GSR,loser car? I want to smoke STI's and stangs!

[eckoman_pdx]

Originally Posted by billab2ong

dont take advice from people who arent turboed and run NA. turbo costs more than $2500.

if you want to learn how to turbo...you really should read instead of just making a post answered about 50 times before. dont buy a fucking kit...they suck and their manifolds are for shit. not to mention some of the shit they use in the kits suck. buy it piece by piece and you will get more performance for less money

and anyone that runs a FMU is an idiot and wastes their money

225 fuel pump + 440/450cc injectors + uberdata + tuning= good fuel management.

list of all this shit you will need:

$310 Garrett Super 60 T3 Turbo
$300-500 Manifold
$200 Tial Wastegate
$100-200 BOV
$100 Chip Burner and all that stuff needed for uberdata
$100 Dyno time for tuning
$100 IC Piping
$350 FMIC
$50 Downpipe
$105 Etech cutout
$30-50 cut out and reducers
$350 Clutch
$50 Boost Gauge
$120 EGT Gauge
$30-50 Cluster for Gauges
$100 Fuel pump
$150-300 450cc Injectors
$100 for oil lines and adapters and t's

and still need vacuum lines, silcone tubing, and an air filter

Okay, first off, no one in here today him he needed an FMU. Whtteg recommended a Hondata. And FMU's are for idiots? Not always my friend, don't go bashing things and saying they are for idiots. They serve their purpose. I know a guy with a 500WHP LS/Vtec turbo. He did this several years ago, it's still running. He runs a Federal-Mogul stand alone FMU, same as Papadankis and Kubo ran on their hondas. He put out so much HP, he needed to make sure all the fuel was being delivered to aviod staving the turbo. The injectors, fuel pump, and that FMU. They were all part of the equation, the FMU being the brain. Beilive me, he planned that motor out very well, and he was no "idiot" for running that FMU. So don't go and call people using FMU's idiots. Like I said, they serve their purpose, and are beifital to high HP/high bosst apps. As for don't listen to people who don't have turbos. Get a life. Just because my car isn't boosted don't make me ignorant. People may not have the $$ to put a turbo on at the current moment, but that don't mean they are ignorant. Myabe their old car was turbo, now they are trying n/a. Just cuz you don't run boost at this exact moment in time don't mean you don't know about turbo's and boost. It just means, simply, you don't currently have boost, whether it's cuz of fincanes or anohter reason. Don't make assumations like that. It just makes you out to sound like the igroant one. Also, he can't get a turbo for $2500 are you crazy? He can put his own kit toghter for $2500, so where you got that idea I do not know. My opinion, he should build his own kit. It will cost less, and He'll get way more bang for his buck. But if he doesn't want to put his own toghter, that doesn't make him an idiot for buying a pre-made kit. Just because it's not the choice we would make doesn't make it wrong for him to do.

[tran_nsx]

Originally Posted by eckoman_pdx

Okay, first off, no one in here today him he needed an FMU. Whtteg recommended a Hondata. And FMU's are for idiots? Not always my friend, don't go bashing things and saying they are for idiots. They serve their purpose. I know a guy with a 500WHP LS/Vtec turbo. He did this several years ago, it's still running. He runs a Federal-Mogul stand alone FMU, same as Papadankis and Kubo ran on their hondas. He put out so much HP, he needed to make sure all the fuel was being delivered to aviod staving the turbo. The injectors, fuel pump, and that FMU. They were all part of the equation, the FMU being the brain. Beilive me, he planned that motor out very well, and he was no "idiot" for running that FMU. So don't go and call people using FMU's idiots. Like I said, they serve their purpose, and are beifital to high HP/high bosst apps. As for don't listen to people who don't have turbos. Get a life. Just because my car isn't boosted don't make me ignorant. People may not have the $$ to put a turbo on at the current moment, but that don't mean they are ignorant. Myabe their old car was turbo, now they are trying n/a. Just cuz you don't run boost at this exact moment in time don't mean you don't know about turbo's and boost. It just means, simply, you don't currently have boost, whether it's cuz of fincanes or anohter reason. Don't make assumations like that. It just makes you out to sound like the igroant one. Also, he can't get a turbo for $2500 are you crazy? He can put his own kit toghter for $2500, so where you got that idea I do not know. My opinion, he should build his own kit. It will cost less, and He'll get way more bang for his buck. But if he doesn't want to put his own toghter, that doesn't make him an idiot for buying a pre-made kit. Just because it's not the choice we would make doesn't make it wrong for him to do.

come on u guys, can we all get along? i think all u guys have some good pointers so lets not look at the little bad details as an excuse to go bitch at each other. i do see what both billabong and eckoman is saying, and what i notice is the issue was going off topic little bit.

the topic was to get simpleazn's gsr to smoke sti's and stangs. what billabong is trying to point out is that the fmu is useless because the gsr doesn't need it. unless of course he's trying to achieve 500+ hp then thats a different story.

as far as trying to beat the sti, ur gonna need more then a regular turbo kit. like some of u guys know the gsr's safest boost is at 6 psi, while 8 psi on the other hand is risking it. with most kits, you'll be able to get about maybe 60-80 hp at 6 psi, add this sum to the stock power from the gsr and that will be around 260 hp. this is still short from the 300 hp if ur refering to the new sti, so the gsr might hang with it cause of the weight difference. my point, if u want to beat one, your gonna need to work on the internals to crank higher boost. these results are average for a regular kit and it could be different for a custom made kit.

now im not an expert on turbos but this should give a generalize description of whats gonna be needed to take on the subaru.

lastly, to be truthful i too would rather listen to someone who have a turbo kit for advice, who wouldn't. now their might be some guys with some knowledge on the subject like me for instance, but the best advice comes from people who actually installed a kit themselves. btw, speaking of people who have install turbo kits b4, hopefully there are some in here so they can help me with mine just in case i run into a problem.

[whtteg]

Originally Posted by tran_nsx

come on u guys, can we all get along? i think all u guys have some good pointers so lets not look at the little bad details as an excuse to go bitch at each other. i do see what both billabong and eckoman is saying, and what i notice is the issue was going off topic little bit.

the topic was to get simpleazn's gsr to smoke sti's and stangs. what billabong is trying to point out is that the fmu is useless because the gsr doesn't need it. unless of course he's trying to achieve 500+ hp then thats a different story.

as far as trying to beat the sti, ur gonna need more then a regular turbo kit. like some of u guys know the gsr's safest boost is at 6 psi, while 8 psi on the other hand is risking it. with most kits, you'll be able to get about maybe 60-80 hp at 6 psi, add this sum to the stock power from the gsr and that will be around 260 hp. this is still short from the 300 hp if ur refering to the new sti, so the gsr might hang with it cause of the weight difference. my point, if u want to beat one, your gonna need to work on the internals to crank higher boost. these results are average for a regular kit and it could be different for a custom made kit.

now im not an expert on turbos but this should give a generalize description of whats gonna be needed to take on the subaru.

lastly, to be truthful i too would rather listen to someone who have a turbo kit for advice, who wouldn't. now their might be some guys with some knowledge on the subject like me for instance, but the best advice comes from people who actually installed a kit themselves. btw, speaking of people who have install turbo kits b4, hopefully there are some in here so they can help me with mine just in case i run into a problem.

What billabong was tring to say about the FMU was that they suck!! It is a stupid way of suppling the extra fuel that is needed. All a FMU does is up the fuel pressure x amount of psi to each psi of boost. It does nothing with the duty cycle of the injectors. Increseing the fuel pressure is the wrong way of suppling the fuel you need to get larger injectors and change the duty cycle so that they stay opened longer to supply the extra fuel.

Hmm I seem to know what a FMU does and you may not judging by your comment about it, And I do not currently have a boosted car, so just because some ppl don't drive boosted cars does not mean they don't know what they are talking about.

[xsimpleaznx]

thanks for trying to stay on topic about beating the sti, so safety at 6psi aint gonna cut it huh? hmm so how much boost am i looking at to beat it, 12? 12psi will put me over 300whp? but isnt that a whole bunch of lag? what rpm am i gonna feel the big kick at?

[tran_nsx]

Originally Posted by whtteg

What billabong was tring to say about the FMU was that they suck!! It is a stupid way of suppling the extra fuel that is needed. All a FMU does is up the fuel pressure x amount of psi to each psi of boost. It does nothing with the duty cycle of the injectors. Increseing the fuel pressure is the wrong way of suppling the fuel you need to get larger injectors and change the duty cycle so that they stay opened longer to supply the extra fuel.

Hmm I seem to know what a FMU does and you may not judging by your comment about it, And I do not currently have a boosted car, so just because some ppl don't drive boosted cars does not mean they don't know what they are talking about.

dude squash the shit, im not here to argue about some dumb off the topic issue concerning an fmu. what i was doing was summarizing everything to 1-2 sentences so it was short and clear as possible then returning to what was important. the best person to ask what billabong was trying to say would be billabong himself. im not here at this site for the sole porpose of having flame wars, im here to get help and help whenever i can.

now going back to simpleazn, i ask this guy with a 93 gsr turbo when he feels the power? he said it kicks in at around 4500 rpm. whats cool too he said is that when on the freeway and wants to push it he doesn't have to downshift at all so thats awesome. i got a deal for u, since your intererested in kicking the sti's butt. the guy with 93 gsr is selling his turbo so if your interested let me know. he said its not a direct bolt on since it fit all integra's except 1st gen, so there gonna be a little work trying to install it. the good thing is with your year u can keep the a/c. here's what i know so far on the turbo he selling:

rev hard t3/t04e hybrid turbo
stage 2 turbo kit (120hp @7 psi)
less than 2000 miles driven /w turbo
basically brand new, he got it for almost 3 g's
willing to sell for a reasonable price, and yes he lives in the bay area

so this isn't the regular kit u see on sale via internet, it's better. now heres the down side. to get the most power from the turbo u have get it dynoed and tuned and this kit supposedly won't pass smog cause of the higher hp and tq. the guy's suggestion: when it comes time to smog replace the intercooler pipe that has the bov with a plain pipe and get the car tuned. after these two steps he said the car should easily pass.
i might be interested in getting it myself but i haven't fully prepared my car for the setup yet. also, i would rather have a new kit to make sure nothing was worn out, but again it only has only 2000 on it.

he's trying to sell it cause he's not interested in drivng fast anymore. at the same time he just bought a new lexus is300, u know the altezza and is looking for a house. to sum it up, racing is getting old for him. if anyone is interested let me know.

[tran_nsx]

oh another thing, he set the turbo at 8 psi and said the car runs fine even though it has 150000 miles. the guy was even thinking of pushing it even higher so that was some interesting info.

[eckoman_pdx]

Originally Posted by xsimpleaznx

thanks for trying to stay on topic about beating the sti, so safety at 6psi aint gonna cut it huh? hmm so how much boost am i looking at to beat it, 12? 12psi will put me over 300whp? but isnt that a whole bunch of lag? what rpm am i gonna feel the big kick at?

Okay, I'll take this since mister "please say on topic didn't, and went off topic himself." Jeez...Okay, 12psi should do around 300, that'll do it, but your gonna have to rebuild the internals of the GSR to get there (unless you wanna fry the motor). As for lag, that depends on the turbo itself. Whats the a/r housing size, etc. Some turbos that will produce 300whp will spool faster than others. Best advice is do your homework, some of the newer turbo designs spool much faster than some of the older ones. Yes, you'll have more lag than with oly 6psi, but you can minamize this by choosing the correct turbo. Remember, NOT ALL TURBOCHARGERS ARE CREATED EQAUL. Some will produce more lag at a give psi/hp level than others. Do your homewrk, and you will find one that suits you well.

[freekinfreak]

Also, he can't get a turbo for $2500 are you crazy?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33742

[freekinfreak]

Originally Posted by freekinfreak

Also, he can't get a turbo for $2500 are you crazy?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33742

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=33742

[pointblank69]

Gsr have to high of a combustion ratio there like 10:1 making them horriable to put a turbo in them. Ill tell ya my friend bought a gsr and i bought a rs he got a exhaust and a cold air intake new spark plugs and injectors, anyways he thought he was hot shit with the gsr cause it gives u boost at 5000rpm off a smaller cam gear, hes barly hittin 200 hp but hardly a upgrade. The rs i bought was stock 140 hp and i did everything he did plus i put in a skunk2 intake manifold and a drag turbo / intercooler my car hits around 280 hp its amazing ho much i spank the shit out of the big gsr. My point is u might of payed more for the gsr but u lost in the long run with the hp, the only thing i could say is try a small turbo and like 8 or 9 psi then hook up a co2 spray into the intake manifold and u could proubley be able to hit around 250 or so its all up to how much u want to spend or blow on ur car, me its worth seein my friend try to beat me each time with the same outcome everytime...

[eckoman_pdx]

To the guy who started this thread (I forgot your SN), excatly how much money are you willing to spend on a turbo and related engine build, in your effprt to beat the STI. Yes, the LS has a more sturdy block that can handle more boos;, yes, it has lower c/r pistons. As you stated in your first post, these are a few of the reasons the LS is a better suited motor to boost. However, you CAN boost a GSR, and to above 8 psi, you'll just have to do engine work. Any motor can be boosted, some like the LS, are just better suited for boost in relative stock condition than others. This is due to the stock internals. First, you'll want to put in some low c/r pistions. If your looking to boost the motor into the stratosphere, 8.8:1 is nice. Also (very important), close the deck, plain and simple. That will keep the cylinder walls from moving (and cracking) under high boost. Also, stronger rods are also good to do while your in there. My point is, since you already have the GSR and don't wanna dump it for the LS, don't worry. Build up the GSR internals to suit the desired boost level you have. Like I said, close the deck, low c/r pistons and stronger rods are a good start towards a motor that can handle higher boost. There's more you can do, but right there, that will help out signifcantly. Good Luck.

[xsimpleaznx]

if i went the turbo route, i wouldnt really want to spend more than say $2200 and i would want an intercooler with that. that amount of money is kind of hard for me to come by too so i doubt upgrading the internals is an option. beating the sti on a limited budget doesnt seem too realistic for me anymore, i can boost the gsr but without the internals i have to stay below 8psi to be safe. and thatll never beat an sti i assume. ive also been seeing a lot of people get pulled over at the weekend runs down in montague where i go, so im starting to consider getting the greddy turbo kit to stay street legal, i know that the greddy kit is the worst kit out there in terms of power but it would suck to spend money on a nice turbo then have to take it off because of the cops. but since i dont plan to upgrade the internals, the small turbo and low boost would work out well right?

currently my car is basically stock, injen cold air intake is about the only engine mod i have. i was considering just getting a dc header and rsr catback exhaust for now til i can better afford turbo later. ive been reading a lot that says nitrous is a cheap and fast upgrade, whtteg , i think i read some of ur post and u suggest wet system as opposed to dry. i almost bought a venom or zex kit forgot which one but i read that they blow the engine in a year. so if i decided on nitrous a single fogger wet system is best? i/h/e and nitrous will at least keep up with an sti right? also if i got the header, whats better for power, ceramic or stainless? ive heard that although the stainless looks better, it has more heat which is bad for power, its also more expensive, any info helps a lot, thanks.

[whtteg]

Well I do like the wet kits better because there is less chance of a lean mixture which will cause serious damage to the engine. Now for your car i would suggest a single nossle fogger if you plan on staing below 75-80 hp and direct port if you plan on 75-100 and if you want bigger and badder then NOS makes a plate kit for the B18C1 I think you can jet it down to 80 hp but it will go to around 200hp or so. But it being a dstock motor i would stay under 80. The key to a successful nitrous experience is tunning and self control. You need to learn how to tune your nitrous system, ie: reading plugs, adjusting fuel pressure, adjusting jets etc. And self control is not using it constantly, you need to use it for no linger than 15-20 secs, And believe me in 17 secs i can smoke past 120mph easily so ther is no reason for any longer. Also you need to give the motor time to cool down a bit after useing the N20, don't turn the motor off just drive it around or let it idle for a few mins, this will help cool it down, b/c nitrous causes alot more heat in the cylinders, and this is transvered to the coolant etc. Also change your oil regularly, the extra heat will speed the oil break down up.

[xsimpleaznx]

how does this look?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2442573532

either i might start slowly piecing together a custom kit or buy a used greddy kit to stay street legal. ive seen them go for about $1500 with intercooler, thats a pretty good deal right? in california, if you get pulled over with illegal parts, you have to take it off and go to the referee right? anybody know how much they fine you? and if you put it back on and get caught again, does the fine go up? ive read that a lot of people w/ drag kits are putting down like 270whp etc, thats enough to beat an sti right? but what about the street legality, isnt it kind of risky?

[xsimpleaznx]

oh yeah, another issue, with a turbo, will 91 octane gas be enough? california used to have 92 but i dont know what really happened to that. or am i going to have to constantly stock up on octane boosters and spend $40 a tank from now on?