3.8L Timing Cover Removal

[Ed_Strong]

Our 2000 3.8L developed a leak around the upper left corner (right between the Steering Pump and Y Pipe Tube inlet to the Water Pump) about where the Timing Cover and Water Pump meets with the #1 Cylinder Head and Intake Manifold!

The leak got really bad and now water gushes out even without the engine running. So I priced all the parts needed and went to read the Haines Manual on the repair procedure to become familiar with the process. But the manual warns about the engine having to be taken out of the vehicle to be able to remove the timing cover!

Has anybody been able to get the cover removed with the engine in place?

I don't have the money to pay a mechanic to do the repair and the van cannot be driven any longer, so any help would be greatly appreciated... thank you in advance.

[kevink1955]

Just did mine on my 96 about a month ago. It does not require removal of the engine, You do have to remove the front engine mount nut and jack the engine up about 2 inches.

You have to double nut the studs that go thru the cover into the block and unscrew them from the block so you can remove them while they remain in the cover. Do not forget to put them back in the cover on reinstallation as 3 of the 5 cannot be installed later. 1 of my studs was frozen to the cover and several soaks with penatrating oil and heat inbetween I was finaly able to rock it about 1/4 turn, after 1/2hr of rocking I was able to turn it a full turn and remove it.

Only other tough thing is removing tha crank shaft balancer, when you try to remove the bolt the engine turns. I braced a breaker bar on the frame and bumped the starter, the engine turns in the direction needed to break the bolt loose. Just be carefull that the bar does not fly off and hit you or anything else. You will then need a puller to pull the balancer off the end of the crankshaft, make sure it is the type that pulls from the pulley bolts and not the jaw type that pulls the outside of the balancer or you will break the balancer.

I would recomend that you remove the balancer as the first thing you do then mark the position of the cam syncro rotor and body so you can put it back with the proper timing. Do NOT turn the engine after you mark the syncro or you will have trouble geting it back in time.

Everything else is just nuts and bolts but I would think about replacing the water pump while I was in there.

Took me about 7hrs to do but I was in no rush to get it done.

[12Ounce]

I'm facing the same task...have a small coolant leak somewhere on the front cover. I've done the task before ... a real knuckle buster! This time I may lower the subframe on 4x4's and move it as far as it will to the left to get more wrench room.

[Ed_Strong]

That sounds like a really good idea on the studs kevink1955... but now there are also significant changes from a '96 to a ''00 model both with engine and body. So I don't know if that's the only issue I will encounter if I try the repair my self.

Did you have to remove the water pump from the timing cover or does it all come out as one?
On the crank shaft balancer the Haines manual suggests removing the starter motor and jamming the fly wheel with a flat lever or screw driver

I can't remeber if the manual says that the cam syncro rotor has to be removed or not!

Did you have to remove and replace the Oil Pan Gasket as well?

[Ed_Strong]

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

I'm facing the same task...have a small coolant leak somewhere on the front cover. I've done the task before ... a real knuckle buster! This time I may lower the subframe on 4x4's and move it as far as it will to the left to get more wrench room.

That's how mine started... When I went to trace it it dissapeared, no trace of it, so I kept running it and adding water every few weeks. Then it came back and seemed to be the water pump.

Upon closer inpection it looked to be the rubber seal on the "Y" Pipe so I replaced it but leak continued. Scratching my head i did a pressure test and could not figure where the water was leaking from!

That's when I stumbled on the gasket defect on the timing cover, so don't wait till it gets worse. If I would have figured it out sooner i would've tried a stop leak product and called it a day! I don't plan on holding on to mine any longer, just needed it to hold on a little bit more!

[kevink1955]

Not sure what changed from 96 to 2000 but the 96 manual also says to remove the engine.

I pulled the cover with the water pump attatched.

The syncro is in the top of the cover on all 3.8's I have seen so it has to come out, it is driven off a sprial gear on the front of the cam and also drives the oil pump.There is no way you could put it back and keep it in time.

I had no problem using the starter to bump the bolt loose

The oil pan gasket I purchased (fel pro) included a tube of black silicone to seal the cover to the pan, the pan gasket does not extend under the cover it only has silicone at the front. There are 2 bolts thru the pan into the cover that need to be removed.

Loosen the water pump pulley bolts before you take the belt off, the belt will keep the pulley from turning. The pulley will not come off on the 96 as it hits the frame but comes right off after you jack the engine up a few inches

[Ed_Strong]

thanks again... it does sound like the same procedure regardless of year model. I gotta find a place that would loan me the puller for the crank pulley. I'm also replacing the Water Pump to save me a headache down the road if the old water pump decides to break right after everything is put together. I hate having to spend the extra $80-$100 dollars but thats the price for peace of mind I guess!

I have a cheap 12V impact wrench that may or may not remove the crank pulley bolt, depends on the torque value! It does remove the nuts on the wheels which are always set at a 100 pounds.

The problem I have using the starter to bump the bolt loose is that I may not be able to mark the pulley and syncro for re-assembly later... how did you get around that?

Also, how did you manage with the Power Steering Pump and hardware? mine is right above the belt tensioner on top of the engine, don't know if your is the same!

[12Ounce]

I would not sleep well if I planned to use the starter motor to loosen the crank bolt. Sounds like a way to hurt somebody or something. And I also never use a chain wrench, or the like, on the aux belt pulley surface. IIRC, my '99 has a hole, a "spoke-hole", that allowed me to stick a rod thru ... preventing the crank from turning as I loosened the bolt.

Or ... and I just did this on a Volvo 2.5T... find TDC-compression stoke on some convenient cyl (I would choose #4 on this engine), turn the crank back (or forward, CCW or CW ... depends if you are loosening or tightening.) a quarter rev. And then stuff the top of the cyl with braided cord that is small enought to fit down through the spark hole. Pack the cord in place. A plastic soda straw will help you place the cord down against the piston. Feed the cord down thru the straw. On the Volvo engine I stuffed in over 25 feet of new 1/4" braided cord that I bought at Home Depot. Really pack the cyl full of cord. The cord will cushion and stop the piston as you loosen, or tighten, the crank bolt. And this is a safe process as long as the cord is packed in very tight.

I have never needed a puller to remove a crank pulley. A little WD-40 maybe, and then just hand-force. But my luck may run out on the next engine ... who knows!

[kevink1955]

I would not use an impact on the balancer bolt, the outer ring of the balancer is mounted in rubber and the impact may cause the rubber to slip. I damaged an oldsmobile 3.8 balancer that way.

On my 96 the tensioner is at the rear of the engine and the PS pump is top front. Some have said you need to pull the PS pulley (a special puller required) to access the mounting bolts. I was able to remove the bolts with the pulley still on the pump, it was slow going as in 1/8 turn flip the wrench 1/8 turn flip again.

As far as keeping the syncro in time, if you pull the balancer first you will not turn the engine again during the rest of the process then mark and pull the syncro. In reassembly first install the syncro with your marks lined up then reinstall the balancer. Removing the balancer was the only time I had to turn the engine.

Yes the bar and bump the starter is scarey but if you have a remote start switch and go directly to the solinoid you can take it in very small bumps.

Do not try to use the timing teeth on the balancer to stop it from rotating, they are soft and if you deform 1 you will have problems

[12Ounce]

Originally Posted by kevink1955

....I would not use an impact on the balancer bolt.....

Me neither! In fact, I don't use an impact on anything ... don't own one. Does one use the starter motor to also tighten the crank bolt? (That would be a trick.)

After one uses the rope-a-dope method, I believe it becomes the method of choice. Allows one to use a bar and socket to loosen the bolt, and a torque wrench to tighten. (Of course, if one happens to have the oil pan off ... a block of wood, or a wooden hammer handle, up against a crank throw ... will allow one to turn the bolt at will.)

I never trust an synchronizer to have been positioned properly. The plastic locating guide-tool can be purchased for less than $10 ... using it, you know the sync is positioned correctly.

About the harmonic balancer portion of the crank pulley ... that part mounted in rubber. It does fail over time, especially if exposed to a lot of oil. If one has a very high mileage engine ...or one that has seen a rough life, you might consider replacing the crank pulley. Its a bit pricey, but it does not last forever. I have already purchased one for replacement on my 345k mile engine.

[kevink1955]

If you mark the syncro body and timing cover with a punch mark on each and make good notes of the rotor position it can be done. if it goes back 1 tooth off the rotor will be almost 3/8" off and easy to see it's not where it belongs.

This is assuming that you do not turn the engine and is why I pull the balancer first and reinstall the balancer after I reinstall the syncro, it can be done if your carefull. I have done it twice with no problems at all.

[Ed_Strong]

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

I never trust an synchronizer to have been positioned properly. The plastic locating guide-tool can be purchased for less than $10 ... using it, you know the sync is positioned correctly.

About the harmonic balancer portion of the crank pulley ... that part mounted in rubber. It does fail over time, especially if exposed to a lot of oil. If one has a very high mileage engine ...or one that has seen a rough life, you might consider replacing the crank pulley. Its a bit pricey, but it does not last forever. I have already purchased one for replacement on my 345k mile engine.

Do you have a link for the plastic locating guide-tool for the syncro?

Also my crank pulley was already replaced a few years back and you're right, it is pricey!

Really good points guys...
I'm getting ready to get all the parts I need to get started... I may start doing a partial teardown to save me some time for re-assembly next weekend.

My biggest fear is actually breaking a timing cover stud during removal, that would mess up my day big time..! Which reminds me to ask, how many nuts and what size nuts do I need to double up on the studs?

[kevink1955]

I just used 1 of the nuts I took off 1 of the studs to double nut the others, the stud that was frozen in the cover was so tight that the double nuts striped the end of the stud. I forced a 5/16 USS nut on as the last nut and using alternating heat and penertrating oil I was able to rock it loose.

Had to go to ford for the new studs and that was another ordeal, the original dealer told me he did not have them so I hit 2 other dealers. They did not have them but their computers said the original dealer I went to had 12 of them so back to the original dealer who it turns out was looking up the wrong part. He had them in a package of 4 so I reused 1 of the original ones, other than the one that broke they could have all been reused.

When reinstalling the studs some of them go into the water jacket and require sealer, the new studs had some red sealer already on them on the reused one I used #2 permatex

[Ed_Strong]

hmmm... scary stuff...!

[scubacat]

Ford's "official" service procedure