What will happen when the lower intake manifold leaks coolant?

[lidation]

I found out that my lower intake manifold is leaking a bit of coolant outside the engine. I saw a small reservoir (a few ml) of coolant next to the low intake manifold every time I shut down the car. So I guess my '98 Windstar 3.8L GL (80k) has the same infamous problem as many of you guys.

However, my car drives fine now. No stuttering, no misfire, no rough idle, no loss of power and on the highway it gets 26MPG. And the coolant leak rate is not that great. After driving it for 3 weeks and 1000 miles, the coolant expansion tank level was down only a quarter of an inch.

So my question is: what will happen if I continue to drive it, ignoring this problem?

[12Ounce]

The risk is further gasket failure, allowing coolant to get into the short block ... and causing a lubrication failure.

[busboy4]

Hi

I do not hesitate to recommend http://www.blackstone-labs.com/ to test your oil. If you do not have any coolant in the oil, press on if you desire. For what it is worth, the lower gasket job is not that big a job if you have some experience and some time.

Good luck

[lidation]

Originally Posted by busboy4

Hi

I do not hesitate to recommend http://www.blackstone-labs.com/ to test your oil. If you do not have any coolant in the oil, press on if you desire. For what it is worth, the lower gasket job is not that big a job if you have some experience and some time.

Good luck

Thanks for the recommendation! $20 for an oil analysis is very affordable.

You said the lower intake gasket is not a a big job, so usually how many hours does it take? You seem to need to take the fuel rail off and there are a bunch of screws that are close the firewall and hard to reach. So how much a PITA this job is?

My experience is that I have worked a lot on my other car, I have overhauled its cooling system, radiator, waterpump, thermostat, clutch fan etc. I have overhauled the whole suspension system, springs, shocks, control arms, control arm bushings, trailing arm bushings, sway bars. So I guess I am an OK home mechanic.

[garync1]

Seems like from what you listed you may be able too handle the job. The time it takes you to remove parts is up to you. With regular tools it could take you about a good days work or less.. I have air tools so sometimes I remove more to get into what I am working on better..

[busboy4]

Hi Again

As the previous poster suggested, you would have no trouble with the job. I personally always take off the cowl on a job like this. I can have mine off now in under 10 minutes and it just makes the job easier. I "break" bolts with a 1/4 or 3/8 drive bar, and then zip them out with my drill driver. As I recall on the lower manifold job, almost all the bolts to get down to the gaskets are 8mm so you are not constantly changing sockets. You do have to drain the coolant, and yes the injectors come out, but, those are easy. You just remove the nuts retaining the rail (4 I think), wiggle each injector loose and lift the whole thing. I used a bungee cord and just hung the whole rail from the underside of the hood, therefore I did not open any fuel lines.

You can get step by step info on autozone.com under repair info, plus there are several posts on the how to's and best of all, photo recon on Wiswind's site http://community.webshots.com/album/201931518cScpNK

Start with the oil check. The Blackstone folks are very nice. The tech that ran my test called me personally with the results, plus sent an email and a snail mail. It will help you make an informed decision.

[lidation]

Whow! Thanks for the reply! I love this forum!

I just read the write-up in autozone's "repair info". It says that you have to take off the upper intake manifold, and the valve cover to gain access to the lower intake manifold. Is it right? Then I also have to replace the upper intake manifold gasket and the valve cover gasket in the process?

[12Ounce]

There is an updated valve cover that is offered ... but not really needed. I don't believe the cover has to come off to make the lower manifold more accessible.

Be sure to use RTV on the "joints" of the lower gasket set. You'll know what I mean once you're in there. Remember all those bolts only require 7 - 8 ftlb of torque ... not much ... easy to snap them off.

I agree with removing the cowling. Look in Haynes (chap 13 ???) to see how.

[busboy4]

Originally Posted by lidation

Whow! Thanks for the reply! I love this forum!

I just read the write-up in autozone's "repair info". It says that you have to take off the upper intake manifold, and the valve cover to gain access to the lower intake manifold. Is it right? Then I also have to replace the upper intake manifold gasket and the valve cover gasket in the process?

HI
my experience is with the '96 - but you should not have to worry about the valve covers. You should not need to pull them off. Obviously the upper manifold needs to come off which necessitates unhooking the throttle linkage, air intake system(s) and related electrical and vacuum, the fuel injector rail, then the coolant lines into/out of the lower manifold, then the manifold bolts. The majority of the job for me was cleaning the intake(s) when they were off. I did a lot of scraping and vacuuming carbon buildup, as well as went through about six cans of carb cleaner. As to the gaskets - you can choose to not replace the uppers (6), but of course the lowers are a must. Buy them from Ford period. However, Ford will sell you a set (which I bought) that includes the lower gaskets, 6 upper gaskets, a throttle body gasket and an IAC gasket and costs little more than the lowers alone if purchased separately.

If you choose to dive in, let us know and I'll give you a few more specifics. Be sure and search the forum too on lower manifold gaskets. Wiswind has posted some excellent info on his job and I detailed mine as well.

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...lower+manifold

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...ht=head+gasket

[lidation]

A full day of work! so it should take 6-8 hours from start to finish? I can't do it these days. Too busy. I bought this van 'cause I am rebuilding my other car that I crashed a while ago. I guess I at least need to wait a couple of months before I start this job. Hope it will hold that long. Thanks for the info guys.

[wiswind]

I have mentioned in a couple of other threads.....while you have those fuel injectors out....spray some carb cleaner up inside the end cap.....at the spray end......I have seen junk build up in there......and it will flush right out with a squirt of the carb cleaner. No need to worry about them otherwise.

[lidation]

Originally Posted by wiswind

I have mentioned in a couple of other threads.....while you have those fuel injectors out....spray some carb cleaner up inside the end cap.....at the spray end......I have seen junk build up in there......and it will flush right out with a squirt of the carb cleaner. No need to worry about them otherwise.

Thanks for the advice. That is the reason I usually don't want a mechanic to touch any of my cars. Not that they are not good enough, but they are usually not that meticulous about your care as you do. I hope I could get my other car done so that I can pull my van into the garage to do this, maybe couple of hours a day to get this thing done.

[daveck2]

For those of you with this same problem, don't forget to check the coolant crossover pipe on the 3.8 that runs under the Intake manifold has a defect that will cause it to leak at a given point (after warranty). My pipe looked brand new but had a pinhole leak that would have never been found had I not run the engine and luckily saw a small stream coming out from under the upper intake plenum.

The other pipe that this connects to which tees off into the water pump and to the firewall hoses sprung a similar leak exactly one month later.

The pipe with the yellow tape is the new replacement. $30 bucks, $60 for the one under the intake! Beware, this one has a bolt on the rear of the PS pump and connects to a firewall heater hose T and to the hose that runs under the Intake. I wish I would have known about this problem when I replaced the Isolator bolts about a year ago.

Picture can be seen at following link: Pinhole leak:
http://picasaweb.google.com/EckFamil...01800148136290

Location of other pipe: Pipe has yellow sticker attached
http://picasaweb.google.com/EckFamil...01804443103602

This is a picture of the pipe that runs under the intake, the shiny new one in the center of the pic:
http://picasaweb.google.com/EckFamil...01813033038226

This could save you from having to replace the entire lower intake and gaskets

[alofile]

Make sure it is external leaking only and it is leaking from the lower intake not from the head gasket.

[wiswind]

I replaced that cross-over pipe while I was doing the lower intake manifold gasket job.

A real good cleaning up of the lower intake manifold, including the EGR ports is a very good idea.

Also, TAKE YOUR TIME, and be super careful with the IMRC actuators.

Make SURE to change the engine oil BEFORE starting the engine following this repair.....as you will have a lot of coolant in the oil pan.