that you feel is still sounding good, and watch the car idle with every electricall accessory on, heat full fan lights, and let the car idle, if the rpm's fluctuate or the lights dim NOTICABLY, then you have a power issue and should look into alternator and battery upgrades.

good luck.

[GSteg]

Originally posted by starkfu
remember too that an amplifier of the same rating will always do a better job then a head unit.

for example, an amp that provides 40 x 4 will out perform a head unit of 40 x 4 or even 50 x 4, this is because the amp is dedicated to this one task, power and stability. A head unit has so much more to worry about. Also most head units use "stepper" circuits to produce that extra output. reason-an ideal situation gives a head unit 13.8 volts on average. the old head units would take this voltage and run it through a basic IC amp circuit, usually an op amp, and produce a 25 x 4 or 30 x 4, granted this is at 4 ohms ONLY!!!

these new head units throw in a circuit before that that jumps the 13.8 to an average of 17 to 18 volts, creating that higher output. also only at 4 ohms.

An amplifier will produce a strong 40 x 4 at 12 volts (varies from amp to amp) any way my point being that your 50 x 4 from the head unit will in no way compare to the output of your dedicated amplifier.

yup. an external amp will always perform better than an internal. some of the world's best headunit doesn't have an internal amp because simply they generate lots of heat. in a sound quality headunit, heat can be a big factor in how the headunit performs.

[sparq]

Originally posted by Devedander
...a place that says taht caps are just to get chicks).

Uhhhh, sorry I have NEVER have a chick tell me they dig me cause I have a capacitor! LOL... most girls dont even know what the hell it is!

And given the choice would you go for a re wire or a new alt? Mean green says they can use stock bolt holes and wiring harnesses, does this mean it's a quick and easy swap?

Yes, Mean Green is 9,999,999 times outta 10,000,000 going to be a direct bolt up into your car ~ yank the old one out and put this one in. Where as some other brands of alternators might require custom brackets ON TOP of their $$$$ pricey cost.

Me personally? Going w/ aftermarket alternator because new is still always going to be better then recycled

[sparq]

Damn you all beat me to the punch today... I had a busy day shipping and tracking and packing and shipping and oh the fun just dont stop. And of course now that I get back no one has any questions :finger:

[GSteg]

Originally posted by sparq
Damn you all beat me to the punch today... I had a busy day shipping and tracking and packing and shipping and oh the fun just dont stop. And of course now that I get back no one has any questions :finger:

no wonder i didn't see you...u are usually the one answers all the questions

[Devedander]

OK so between Sparq and Starkfu I get conflicting sugestions, Sparq says don't hook it up I will fry my amp (which would leave me buying the mean green anyway (by the way what's a mean grean go for? Stinger and Ohio both run about $500 for the whole package, but mean I couldn't find mean green prices) but without a car for probably quite some time) and starkfu says go for it and see how it works. My main concern, am I gonna fry shit? I don't mind installing it all, finding I need a new amp and unplugging one amp until I can get the new alt, but i really can't be without a car for a week or two. So which way should I go here?

I am for sure gonna toss in another cap (two amps, two caps, seems fair enough and they aren't too expensive) and if the fuses on the amps really are twice their average load then maybe I will be ok for now (or maybe with one of those wire jobs).

I forget exacltly where it is (I spent 4 hours going over the FAQ and the links so it's all a blur) but it definitely did say a main purpose was to get chicks. By the way the cap is just in it's blister wrap on my couch and already two girls got naked cuz of it and another one said she was all horny and couldn't figure out why, must be that thing on my couch.

j/k

I wish... I would have so many caps.

Oh and as for what kind of alt I already have the car is a 93 civic EX. I can't find the alternator output rating anywhere, if you could point me to where to look or attach a voltometer or something I would greatly appreciate it!

[starkfu]

I had a 94 EX that I ran a punch 400 and punch 250 off of the stock alternator for two years without a problem, i had one cap and a stinger 1200 battery.

In my 2k2 civic i am running an alpine MRD-F752 T-Class 5 channel which in itself is fused at 80 amps, I have had no problems what so ever. Just one capacitor and still stock battery in this car.

[Devedander]

Hmm, that makes it really tempting but my setup looks like it will be running double the amperage of yours (since mine is 700 and 500), do you recall what the fuses were rated on those amps?

[starkfu]

the older models of rockford 400x2 and 250 dsm were the biggest of their time in that model line, equivelent to todays 1100 and 800a4.

[Devedander]

Really? So they were probably running about the same draw as mine will be put together? That makes it soooo tempting! I just love decisions that are right up on the line