93 Spirit 2.5L slight knock

[parkavenuechrome]

My friend gave me his 93 spirit which is in good shape for having 131K on it. I immediatly changed the timing belt after having suffered from other cars with bad belts and blown heads before, in which this car has had a head replacement already due to a belt breaking, and it ran great and still runs great after about 500 Miles on the belt. It has gotten much colder up on the NE and now It has a knock on accelleration which is didn't have before. I just did a full on tune-up and all is good. Car has power, and runs clean. It seemed to start after I changed my oil and added 10W30. Oil was dirty, and new oil seems dirty already. I added some Rislone with no help. Oil pressure seems strong and don't think its an issue.. I adjusted the timing, does it in any setting. I know these dodge motors have that slight knock to them, but is there any fixes besides a crank bearing job to alleaviate this? I added some higher octane fuel, seems to help but its still there.. Also My reverse light don't work.. They worked once in a while when he had it, now they just don't work at all. I know it has a reverse light switch on the trans. Is that most likely the issue? Any help is great! thanks!!

[DaYtOnAt2]

First of all I don't see the need to replace a head if the timing belt breaks... these are a non-interference head engine. But whatever... The knock problem could be and seems likely to be a cam timing issue. If Higher octance fuel helped it out then it could be spark knock(detonation). Is this a turbo engine btw? Recheck your timing gear alignment (all gears, not just cam) and use the proper tool to set the tension on the belt. Also If you noticed this started after an oil change to 10w30, try switching back to 5w30, as it may also be the hyd.lash adjusters being noisy. I've heard of people replacing a head and/or rebuilding engines because of the noise they make. Do these couple quick things and see if it helps. I suggest not driving too much until you get it figured out.

[parkavenuechrome]

Originally Posted by DaYtOnAt2

First of all I don't see the need to replace a head if the timing belt breaks... these are a non-interference head engine. But whatever... The knock problem could be and seems likely to be a cam timing issue. If Higher octance fuel helped it out then it could be spark knock(detonation). Is this a turbo engine btw? Recheck your timing gear alignment (all gears, not just cam) and use the proper tool to set the tension on the belt. Also If you noticed this started after an oil change to 10w30, try switching back to 5w30, as it may also be the hyd.lash adjusters being noisy. I've heard of people replacing a head and/or rebuilding engines because of the noise they make. Do these couple quick things and see if it helps. I suggest not driving too much until you get it figured out.

Well Today new issue, oil gauge dropped to almost zero and it was knocking, with the rpm's rising the oil pressure got back to normal, but it drops when it heats up.. So i think I need an oil pump.. At the very least I am changing it so i don't have to worry.. When the car is cold it holds oil pressure and doesn't knock at all. So Thin oil with a bad pump is what its looking like to me..

[parkavenuechrome]

Well, I changed out the Oil Pump today, Much much better... looks like it was majorly shot plus it was noisy and rough as hell to spin my hand..

[KManiac]

Its a good thing that you found your problem and quickly, too. I feel sorry for the previous owner who was suckered into replacing the head after the timing belt broke. There are no interference issues between the valves and the pistons on a 2.5 liter Chrysler 4 cylinder. The timing belt in my 1991 Shadow 2.5 Turbo shredded it's teeth last year while moving along at 65 mph on the freeway. I put in a new belt and all has been well since.

[DaYtOnAt2]

Originally Posted by parkavenuechrome

Well, I changed out the Oil Pump today, Much much better... looks like it was majorly shot plus it was noisy and rough as hell to spin my hand..

How did the drive gear look?

[neon_rt]

On these cars,it is a good idea to change the head gasket and head bolts on the first timing belt change. After that, only the timing belt. The 2.2/2.5l engine like to blow their head gasket at about 100K miles (like clockwork). I've had 3 of them.

[KManiac]

I understand now that 2.2 & 2.5 engines have a problem with blowing head gaskets at 100,000 miles. Why does this occur? Cheap head bolts? Inferior gaskets? Also, what are the symtoms of this engine's imminent head gasket failure? How hard are these to repair yourself?

I have a 1991 2.5 Turbo with just under 113,000 miles on original head gasket. This information would be helpful.

[DaYtOnAt2]

Originally Posted by KManiac

I understand now that 2.2 & 2.5 engines have a problem with blowing head gaskets at 100,000 miles. Why does this occur? Cheap head bolts? Inferior gaskets? Also, what are the symtoms of this engine's imminent head gasket failure? How hard are these to repair yourself?

I have a 1991 2.5 Turbo with just under 113,000 miles on original head gasket. This information would be helpful.

They are simple as long as you take the proper steps when doing them. My advise: Once you get the valve cover off, pull the A/C bracket, fuel lines, vac lines, wiring, then the downpipe bolts and the head bolts. Pull the head, manifolds and turbo as a unit. It's heavy this way but can be done if you can lift 60 pounds. (May be impossible to do any other way, don't know never tried) Also remove the cam gear while the belt is still on it. Attach a bungee strap securely to the hood or some other support that prevents the belt from coming off/slipping. Re-timing these engines can be a bear if you've never done it before, and is easier to screw up than get right. Use only a new mopar gasket, replace the head bolts, VC gasket, exhaust donut and bolts, and it is actually advised to have the head checked for warpage. Normal boost applications seem to be fine without milling. Felpro head gaskets WILL FAIL. -J

[parkavenuechrome]

The gear looked ok, however the internal of the pump was strashed, it seemed to be the the pump impeller was granding away at the casing causing it to shift around in the housing. Obviously bearing failure of the oil pump.. Car still has it knock at idle however oil pressure is constant now, so i figure probably bearing damage already occured especially with 130K. would a bad head gasket cause the motor to knock in these cars? it had the head replaced or rebiult around 100K anyways so it should be ok right?

[DaYtOnAt2]

Originally Posted by parkavenuechrome

The gear looked ok, however the internal of the pump was strashed, it seemed to be the the pump impeller was granding away at the casing causing it to shift around in the housing. Obviously bearing failure of the oil pump.. Car still has it knock at idle however oil pressure is constant now, so i figure probably bearing damage already occured especially with 130K. would a bad head gasket cause the motor to knock in these cars? it had the head replaced or rebiult around 100K anyways so it should be ok right?

Flip the coin... It only takes one good overheat to warp a head. No, a bad/blown HG won't cause a knock. It is possible however that the lash adjusters (lifters) are worn out now due to oil starving, and can't stay "pumped up" at idle oil pressures. (5-10psi) Of all the things to check, I'd start here. All it takes is the pressure from your finger to tell if they're bad or not. If they're spongy replace them, If they stay firm then they're good. Could also be wristpin to rod/ or piston excessive clearance. Piston slap was common with these engines as well.