'01 T&C - Battery killer?? Bad PCM/relay??

[RonMur]

2001 Town & Country LXi - 3.8

Twice within last month, have gone to crank the van in the middle of the day, and the battery is completely dead. No interior lights, no dash, no speedometer, nothing. The battery was replaced a week before the first time this happened, so first thought was a faulty battery. After my wife tryed to crank it the first time this happened, I opened the hood and could hear a light clicking coming from the PCM. I tried pulling the relays and determined it was the ASD relay. It continued clicking after I reinstalled it. I hooked up the battery charger to jump-start the van, and as soon as I flipped the switch, the clicking stopped. I took the van to Advance Auto (2 mile trip) to have them check the battery (that's where I got it). They said the battery was good, but the charge needed to be topped off. Had them check the charging system. They said there was a flutter in the voltage and that I might have a regulator going bad.

Now, a month later, wife went to crank the van, and the same thing. This time, I tested the battery before doing anything else (3.8 volts). Again, the ASD relay was clicking. I hooked up the charger and as soon as I flipped the switch, the ASD relay stopped clicking and I heard a louder click come from the PCM. After starting the van, I checked battery at idle and under load (headlights, blower, etc) (9.9 volts - steady - no dropoff at load). That would indicate the regulator is doing it's job.

Got home from work tonight, van dead again. Battery tested at 5.5 volts. Haven't tried testing amp draw at rest yet.

It seems that if it was an amp draw issue, I should've had battery problems more often between now and the first time it happened. But it's been a month since the first time.

Anyone have ideas/opinions??

Oh yeah, what exactly is the function of the ASD relay?

[ALcars]

Something is using ur battery, like a bulb that is on all the time or a relay is keeping plugged, you may need to check relay by relay and by closing the car and taking out the key check for a light that doesn't come off.

[RIP]

I would expect to see much higher alternator voltage output load or no load. What are you seeing with everything off. Should see at least 13 vdc checked at the battery terminals and engine running. > 14vdc is best. Clicking relays are common with a weak battery.

[earlyrizr]

+1 with RIP 9.9 volts running is way too low, not running with no acc. on you should have 12.5 volts. will advanced auto test just the alternator for you,to isolate components? No mention of the mileage but the alternator brushes do wear out and could cause intermittent contact,thus the fluctuations. Any dash warning lights lit? And is this why the battery was replaced in the beginning?

[hundahunta]

are you leaving a light on at times, do you have power seats and the seat covers and pressing the seat motor buttons, do you have something plugged into the cigarette lighter

[RonMur]

The 9.9 volts I referenced originally was testing immediately after I got the van started after the second occurrence. That is without charging the battery after the initial 3.8 volt reading.

I put a 10Amp charge on for about 16 hrs overnight. Tested and got a 13.9 volt reading this A.M. Drove it around today for a couple hours. After being parked in driveway for about 5 hrs, tested and got 12.5 volts. Cranked the engine, at idle no load, 13.9 volts. Turned on headlights, radio, blower, at idle, 13.9 volts.

Alternator was replaced 6 months ago, about 10K miles. No dash warning lights of any kind. Nothing is plugged into the cigarette lighters, switched or unswitched.

Only known electrical issues are 1) the passenger overhead maplight is malfunctioning (press the light to switch on and it will light but go out when you release pressure), 2) the driver's side sliding door will not open/close/latch on it's own (by interior or remote, don't know if it's a motor or latch issue), and 3) the rear liftgate will not open by switch or remote (you can hear the latch release and the warning beeps, but does not lift majority of the time. Dealer checked when I had van in for some service last year and they said they couldn't get it to fail). I could see where some of this might drain a little on the battery, but I would think it wouldn't be enough to kill it completely to where the odometer didn't even illuminate when opening the door.

Haven't had a chance to test for amp draw at rest yet.

[RIP]

Yup, looks like the charging system is ok. Keep verifying. Now looks like a parasitic drain as hundahunta was leading to. Your amp draw check should reveal it. Here's some tips on how to do it: http://free-auto-repair-advice.blogs...attery%20drain Scroll to third entry.

[RonMur]

According to the Haynes manual, I should have a fuse panel under the left side of the dash. Took the steering column cover and the knee reinforcement out, and no fuse panel in sight. Don't know how I'm supposed to pull fuses for an amp draw test when I can't find the fuses to pull. None of the fuses in the IPM under the hood made a difference when they were pulled. Now what??

[RIP]

If yours is like the unlabeled picture I'm looking at, it's behind the drivers side kick panel under a long rectangular cover. What current draw are you seeing?

[RonMur]

I didn't see any kind of cover to remove from the kick panel. If it's there, I'll probably have to remove the entire kick panel. As for the draw, I'm not quite sure on the reading. With the meter set to DC mA, it displays .17 - is that 17 mA, 170 mA, ?? Either way, it never changed when pulling fuses or relays in the IPM.

Wife's out-of-town in the van at the moment. I'll have to wait for her return before I can look at the kick panel.

Thanks for the info.

[hundahunta]

17 mA is good....

[Cntrysthbst]

I had an 01 T&C limited do this and it was the PCM. the pcm controls all the voltage issues you are having..and it was clicking too..i dont think mine ever put off a code either..possible? i think only the dealer can verify that. if you find it is the pcm remember to make sure they put the right one in..some 2001 models have pcms that are updatable and some dont. definately ask and get a detailed explaination on which one..this is only for 2001 models years..all 2002 and up are updatable.

[RonMur]

The PCM is my first thought also. Advance Auto's test supposedly showed a flutter in the charging system, which could possibly be attributed to the voltage regulator, which is incorporated in the PCM.

But the drainage/dead battery hasn't happened in over 3 weeks. It even started with no problem today during the snow here in Atlanta. So the battery had to have decent CCA's.

Still haven't found a voltage drain in my limited time trying. And I'm kinda waiting on warmer weather to start disassembling the interior to get at what electrical issues I know of (rear hatch, left sliding door latch/lock, and passenger overhead courtesy light). And the alarm going off randomly when the van is locked by remote, I have no clue where that's triggered. Hoping the door/hatch lock issues might be the cause. Won't know until I get those remedied.