$2000 budget for 2007

[scottsee]

If nothing brakes I know I will see high 11's with my current setup. I only had one chance to goto the track with what I have right now, and couldn't get the boost over 21psi netting me a 12.4 on a shitty tune without using NLTS. When I mean shitty, I mean 220deg coolant temps, 7deg raw knock, 13deg t-advance, 11.5 AFR, -20deg washer fluid, pump gas.

My goal is to squeeze as close to 30psi on race gas out of this Evo316g as humanly passable. I have already bought some ARP's & Cometic gasket. I need to get some 272 style cams, new lifters (new cams require them) and a 2600 style clutch from somewhere. That totals up to around $1150, leaving a little bit left over to ponder "what's going to help the most?"

I've had the conversation about 1g head this, 6bolt bottom end that, 400whp snaps 2g rods here, smaller intake ports on the 2g their. I'm just not interested in putting a 1g head or 6bolt on this pos, and wont be doing so until it self destructs. Even If I am taking the head off to put ARP's I don't feel like spending the $$ to put find/clean/machine and install a 1g head/intake/tb. That said...

While the 2g head is off getting a new H/G and ARP's should I tap the intake runners and install a 50shot ZEX direct port nitrous setup, or spend the extra $$ on a TEIN basic coil over setup.

PS. Meth injection & Nitrous is a good thing.... I've been doing a good bit of reading up on the Domestic forums about it..

[Blackcrow64]

I would go the meth route as it seems to be the best power for the money. It will also allow you to run a lot more boost on pump gas.

[scottsee]

I have meth injection already.

[Thor06]

Ha ha, hes already running meth injection, hes talking about adding a 50 shot of nitrous to that.

I would say yes, that would be sweet. I wouldn't take it farther than that on stock shit though, not unless you dont care if you blow shit up. I would get jets for like a 30, 50, and 75 shot and tune from the 30 to the 50 to the 75 should you want that much. From my research, ZEX and NX seem to be the cheapest kits while NOS and Venom seem to be more pricy.

I think eventually I will be running some nitrous eventually. My plans are (there will be a thread on this later) performance stuff, interior, suspension, then respray the outside, then that other stuff like N20.

[Blackcrow64]

Originally Posted by scottsee

I have meth injection already.

Oh, my bad. I didn't realize you were already running it... Well sure then the next step would be to throw some nitrous in there I guess. lol

[defiancy]

New springs with new cams as well


And my vote is for the nitrous. My friend has the ZEX Kit on his car and it's good stuff.

[scottsee]

Well cams for sure. I never plan on shifting at 8000 or higher. No point with stock 2g intake/3vo316g. 7500 is about max.. I'll be fine with stock springs/retainers.. I'm not sure how much power this engine will take, I'm thinking it will handle a 50shot.

[Thor06]

As long as you got 'er tuned good enough to where it doesnt eat itself from knock and the hp is around or below 400 I would think she'd hold up a while. I would worry about those 2g rods at 400 hp though...

[defiancy]

Originally Posted by scottsee

Well cams for sure. I never plan on shifting at 8000 or higher. No point with stock 2g intake/3vo316g. 7500 is about max.. I'll be fine with stock springs/retainers.. I'm not sure how much power this engine will take, I'm thinking it will handle a 50shot.

The way it was explained to me by the shop I use to do all my performance stuff is like this. I always pick these guys brains and I find that they know their stuff.

The springs on your head are only meant to compress so far, after they are compressed to their limit they can no longer compress anymore. They are designed to be used with the stock cams. When you add on aftermarket cams the springs can only compress so far, and with the bigger lope you are going to want springs that will compress biased on the lope of the cam you are using.

IE: The aftermarket cam isn't going to be doing it's job as well as it could with the stock springs since it can only compress the spring as far as the stock spring will let it, if you buy different springs than it allows the cams to have a full range of motion and the spring to be compressed and effective with the aftermarket cams.

Now when I talked to the guy he was spitting out the measurements on the travel of the springs and etc. But I don't have a photographic memory so I can't recite any of that.

This is just what I remember from that conversation.

[Thor06]

Well, the springs can go past the added lobe, if they physically couldnt go past the lobe, the cam wouldnt turn, atleast not without a big explosion.

The 4g63 (6 bolt anyway) is pretty overengineered, just look at the rods. I have heard many numbers as for what their HP range is, but 500 is the lowest I heard with the most rating them to 650 hp. I dont think springs are much different. I have exchanged PM's on the spring topic with Kevin several times. I dont know about the 7 bolt springs, but I he only used all stock head parts (except the cams of course) in his DSM. He had 272's and revved out to 8500rpms at the track regularly. Though he did say he replaced them occasionally (during rebuilds IIRC), he never had one break. From what I have gathered, you want stiffer springs to keep the rocker arm firm on the lobe of the cam. Not having stiff enough springs on aggressive enough lobes at high enough RPMs will lead to valve float (when the valve stay open even when they arent being pushed by the cam). read a review on Crower springs, they turned out to be only like 3% stiffer than stockers so IMO, if you want to go aftermarket you might as well go hard core and get dual springs. Otherwise, I think, new OEMs will do you fine.

I think the reason the stockers get a bad rep is because people use springs with a shit ton of miles on them and wonder why the higher revs and extra lift is breaking their springs. I bet head to head, new OEM springs vs. new crowers on 272's or FP2's will be no different. Bottom line is old springs are old springs, brand name or OEM they will reach a breaking point.

Thats just my opinion from what I have gathered.

[defiancy]

Originally Posted by Thor06

Well, the springs can go past the added lobe, if they physically couldnt go past the lobe, the cam wouldnt turn, atleast not without a big explosion.

The 4g63 (6 bolt anyway) is pretty overengineered, just look at the rods. I have heard many numbers as for what their HP range is, but 500 is the lowest I heard with the most rating them to 650 hp. I dont think springs are much different. I have exchanged PM's on the spring topic with Kevin several times. I dont know about the 7 bolt springs, but I he only used all stock head parts (except the cams of course) in his DSM. He had 272's and revved out to 8500rpms at the track regularly. Though he did say he replaced them occasionally (during rebuilds IIRC), he never had one break. From what I have gathered, you want stiffer springs to keep the rocker arm firm on the lobe of the cam. Not having stiff enough springs on aggressive enough lobes at high enough RPMs will lead to valve float (when the valve stay open even when they arent being pushed by the cam). read a review on Crower springs, they turned out to be only like 3% stiffer than stockers so IMO, if you want to go aftermarket you might as well go hard core and get dual springs. Otherwise, I think, new OEMs will do you fine.

I think the reason the stockers get a bad rep is because people use springs with a shit ton of miles on them and wonder why the higher revs and extra lift is breaking their springs. I bet head to head, new OEM springs vs. new crowers on 272's or FP2's will be no different. Bottom line is old springs are old springs, brand name or OEM they will reach a breaking point.

Thats just my opinion from what I have gathered.

I am by no means an expert in this field. I was just saying what the shop told me about the stock springs.


And when I think about it it makes sense for you to have to change the springs for different cams.

But I do agree with you Mitsu stuff is way overengineered

[Thor06]

Originally Posted by defiancy

I am by no means an expert in this field.

Me either . I'm sorry if I came across angry or assholish, if I did it wasnt intended. I just wanted to put my research and observations out there too, let the reader decide for themselves.

I also forgot to say that its very possible that my rebuild is going to get new Crower springs, it just depends on the prices of them and stockers and how well my current stockers and my used set of Crowers (got with my spare head) check out.