engine idles rough with black smoke.

[rodeee]

1989 chrysler 2.5 liter turbo with 4 port fuel injection.
engine idles poorly w/ black smoke, runs fine at or above 2500 rpm.
will not get higher than approx. 3500 rpm, stalls at that point when put into drive. In addition when more pedal is applied at 3500 rpm the engine bogs down like its too lean.
Replaced:
1. MAP sensor
2. throttle position sensor
3. oygen sensor
4. disconnected the EGR Valve
5. checked distributor and plugs (did not check timing)
6. replaced fuel pressure regulator
7. checked for blockage of airway
8. replaced main computer

If anyone can help, please email at [email protected]
Im desperate now as my backup vehicle is on the way out.
Thanx Rodeee

[Racincc85]

are you getting a check engine light?

[rodeee]

Originally Posted by Racincc85

are you getting a check engine light?

Yes, check engine has been there all along. The new computer I put in senses a problem like the the one I needlessly replaced. I already know a problem exists and the computer turns the light on accordingly. That in itself is rather silly. In a perfect world, why cant the computer do a self diagnostic and just show you a display of the failed part or at least a theory or recomendation?? Im 46 years old and I grew up with carburators. Very simple stuff. Now we have 20 sensors to tell the computer what to tell the rest of the 20 servo robots what to do, and I dont believe in any of it! If it dont have ROUND headlites, it must be JUNK!

[foureyedbuzzard]

Not familiar with this vehicle but does the fuel pressure regulator connect to a vacuum line? Check it for good connection, not plugged, hose leaks, etc. Check for other vacuum leaks in the system. If you hadn't just replaced the fuel pressure regulator it would be my #1 suspect. Other possibilities, bad connection from the map sensor to the ECM - check/clean the connector - check the wires, bad O2 sensor/connection, plugged fuel return line, and now to get really get confused http://www.thedodgegarage.com/turbo_pfi.html

[benchtest]

Rodeee, Yes, computers can be useless at times, but it is trying to tell you something. What codes are stored? Also, what have you checked (not replaced)? Such as, timing (cam and ignition), vacuum (idle and cruise), fuel pressure, etc. Do you hear any vacuum leaks? Also, why did you disconnect the EGR? Have you checked to see that the EGR is not stuck open? The more info you have the better.

[rodeee]

Originally Posted by benchtest

Rodeee, Yes, computers can be useless at times, but it is trying to tell you something. What codes are stored? Also, what have you checked (not replaced)? Such as, timing (cam and ignition), vacuum (idle and cruise), fuel pressure, etc. Do you hear any vacuum leaks? Also, why did you disconnect the EGR? Have you checked to see that the EGR is not stuck open? The more info you have the better.

1. I can read the codes by turning the ignition etc. but I cant find reference to what codes mean what. The van is not at my house now so ill have to read the numbers and get back with you.
2. did not yet check timing, maybe it slipped to retarded??
3. yes distributor was checked and cleaned and replaced coil
4. cant hear vacuume leaks but I looked at and felt if there was vacuume in various hoses, most of which I dont know what they are anyway. one of the hoses may still be the culprit
5. my friend thought it might help to disconnect the EGR, hmm maybe not. Im not sure if he checked to see if it was stuck open. I dont know how they work or what its for eighther..(exhaust gas reclamation?)

[jimmy[the]gent]

maybe its your catalytic conver that has clogged

its a possibility thats all i can say

[benchtest]

1) I'm sure someone here can tell you what the codes mean. 2) The basics need to be checked first during any diagnosis. 3) OK 4) Routing is important also...anything been disconnected lately? 5) Checking requires a bit of experience to know the resting position, but if there are windows in the bottom of the diaphram base you can put your finger under it to check. The diaphram should be near the windows. If it's open the diaphram will be pulled up away from the windows. This is where experience helps. If there are just holes under the base, a q-tip or such can be used to feel the position (nothing sharp). If it seems to be open, a firm (NOT hard) rap on the edge of the diaphram housing with a screwdriver handle will often times jar it enough to close again. It will be HOT when running, but you can check it without the engine running. Hopefully, the codes can add some light to the picture.

[fredjacksonsan]

My first thought was timing belt. How many miles are on the vehicle?

[jimmy[the]gent]

timing thats something ppl say all the time

my question is how do u know if a cars timing is set too far forward wat are the symptoms and is it different if the cars timing is set too far back??

it could very well be the timing chain but i always leave that as a last resort cause the only way i know of finding out is taking the cover off the timing chain and looking for the arrows to match up

[rodeee]

Im pretty sure it has a belt and not a chain. Belts do slip in either direction. My dad told me if the timing is advanced even a little, itll idle fast then slow down, then speed back up again. hmmm. I still havnt checked the timing cause its been tooo cold in Ct. Maybe Friday. then ill check the codes too. and get back with everyone. I still need to thoughrouly check the hose from the fuel pressure regulator.

[fredjacksonsan]

To check timing, you'll need a timing light.

As far as the timing belts/chain; if it's an 89 and hasn't had the belt changed ever, then I'd be pretty sure that's the problem.

[rodeee]

Originally Posted by fredjacksonsan

To check timing, you'll need a timing light.

As far as the timing belts/chain; if it's an 89 and hasn't had the belt changed ever, then I'd be pretty sure that's the problem.

===========================================
Hi all!!
I know its 5 months later but the mystery is solved!!
I pulled the valve cover when I finnally had time and guess what?
The cam had a bad lobe, it was half gone and the litle valve didnt move and heated itself into stuck. I replace the cam shaft and it was still stuck. No prob I pulled the head and got the old valve out then put in a new one. Chrysler wanted $70 for one little exhaust valve so I call my High Performance shop. They found one in Ca. so few days later I was back in business! Now I have a brand new computer and all the odds and ends for proper cubustion of a fuel injected piece of krap!
It turns out that Chrysler put inferior lubrication galley size to the rocker arm assembly. One speck of clogging carbon and you no longer get lubrication to the cam lobe! Man thats stupid!
See ya Pm me if ya wanna talk.
Rodeee

[TRACYCULBERSON]

Originally Posted by rodeee

1989 chrysler 2.5 liter turbo with 4 port fuel injection.
engine idles poorly w/ black smoke, runs fine at or above 2500 rpm.
will not get higher than approx. 3500 rpm, stalls at that point when put into drive. In addition when more pedal is applied at 3500 rpm the engine bogs down like its too lean.
Replaced:
1. MAP sensor
2. throttle position sensor
3. oygen sensor
4. disconnected the EGR Valve
5. checked distributor and plugs (did not check timing)
6. replaced fuel pressure regulator
7. checked for blockage of airway
8. replaced main computer

If anyone can help, please email at [email protected]
Im desperate now as my backup vehicle is on the way out.
Thanx Rodeee

seems like u have coverd a lot of bases. sounds like it running way rich,so u have changed o2 senser maybe it has somthing to do with the turbo