Saddam's Captured

[carrrnuttt]

Some of you aren't going to like these then!









And here's the "Say-Ahhhhh" pic:

[carguyinok]

THANK YOU.

[YogsVR4]

Definately a great development. Still have the big one and his lackies to get but this is great!

[2strokebloke]

For some reason (other than the beard) he doesn't really look like Sadam.
Personally though, if he is the real deal, I don't think he should go to jail, be executed etc. - because he'd make a really cool sideshow at carnival.
"Step right up and take a peek at a murderous dictator... And have him read your fortune for only $2!"

[carrrnuttt]

They already did DNA testing, and it IS him. The "Say-Ahhh" pic was when they were swabbing him to get a DNA sample...

[Solomon219]

As far as embarassing him goes, they've been doing interviews with some Iraqi citizens who are saying "I won't believe it 'til I see it". I'd say we get medieval on his ass and parade him through the streets. Maybe borrow the Pope-mobile so he doesn't get assassinated. Full military blanket so no-one tries to rescue him.

As far as a tribunal, I believe it will be Iraqi.

[justacruiser]

Well, they finally got his ass. Didn't they have a chance to do this... oh, about 12 YEARS ago? Should have done it the last time folks! With the Reagan era still lingering, the general populace of the world might just have had enough of a pair to actually execute him instead of harping about an 'internationla tribunal', how he should just get life in prison and not to humiliate him. Oh, not to mention all the other bullshit they've had to go through to get his ass in the end. It's good that they got him alive though, that way they have live pictures of him to prove that they actually have him. Pretty easy to fake a dead Saddam, but a live one? A bit harder to do.

As for whether or not he should be humiliated... lemme get this straight, he's killed tens or hundreds of thousands of his own people, brutally torturing them first in some cases, had a standing reward for the family of any Muslim who died in suicide attacks against Israel and America, yet you actually give two-tenths of one shit about how they treat him? See what I'm talking about people? Ever since the hippie movement, the world has been totally emasculated. No wonder psychotic criminals dont give a shit about what they do, nothing is going to happen to them in return! They should have confirmed who he was and turned him out naked on the streets of Baghdad, that would have taken care of him pretty quickly.

[carguyinok]

As for whether or not he should be humiliated... lemme get this straight, he's killed tens or hundreds of thousands of his own people, brutally torturing them first in some cases, had a standing reward for the family of any Muslim who died in suicide attacks against Israel and America, yet you actually give two-tenths of one shit about how they treat him? See what I'm talking about people? Ever since the hippie movement, the world has been totally emasculated. No wonder psychotic criminals dont give a shit about what they do, nothing is going to happen to them in return! They should have confirmed who he was and turned him out naked on the streets of Baghdad, that would have taken care of him pretty quickly.

Another thing, as far as anyone knows he may still see an Iraqi trial. Now there are some people that are far from emasculated
"I'd say we get medieval on his ass and parade him through the streets."
They may, That is if Bush jr dosnt put his ass in a cage n give him to his daddy for x-mas.

[Solomon219]

lol, carguyinok.

Justacruiser I agree with everything you said, except for the figure. While no exact figure is known, the deaths he caused, or at least had a hand in, number in millions.

MILLIONS! While I don't have figures (if someone does, post) I'd say Saddam has Hitler beat, yet the world see Hitler as the worst, most horrific dictator/leader in history.

Yet we're crying over his civil rights. He's killed millions of people. We know this as FACT. Yet we still bother worrying about how he feels.

Tying in with that hippie movement is the whole "psychology" thing. Everybody is so concerned with the feelings of others, that we're allowing the little people to be killed to protect the killers. All he has to say is "I was abused" or "My mother was a whore" and he's FORGIVEN! It's not his fault!

Bullshit. My life hasn't been easy, but it's definitely not been like people over there are living, in fear for their very lives every day. But I still believe that it's the person who makes decisions, whatever happened to you as a kid.

In a day when there's a pill or therapy for any little bit of unhappiness or sadness, yeah. We've been emasculated.

[IntegraBoy2003]

Finally, next Bin Laden

[DaxManio]

Originally Posted by Solomon219

MILLIONS! While I don't have figures (if someone does, post) I'd say Saddam has Hitler beat, yet the world see Hitler as the worst, most horrific dictator/leader in history.

Yet we're crying over his civil rights. He's killed millions of people. We know this as FACT. Yet we still bother worrying about how he feels.

Adolf Hitler's got 12 million...6 million of them are Jews
Josef Stalin's got 20 million..mostly from the middle class
Saddam...he's waaayyy below those figures but it doesnt mean you have to pity him...

I totally agree with you.
If the situation was reversed and you were in Saddam's place right now, I doubt if He'd give a shit on what's happening to you...He'd prbably have a video of your torture recorded for entertainment purposes

[DaxManio]

Saddam's atrocities:

—1978-80: Hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, whose ancestors were of Iranian origin, packed in trucks and thrown out on border with Iran. Property confiscated. Hundreds died in very cold weather. Thousands of their teenage sons kept in Iraqi jails and after more than 15 years all killed.

— 1983: Government campaign against members of Kurdish Barzani (search) tribe for helping Iran launch offensive in northern Iraq. Estimated 8,000 killed, many buried in mass graves far from home in Iraq's southern desert.

—1986-88: Scorched-earth offensive known as "Anfal (search)" that included chemical attacks on Kurds in northern Iraq for advocating autonomy. Estimated 180,000 Kurds killed, many buried in mass graves in south. Possible genocide charges in Iraqi tribunal.

—1991: Crackdowns on Shiite Muslim (search) and Kurdish uprisings at end of the Gulf War. Estimated 60,000 killed. Many buried in mass graves.

—1992: Draining of marshes in southern Iraq, driving population known as Marsh Arabs from homes and wiping out way of life. Tens of thousands killed. No mass graves. Possible genocide charges.

—1979-2003: Various political prisoners of populations distrusted by Saddam disappeared, including Turkomans, religious Muslims and communists. Tens of thousands believed killed. Many buried in mass graves, some near prisons.



Oh my god, he's being humiliated too much. Jeez...read the list again.

[Motor Eyes]

freaking finally.

[replicant_008]

Now that he's captured, the international community faces another dilemna. The US could hold him in the rather dubious situation as the inmates at Camp X-Ray who are neither prisoners of war nor criminals. This would be a no-win for the US for a variety of reasons...

The alternative is that there is probably sufficient evidence to try Saddam for crimes against humanity and war crimes - the question is wherre do you hold such a hearing, under what jurisdiction and who will sit on the panel adjudicating the hearing....

The US and its coalition partners probably prefer a trial to occur and be seen to dispense a fair and defended hearing using international law and an international panel to be seen to be independent from the judicial process.

This brings issues as to where you hold the hearing, the unprecedented security building up to, during and after the trial - and presuming the panel find the man guilty of charges what sort of punishment do you mete out?

Remember the US's presence in the Mid-East is opposed by many and at best only tolerated by some...

I'm not suggesting that Saddam isn't a vengeful, violent tyrant responsbile for atrocities, crimes against humanity, death and destruction, persecution, torture etc... The overwhelming weight of evidence is there...

The issue is punishment - most Western countries do NOT have capital punishment and would oppose this - even some of the closest of the coalition partners. Secondly, it's unlikely that even if it is sentenced that it would be carried out - it would be commuted to some sort of imprisonment. Thirdly, it would make the man a martyr and create the impetus for more terrorism rather than to rid overselves of it.

Summary:
The thing about laws is that we choose to make and live by them and they provide for fair and defended trials no matter how heinous the perpertrator's crimes.

When we give up our laws, ethics and morals for revenge or anger, we stoop to a situation where we end up with a situation that we defend our actions on similar defences to the deplorable acts that the accused stands accused of.

We hold ourselves to be in the right, to be defending freedom, justice and truth - so try the man in a fair and defended trial - and if the evidence presented provides beyond a reasonable doubt to a fair and unbiased jury then let him be sentenced for the crimes he is so convicted - but demonstrate those qualities of justice not only for those wronged but to remind ourselves of what justice means.

[justacruiser]

Give him to the Iraquis. They would know exactly what to do with him. If he's allowed to be tried in an 'Internatianal Tribunal' (ie. European countries) then the trial is going to turn into another Slobadon Malosevic trial, in other words, a joke. The Iraquis suffered under him the most, let them try him and execute him.