Help My 12 Second Civic Dream

[ImportRacer3]

240 sx- does it matter what year the car is for the s15 sr20det swap?

civic- how much would the pistons cost, you said it was the most pricey but will it be faster then the 240sx?

mr2- r we just dropping this car? Maybe not practical?

just want a car in the 12s for under 24 grand

is anyone familiar with indy extreme imports, i live in indiana and thought i could get an engine swap done there. How much would installation be, and could i sell my stock engine to them to take off the installation cost?

[ImportRacer3]

Hey blazedout06, i can find a used '04 srt-4 for 12 grand. Thats lookin a lil better then a 30 grand evo..

[CivicSpoon]

screw the evo. You'll be going thru clutches and tires like crazy. You can't drive it like a regular car, not even like a regular AWD car. It's a very high maintnance car. Not worth the $ IMO.

[CocaColaEatsPie]

I would definitely suggest a RWD or AWD. You are very limmited with a FWD car. You can only do so much. I saw a 750 hp prelude. that still couldn't dip below 10.5-11. How about a Buick GNX I know most of the suggestions have been imports. But with 20-25 g's you can get a 87 GNX with like 15-20 thousand miles on it and you are already running low to mid 13's with a 0-60 of 4.7. If I had that kind of money that's the car I would own. Or an LS1 Camarro also running mid 13's and a 5.2 0-60 and is VERY upgradeable and reliable but will kill gas millage.

I do like the RX-7 Idea although a buddy of mine has one and they are not reliable. AMAZING car though.

Also Turboing a honda isn't usually the smartest move when it comes to reliability. No offense, I know it can be done right and it can be built to last but it takes alot. And if you want to turbo an H series. Your best bet is an H23, I know it doesn't have the V-tec but it does have a closed deck which makes it much more accepting of the boost. but whatever you do it's going to take alot of internal engine work to turbo a honda unless you want to run 5-7 psi forever. Which probably won't put you in the 12's nor would it have a 0-60 of less than 5.

[ImportRacer3]

k so civics are deffinately not gonna work for my needs, i kinda figured that out and the fact that it was fwd always bugged me but my friend who does know a ton about cars insisted that i get a civic cuz of the convenience and the wide amount of aftermarket parts.

Ok so on with the 240sx, mr2, recently added camaro and buick gnx.
Will the camaro and gnx be reliable, i dont want an older car that will have a tendency to brake down. What sort of mods would be put into the gnx and camaro? Engine swap?

Nothing has recently been mentioned about the mr2. Maybe thats not the best car, it has the engine in the back so it may get annoying fish tailing all the time and allthough im going to avoid driving in winter as much as possible an mr2 would b hell to drive.

240 sx, wat about a r33 engine? More expensive but is it worth it? What turbo upgrade should i put on this? Garret GT25R ball bearing? GOOD INFO on the different engines and quoted prices- http://www.jspec.com/frontclips.html. AGAIN THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP!! im gettin so excited about building this race car.

[CocaColaEatsPie]

Well the LS1 was only put in camaro's from like 98-02 I believe. But it was just the later ones. They also come with a 6 speed and that's always fun. A Camaro is very reliable because it is all motor and you could find one with less than 20,000 miles in your price range so it would last a long time.

As for the GNX the problem with them is the last year they made them was in 87. Although if you find one with low enough miles it will be reliable. Buick Grand National's are amazing cars. It has a turbo'd V6 so with a new turbe you could be running low to mid 12's easy. They are rear will drive. But my biggest problem with a GNX is they only come with an automatic and their top speed is 124, so if you are looking to drag they are great, but if you are looking for flat out speed forget it.

Both cars are have a large amount of upgrades. The Camaro would be 10-15 years newer than a GNX but I still love GNX's

[SiGNAL748]

Originally Posted by ImportRacer3

mr2- r we just dropping this car? Maybe not practical?

I wouldn't drop it. It's probably the most practical out of all of the cars because it will require the least amount of work. No motor swapping required (provided its the turbo model). In fact, out of all the cars listed, it would be at the top of my list if i were in your situation. Sorry, I can't provide much information on it, but theres a guy named JekylandHyde that posts here also, he owns one that runs a high 11. If anyone can help you out with building your mr2, its him.

[JekylandHyde]

Well hello everyone ImportRacer3 directed me over here.

The MR2 is a very capable car. It's midengine layout is ideal for launching and it's turbocharged 3SGTE engine takes to modifciation really well.

You asked for a site on how to get power from an MR2. Try here:
http://www.mrcontrols.com/primers/power.htm

I bought "Hyde" with 180,000 miles. He was bone stock.
I have since taken him to well over 350 RWHP, done over 120 quarter-mile passes (most in the 12s, over a dozen in the 11s). I have also done 3 SCCA Solo 1 Hill Climbs, over 1/2 dozen SCCA Solo 2 Autocrosses, 20+ dynos pulls and lots and lots of abusive street driving.

My car now has 200,222 miles on an unopened engine. It's all documented.

Are there a lot of junk MR2s out there? ... sure, there are plenty of beat, high mileage sports cars of all types.
I would recommend finding a bone-stock MR2 to start your project with.

At any rate, I vote for the MR2. Not only can you have a 11/12 second car, but it will also be road race worthy. You build a 12 second Civic and chances are good I would not want to see you racing through the twisties.

As for budget, I could get you into the 11s for a lot less $$ than you talked about in your PM.

If you want to see more of what my car is about, check out my Web site ... or better yet, order my DVD

[ImportRacer3]

Originally Posted by JekylandHyde

an unopened engine. You build a 12 second Civic and chances are good I would not want to see you racing through the twisties.

what do you mean by unopened engine and what do you mean by you wouldnt want to see me racing through the twisties with a civic? Also you said i should start with a stock mr2 but the car will probably have high miles. Im assuming the next step of the mr2 would b to get a 3sgte engine swap?

[CivicSpoon]

unopened means he never took the head off the block and did any internal work. I think he also ment not to buy an MR2 that has been modded. The same reason you shouldn't buy any pre-modded car of any type. Because you never know how much the previous owner beat on the car. You'll be able to find a used MR2 with lower mileage, you just have to look around. Just don't rush into buying the first car you see, because something better will always come around eventually.
But I disagree with the comment about doing SCCA with a Civic. There are a lot of Civics that do very well in autocross. I mean you'd have to beef up the suspension a little but they can be very fast. Just ask CivicSiRacer he'll tell ya. You just have to know how to drive.

[Miataracer]

a Civic is capable of being a pretty good handling car. it takes a bit of work but it can be done

[CivicSpoon]

Also he's right about the getting better ¼ times for less $ than you're talking about. That's another reason why so many people have Civics and Integras. They're fairly light weight cars and have tons of aftermarket support and engine swaps available. There are just so many ways you could get there. You could get any B-series motor, do a moderate amount of motor work, and turbo it and you could easily be in 12's. But I'm not trying to sway you to a Honda, because it's a well known fact that RWD cars are better for the drag strip and getting the power to the ground. I'd recommend going to a car site like www.edmunds.com or something like that, comparing the features and specs on all the cars you're interested in. Then go out and test drive those cars, because a test drive is the only way you'll know for sure if a car is right for you. Like for me, the first time I drove my friends Civic I was hooked on the idea of driving one. Now I've had mind for over a year now and couldn't be happier with my decision.

[JekylandHyde]

Civic, is right on with his interpretation of my post. Unopened means I have ZERO engine work. That engine has not been touched since it was originally assembled 15 years ago.

And as staeted, I would not buy someone else's modification project.

I'm not sure why you keep refering to "Swapping in a 3SGTE" engine?? .... The turbo MR2 comes with that engine already, no need to swap it in.

Civic, please do not take offense to my post. I have nothing against Civics. Keep my words in context.

I am not talking about just autocrossing, I was also talking about Road racing (see previous sentence) ... I race Solo 1 Hill climbs as well as autocross. And yes, a Civic could be set up to do that well also ... but not a 12 second Civic.

My point is that most Civics that are set up for Drag racing would be dangerous or foolish on an autocross/hill climb course.

Very few cars make sense to set up for both types of races. The MR2 is one of them.

[th_james2003]

hell if you got money get an awd car. i would get a galant vr-4. i have seen those with not that much mods go 12.5's. thats my 2 cents

[CivicSpoon]

Originally Posted by JekylandHyde

Civic, please do not take offense to my post. I have nothing against Civics. Keep my words in context.

I am not talking about just autocrossing, I was also talking about Road racing (see previous sentence) ... I race Solo 1 Hill climbs as well as autocross. And yes, a Civic could be set up to do that well also ... but not a 12 second Civic.

My point is that most Civics that are set up for Drag racing would be dangerous or foolish on an autocross/hill climb course.

Very few cars make sense to set up for both types of races. The MR2 is one of them.

Oh no I don't take offence to your post at all. I know you're not bashing or anything.

But I see what you're saying now. I agree a 12 second Civic wouldn't really make the best road race car. But it'd certainly be fine for autocross. My buddy has a '95 Civic with an H22a/turbo swap, I mean he doesn't pull 12's yet, but he still did the best in his class at a local SCCA event. He's got a small turbo so it spools really quick (dies past 6,200rpms), but he does high 13's with it. I know there's a huge difference between 12's and high 13's but he could still do fine with more power. But certainly a rwd car would have he advantage on sharp turns with more power. But there are a wide variety of quality adjustable suspensions available for Civics, so it would be possible to have it both ways (drag and road racing/autocross).