s/c the 2.2

[=OrangeZ=]

Originally Posted by noshun

FYI the compression ratio was dropped from 10:1 to 9.5:1. In a GM test the 2.2 EcoTec simultaneously blew all 4 rods at 283 hp! Not good so It's not just a case of air/fuel! Your SC is running 7 psi which is a small amount of boost! The ss S/c runs 12 psi! That's 171% the boost you are running. A small amount of boost like you have isn't enough to do too much damage albeit that you have a completely different motor. In stock 2.2 form don't be expecting to top 9psi on stock internals without some serious reliability problems. Sure GM blew the rods at 283 but this was instantaneous catastrophic failure and not to be confused with increased wear from use. The Big ends will probalby give out if the wrist pins don't do so first, result! F*cking Mess!

the 2.0 doesnt have the same interals as a 2.2 so the 283whp doesnt apply and besides that was on n20 not boost

and 89IROC&RS your a very jumpy person how was i supposed to know you knew your stuff im not physic all i seen was you said it couldnt be done on stock compression which we all know isnt true,also GM used the smaller engine for quite a few reasons higher and quicker reving,less compresson = less ware and the 2.0 has a special oil cooling system for the interals and was fitted with forged everything

did i ever say once that the 2.0 was developed for the Cobalt lol nope y because i know it wasnt it was developed for the drag strip, and then stipped down to go into a turbo'd sabb and from the sabb it went into the redline from the redline into the cobalt lol
so i dont see where any of my facts where wrong...

[noshun]

Originally Posted by =OrangeZ=

the 2.0 doesnt have the same interals as a 2.2 so the 283whp doesnt apply and besides that was on n20 not boost

and 89IROC&RS your a very jumpy person how was i supposed to know you knew your stuff im not physic all i seen was you said it couldnt be done on stock compression which we all know isnt true,also GM used the smaller engine for quite a few reasons higher and quicker reving,less compresson = less ware and the 2.0 has a special oil cooling system for the interals and was fitted with forged everything

did i ever say once that the 2.0 was developed for the Cobalt lol nope y because i know it wasnt it was developed for the drag strip, and then stipped down to go into a turbo'd sabb and from the sabb it went into the redline from the redline into the cobalt lol
so i dont see where any of my facts where wrong...

the test on the ecotec were performed with a turbo from garrett.

[=OrangeZ=]

still wasnt on the 2.0 different setup Forged everything helps alot lol

the 2.2 doesnt have that thus it fails at 280whp

[noshun]

Originally Posted by =OrangeZ=

still wasnt on the 2.0 different setup Forged everything helps alot lol

the 2.2 doesnt have that thus it fails at 280whp

yeah my point was that they changed the 2.2 to make it handle boost and still run 87 octane! This thread is called why not s/c the 2.2 and that is why! it can't handle it the way it is and they sdon't want to put buyers off by making it premium only

[Omega_5]

well it has already been explained in mechanical terms why the drop in displacement. But in GM's mind it probably went a little something like this:
"why s/c a new engine, when we can just use the 2.0L s/c from the ion redline?"
-economics of mass production-

[noshun]

Originally Posted by Omega_5

well it has already been explained in mechanical terms why the drop in displacement. But in GM's mind it probably went a little something like this:
"why s/c a new engine, when we can just use the 2.0L s/c from the ion redline?"
-economics of mass production-

errr no! the EcoTec has been arouind in FI applications long beofre th redline! it has been in europe in the Astra Coupe Turbo since about 98 and in the VX220 Turbo! it is ecatly the same block at the 2.2 with the same bore but the internals are differnet and the stroke is elss hence the smaller displacement. displacement = 3pi(bore/2)squared x stroke! less stoke, less displacment! All of the turbo units makes upwards of 220hp and the New Astra VXR will have 245 hp form the same motor and a turbo'd solstice to run alongside the s/c'd solstice rumoured to have 300hp may be produced! This motor witb the internals that it has is capable of much more than the pawltry 205hp it makes in both the redline and SS s/c! That was my point on the whole comp ratio thing! with it making little power compared to the turbo'd units it could have been made with the s/c with forged internals and keep the 10:1 comp ratio, make it premium only and then it would produce 220hp or more! This is why I called it comprimised! I think also that this motor has been built for longevity more than power! who wants that?!?!

[Omega_5]

[quote=noshun]errr no! the EcoTec has been arouind in FI applications long beofre th redline! QUOTE]
ya know what i mean... why S/C a different engine when they already have one ready and being produced... it would be economically stupid!

[noshun]

[quote=Omega_5]

Originally Posted by noshun

errr no! the EcoTec has been arouind in FI applications long beofre th redline! QUOTE]
ya know what i mean... why S/C a different engine when they already have one ready and being produced... it would be economically stupid!

yeh that is true but yeh the turbo would have been better still would have a SRT-4 over it!

[Omega_5]

Originally Posted by noshun

yeh that is true but yeh the turbo would have been better still would have a SRT-4 over it!

I dunno, GM has a bias against turbos for some reason. Only real turbo cars they have made were the Grand National and the Grand Prix SE's back in the early 90's. Also, (in another thread) they compared the Cobalt SS and the SRT-4, and they perfom very close... just cuz i like GM i'd stay with the Cobalt.

[noshun]

Originally Posted by Omega_5

I dunno, GM has a bias against turbos for some reason. Only real turbo cars they have made were the Grand National and the Grand Prix SE's back in the early 90's. Also, (in another thread) they compared the Cobalt SS and the SRT-4, and they perfom very close... just cuz i like GM i'd stay with the Cobalt.

countless opels/Vauxhalls and Saabs! SO that's untrue Maybe in North America but not in Europe. They have been mnaking turbo'd cars in Europe for years! It's not like they just recently bought Vauxhall/opel

[89IROC&RS]

i think the mystery behind the supercharger instead of the tubo in north america may be about marketing. All the import cars are running turbos, i think it would make sense for gm to go with the supercharger to set itself apart. From a performance aspect, with modern turbo technology a turbo is actually a better choice, but they may have felt the supercharger offered better reliability. Also, there may have been a factor of emissions and CAFE ratings because North America has much tighter emissions regulations than foreign markets. Im not entirely sure what those would be but im just saying it may be a factor.

[noshun]

the cars manufacturers i mentioned ARE all GM. Also the emmissions standrds in most of Europe are very strict.

[89IROC&RS]

i didnt mean to imply that you were mentioning non GM brands, i was referring to the North American market. The cars running turbos here are mostly imports, GM may have felt that the supercharger was more american, and decided to run with it rather than do like they were in other world markets.

regarding emissions im not really gonna argue that one, because i dont really know specifics, all i know is there are several vehicles available in europe that are not allowed in the North American market due to emissions regulations (aka Landrover Defender) So i was saying that could have been a reason they didnt use the same drivetrain from their export units.

[fac3l3ss]

well i just recently bought myself the 2007 cobalt ls...not a bad looking car..i had to get 4 door cause i have gf with baby...anyways my question is...what performance mods can i get for the ls...to up the hp? i find the car isn't very fast off the line..any suggestions?

[noshun]

gm performance parts Eaton M-62 Supercharger kit