[boingo82]

Originally Posted by Solomon219

Well, first let me say that I AM circumcised, and it was for religious reasons. My parents are Christians, and they DID have a choice. When I was born the OB/GYN asked their preferance. In recent years though, I've seen a lot of uproar caused by the fact that physicians DIDN'T consult the parents, and went ahead with it. There've been several lawsuits over this, and I believe the parents won (and rightfully so!)..

It's not required by the Christian church. It was mandated in the Old Testament, but Jesus dying on the cross released Christians from all of those Old-Testament requirements. Such as the one in Leviticus saying you cannot have intercourse with a woman after her period until she sacrifices two turtle doves. There are a LOT of Old-Testament things people don't do anymore..
Anyhow, it says in the New Testament not to circ - whatever happened to that "made in God's image" and "don't mutilate his creation" thing? I think it's so ingrained in our culture now that a lot of people don't even question it, or they think they HAVE to because everyone else is. (If you are around 20-30 years old, then the national rate at the time of your birth was 75-90% - a lot of people wanted their children to "match" the others.

As for the reason it is prevalent in the US is because that the western world is still dominated by Judeo-Christian beliefs. Hence the reason we don't allow gay marriages (while quite a few European countries do; I could name about 13 right now) and the legalization of marijuana, even for medicinal purposes (which certain European countries have adopted for "recreational" purposes, along with harder drugs).

Actually you'd probably be surprised to find out that circ was popularized here starting in about 1850-something to "cure" masturbation, which was believed to cause almost everything from dementia to headaches to blood infection. Back at this time they would forcibly circumcise known masturbators without any anesthesia, as a form of punishment for masturbating. Females would have a clitoridectomy, (clitoris removed) to cure masturbation and other disorders.
One of the biggest proponents of circumcision was John Harvey Kellogg, founder of Kellog's cereals. He claimed that Kellogg brand cereals could cure minor masturbation, and recommended circ for more extreme cases. Herbert Graham also claimed that his crackers (graham crackers) and flour cured the chronic mastubator.

That's the reason it's still practiced. I personally don't believe that these Christian ideals will last too much longer. I feel that we're moving toward a more liberal, perhaps "agnostic" country. I'm a Christian, but I really don't believe this is a bad thing. Our Constution states that we have Freedom of Religion...but doesn't that give you freedom FROM religion as well?!
As an aside, there are quite a few websites out there documenting people who believe that they should have had the choice, not their parents, being as it was their body. They feel a loss. What they've discovered is that they can TECHNICALLY regrow the foreskin. This is involved using weights that you affix to the skin of you penis and it drags the skin down. Doing this often enough, long enough will cause the skin to lengthen, thus drawing down in a "hood". Men who have tried this have expressed an increased sensitivity (a petty debate that has been waged for some time regards the fact that if you are circumsised, you lose a lot of sensation, due to the fact that your exposed "member" is constantly rubbing against rough clothing, and not protected by the foreskin).

Oh, I am well aware of restoration. Unfortunately you can restore only some of the function of the foreskin, namely the function of covering the glans and protecting it from rubbing against clothing, which desensitizes it.
Unfortunately there are some unique parts, such as the 40,000-odd nerve endings and the Meissner's corpscules, (sp?) and the ridged bands and frenulum that cannot be restored.

..Boingo, I don't mean any offense to you, so please don't take any, but I noticed that you're from Utah (yeah, you know what's coming). Are you Mormon, by chance? If you are, what is their belief? If not, are you religious?

It's none of my business, if you don't want to answer. I was just curious because of the subject.

No offense taken, of course. I do reside in Utah, but I am not LDS. I am aethiest but actually fit in quite well here because I am a non-smoker and almost-never-drinker.
The book of Mormon actually condemns circ (Moroni 8:8), but I don't think most people realize that because the rate is about 90% here. (Nationally, the rate is 55% circ, with as low as 30% on the western coastal states.) People here get offended when someone has a tattoo, because they are "defiling God's creation" but not when someone chooses to CUT OFF pieces of their baby. Makes no sense.

The reason I brought this topic up in this thread is I'm reading a book examining the possible societal impact of RIC (routine infant circ). For example the disproportionately high rate of rape and murder that the US has compared to other prosperous countries. Did you know we're the only "developed" country that continues to circ the majority of its infants, in the face of medical fact? Only in Africa and Israel is circ as prevalent.

Anyway I was thinking about our foreign policy, and the fact that we think that as long as we're bigger and more powerful than a country, we can do whatever we want to them. I wonder what goes through the mind of a baby boy having part of his penis cut off without anesthesia. Maybe he is learning that as long as you are bigger and more powerful than someone (as the doctors are to him), you can take anything you want from them.
I know it is a long stretch. I just can't understand how anybody, even a parent, should be able to amputate parts of a healthy baby 'just because'. Don't we all have a basic right to our own, intact body, to do with as we please? If we as a country cannot respect that right, do not be surprised when we disregard the rights of other nations.