explain countersteer

[Too New To Know]

good = going, sorry just got back from night shift, tired

[Z_Fanatic]

Originally Posted by TechX

If you are riding straight and just turn the handlebar to the right the tires will go right and the weight will be on the left side of the bike now and you will then turn left. Simple.

Ya I'd like to have this explained as well, because this only happens if I wanna lean the bike or swerve fast. Not for turning left or going below 20-25 mph. Below that, steering is like riding a bike. There is steering and counter-steering, two different methods of turning.

[TechX]

It would be much easier to explain with pictures but....If you are riding straight down the road and do not lean at all and you turn your handlebars to the right you tires start taking a path to the right. Well if you are not trying to lean either way and the tires start taking that path to the right your weight will now be on the left side and you will be forced to turn the handlebars left or crash. Just think of it in terms of balance. If your wheels are to the right your weight is on the left which is the way you will turn unless you enjoy crashing. It is much easier and proper to hop on a cycle and ride it around. Thinking about this will only distract you if you are a beginner. I miss my bike now.


Edit: The only difference in steering and countersteering is one you shift your weight and then follow with the bars the other you use the bars to shift your weight for you and they follow with a normal turn. I really can't explain it better sorry.

[Z_Fanatic]

yes I agree, but my point there is a certain speed, where below that, counter-steering is not possible. This is where you have to shift your weight and steer. If you get your bicycle to go above 20 mph, which isn't too hard, counter-steering could be done. And in fact, it has a swifter execution, since the rider weighs 5 times as much as the bike.

[Too New To Know]

hrmmm ok, ok... so, im going pretty fast and i turn right with the bars, before my body goes to throw itself to the left from the force (correct so far?)
i position my weight more to the right of the bike to keep the turning flow even?? ...

how did i do?

[Z_Fanatic]

lol, I have no idea what you just said. Get the bike, it will come to you automaticly and unconsciously at first, before you realize, you'll be doing it.

[Too New To Know]

ahahahahaha ok ok... im just trying to learn, but obviously its one of those things you have to find out for yourself...

but for the record, i think i made sense :P

[Z_Fanatic]

ok I'll give it one more try:

counter-steering:

when you're going in a straight line, let say around 30 mph, you push your right handlebar a few degrees, which makes the wheel turn to the left. right? with me so far? so what follows is, since the weight has been shifted to the right side (since you turned the wheel to the left), the bike starts to lean. and by now, the wheel that was turned left, will automaticly turn right or the direction you're leaned/turning to. if you try to stop the wheel from turning to the right, you'll crash. counter-steering just initiates the turn, but in the end, it's the front wheel turned at whichever direction determines where you're going obviously. below 20 mph or so, I think you're stuck steering in the regular fashion, like bicycle. with counter-steering, the motorbike does the weight-shifting for you.

[Too New To Know]

so above 20mph, you shift your weight slighty to the side you wish to turn, as well as turning the bars that same way? because if you didnt shift your weight, the bike would maybe highside?

(please be right *crosses fingers*)

[Z_Fanatic]

turning the bar should shift the weight for you. remember, push right, go right; push left, go left.

[Too New To Know]

hrmm... i was thinking like in a car, hang a hard left, and your body is thrown to the right..

now change that example to two wheels, and if you turn left, your thrown to the right, which will then bring the bike from turning left to suddenly turning right, maybe resulting in a crash? so you've got to stop that by leaning left with the turn... correct??

if thats not right, ill give up right now

[catback23]

bikes follow the laws of physics differently than what most are use to. Because you can lean a bike you accomplish more turn than you'd expect from the wheel turned as little as it is. For the most part lean is what makes a bike turn at higher speeds because you really can't just turn the wheel to make a turn, your body and upper bike momentum would fight you and throw you off the opposite way you want to turn. So you have to lean to get the bike to actually go in that direction. When you do so your actually turning the bars a tad in the opposite direction you want to go but not much because once you get the bike to lean you countersteer (typically comes natural) to allow the lean to be stabilized. At slower speeds you don't really rely on much countersteering. This is pretty confusing stuff to understand but luckily your brain is very good at keeping itself balanced.

[TechX]

Well speed does have alot to do with it. Because of where the contact patch is (thanks to the front wheel caster) you can sit on your cycle without moving and turn the handlebars right and you will tip over right. That is thanks to the contact patch moving to the left so you are right speed is definitely a factor.

[Too New To Know]

lol, turning the bars the opposite way your actually trying to turn? ok ok, ill leave it at that and just hope it comes natural when i get my bike thanks for all the technical explainations guys

[TechX]

Don't listen to me I am just confusing myself. Have fun riding.