00 Wheel bearing replacement procedure ??
pjw73nh
10-27-2009, 12:08 PM
Ok, I started a new thread because I thought it would be beneficial for ALL viewers to get the info I am requesting.
Here is the thread that led up to this post. http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=968903&highlight=wheel+bearing
My two questions are:
1. Should I do both wheel bearings at the same time even though only one has failed ? 121K miles.
2. What is the best/easiest procedure to replace a front wheel bearing on a 2000 FWD ABS Venture?
I have the GM shop manual (1 of 2). It basically says:
1. Jack up the car
2. Remove tire/wheel, caliper, rotor.
3. Loosen and remove spindle locknut
4. Using special tool #12345 push the shaft back into (pull the bearing forward) and out of the knuckle.
Doesn't mention tie rod or ball joint.
I have seen several posts here with conflicting information to this and to each other.
Some say disconnect tie rod end. Some say disconnect lower ball joint. Some say both. I know I need to do it to replace a shaft, but I would prefer to do neither for the bearing if I don't have to. I usually damage the tie rod end, or damage the rubber seal on the ball joint when disconnecting them.
Some say use a puller, some say use a hammer and wood block.
From the diagrams, it doesn't look like these steps are necessary.
Are either or both of these necessary?
FYI Priced out Timken and SKF. They are about $150 each. AutoZone has similar price but unsure of manufacturer. Pep boys has Chinese ones for $95.
Local auto parts jobber has cheapos for $50 each. Probably won't keep the car more than another year or two. Will the cheapos last that long?
Thanks.
Here is the thread that led up to this post. http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=968903&highlight=wheel+bearing
My two questions are:
1. Should I do both wheel bearings at the same time even though only one has failed ? 121K miles.
2. What is the best/easiest procedure to replace a front wheel bearing on a 2000 FWD ABS Venture?
I have the GM shop manual (1 of 2). It basically says:
1. Jack up the car
2. Remove tire/wheel, caliper, rotor.
3. Loosen and remove spindle locknut
4. Using special tool #12345 push the shaft back into (pull the bearing forward) and out of the knuckle.
Doesn't mention tie rod or ball joint.
I have seen several posts here with conflicting information to this and to each other.
Some say disconnect tie rod end. Some say disconnect lower ball joint. Some say both. I know I need to do it to replace a shaft, but I would prefer to do neither for the bearing if I don't have to. I usually damage the tie rod end, or damage the rubber seal on the ball joint when disconnecting them.
Some say use a puller, some say use a hammer and wood block.
From the diagrams, it doesn't look like these steps are necessary.
Are either or both of these necessary?
FYI Priced out Timken and SKF. They are about $150 each. AutoZone has similar price but unsure of manufacturer. Pep boys has Chinese ones for $95.
Local auto parts jobber has cheapos for $50 each. Probably won't keep the car more than another year or two. Will the cheapos last that long?
Thanks.
Airjer_
10-27-2009, 12:58 PM
I would just do the one.
The easiest way to do it is remove the tire, caliper, rotor. Remove the axle nut, Separate the lower ball joint. The axle should come out of the spindle with a couple taps with the hammer like you suggested. By taking the axle all the way out of the spindle it will be easier to get at the three bolts that hold the bearing in place.
What I do - remove the tire, caliper, rotor. Remove the axle nut. Separate the tie rod from the knuckle (put some penetrating lube on the threads of the tie rod before removing the self locking nut, it will come off a lot easier). I can now freely move the knuckle back and forth to get at all three bolts that hold in the bearing. With the right swivel sockets I can push in the axle with one hand and get enough clearance to remove the three bolts.
Make sure you torque the axle nut to the correct torque or all the work you just did will be for nothing. The easiest way to do this is by inserting a punch into the fins of the rotor and then rotating it until it rests on the caliper bracket. You can then torque the axle nut easily without the spindle turning.
The easiest way to do it is remove the tire, caliper, rotor. Remove the axle nut, Separate the lower ball joint. The axle should come out of the spindle with a couple taps with the hammer like you suggested. By taking the axle all the way out of the spindle it will be easier to get at the three bolts that hold the bearing in place.
What I do - remove the tire, caliper, rotor. Remove the axle nut. Separate the tie rod from the knuckle (put some penetrating lube on the threads of the tie rod before removing the self locking nut, it will come off a lot easier). I can now freely move the knuckle back and forth to get at all three bolts that hold in the bearing. With the right swivel sockets I can push in the axle with one hand and get enough clearance to remove the three bolts.
Make sure you torque the axle nut to the correct torque or all the work you just did will be for nothing. The easiest way to do this is by inserting a punch into the fins of the rotor and then rotating it until it rests on the caliper bracket. You can then torque the axle nut easily without the spindle turning.
pjw73nh
10-27-2009, 01:25 PM
Thank you Airjer_ for the quick reply.
I think I now see what people are saying. See if I have this correctly. The outer CV joint is probably too close to the bolt heads to get a proper grip and or wrench/socket on them. Then there is the issue of having a enough cv joint clearance to pull them out ? Am I correct in this?
Also, how critical is the 118 ft lbs. I have a few torque wrenches (2 Click type for lower torques and one "pointer" type that goes much higher) If I got close with the pointer type is that good enough, or are you going to tell me I have to go buy a heavy duty click type for this job?
Thoughts on which bearing to use? High end or low end?
Thanks.
I think I now see what people are saying. See if I have this correctly. The outer CV joint is probably too close to the bolt heads to get a proper grip and or wrench/socket on them. Then there is the issue of having a enough cv joint clearance to pull them out ? Am I correct in this?
Also, how critical is the 118 ft lbs. I have a few torque wrenches (2 Click type for lower torques and one "pointer" type that goes much higher) If I got close with the pointer type is that good enough, or are you going to tell me I have to go buy a heavy duty click type for this job?
Thoughts on which bearing to use? High end or low end?
Thanks.
Airjer_
10-27-2009, 01:50 PM
Make sure you check the instuctions of the bearing you purchase. Sometimes they like to sneak in a different torque spec. than factory. I would have no problem using a beam type to torque the axle nut.
Yes, the axle needs to be pushed in to get enough clearance for the socket/bolt.
Yes, the axle needs to be pushed in to get enough clearance for the socket/bolt.
pjw73nh
10-27-2009, 02:00 PM
Thanks for all the advice. We'll see how it goes...
dewaynep
10-27-2009, 02:28 PM
Instead of releasing the lower ball joint or tie-rod end it is much easier to put a 2 or 3 jaw puller on the hub and use it to push the shaft out of the hub. That will give you plenty of clearance to remove the 3 bolts that hold the hub in place. Be prepared to beat the heck out of the hub to get it to release from the knuckle if you live where they put salt on the roads. Also, buy the best hub you can afford. I can almost guarantee you will be replacing the el-cheapo hub in about a year (about 15-20k miles). How can they make a hub that sells for $50 with an ABS sensor in it that will last any time at all?
Cobber
10-27-2009, 03:38 PM
I didn't remove the tie rod or lower ball joint when I did mine. I did it in the drive way with hand tools.
Remove the wheel/cal/rotor. remove the hub bolt. tapped the axle back through the hub (there was enough play in the other end) and undid the bolts. Pull and hammered a but and the hub was out. Really easy.
Remove the wheel/cal/rotor. remove the hub bolt. tapped the axle back through the hub (there was enough play in the other end) and undid the bolts. Pull and hammered a but and the hub was out. Really easy.
pjw73nh
10-27-2009, 03:44 PM
Dewaynep,
Thanks for the advice. As luck would have it, I have a local garage that I've done some computer work for in the past. I ran it by him. he said:
"If it was one of my customer's cars, I'd go with the good one. If it was my car, I'd go with the cheapo it's not that bad a job to do".
I like your thinking. It may not be the bearing that goes bad. It may be the sensor. Even so, I'd still have to do it again. I'm leaning toward the Timken or the SKF instead of the cheapo.
He also loaned me a tool that is not a 3-jaw, but I think will do what you suggest. It bolts on to the the lug bolts of the hub, and then the center bolt threads in to push the shaft back into and through the bearing/knuckle. He (like you) said that wouldgive me plenty of clearance for the bolts to come out.
Thanks for the reply. I'm planning on tomorrow to do it. I will reply here with my results.
Thanks for the advice. As luck would have it, I have a local garage that I've done some computer work for in the past. I ran it by him. he said:
"If it was one of my customer's cars, I'd go with the good one. If it was my car, I'd go with the cheapo it's not that bad a job to do".
I like your thinking. It may not be the bearing that goes bad. It may be the sensor. Even so, I'd still have to do it again. I'm leaning toward the Timken or the SKF instead of the cheapo.
He also loaned me a tool that is not a 3-jaw, but I think will do what you suggest. It bolts on to the the lug bolts of the hub, and then the center bolt threads in to push the shaft back into and through the bearing/knuckle. He (like you) said that wouldgive me plenty of clearance for the bolts to come out.
Thanks for the reply. I'm planning on tomorrow to do it. I will reply here with my results.
motorwerkes
10-27-2009, 04:21 PM
FRONT WHEEL BEARING/HUB
Tools Required
J 28733-B Front Hub Spindle Remover
Raise and support the vehicle. Refer to Vehicle Lifting.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292373
Remove the tire and wheel. Refer to Tire and Wheel Removal and Installation in Wheels (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/34865429), Tires (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/56265948) and Alignment.
Disconnect the wheel speed sensor electrical connector (2).
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292374
Remove the wheel speed sensor electrical connector from the bracket.
Remove the brake caliper bracket with the brake caliper. Refer to Brake Caliper Bracket Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control.
Remove the brake rotor. Refer to Brake Rotor Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control Disc Brakes.
Remove the wheel drive shaft nut. Refer to Wheel Drive Shafts Replacement.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292375
Use three wheel nuts in order to attach the J 28733-B to the wheel bearing/hub.
Use the J 28733-B in order to push the wheel drive shaft out of the wheel bearing/hub.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292376
Remove and discard the wheel bearing/hub bolts. Important: Ensure that the wheel drive shaft outer seal (boot) is not damaged.
Remove the wheel bearing/hub. Installation Procedure
Install the wheel bearing/hub. Caution: These fasteners MUST be replaced with new fasteners anytime they become loose or are removed. Failure to replace these fasteners after they become loose or are removed may cause loss of vehicle control and personal injury. Notice: Refer to Fastener Notice in Service Precautions.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292377
Install new wheel bearing/hub bolts.
Tighten the new wheel bearing/hub bolts to 130 Nm (96 ft. lbs.) .
Install the wheel drive shaft nut. Refer to Wheel Drive Shafts Replacement.
Install the brake rotor. Refer to Brake Rotor Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control.
Install the brake caliper bracket with the brake caliper. Refer to Brake Caliper Bracket Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control. Important: Ensure that the connector clip engages the bracket properly.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292378
Install the wheel speed sensor electrical connector to the bracket.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292379
Connect the wheel speed sensor electrical connector (2).
Install the tire and wheel. Refer to Tire and Wheel Removal and Installation in Wheels (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/34865429), Tires (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/56265948) and Alignment.
Lower the vehicle.
http://alldatapro.com/images/blnk_spc.gif © 2009 ALLDATA LLC. All rights reserved. Terms of Use (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888#foot)
Tools Required
J 28733-B Front Hub Spindle Remover
Raise and support the vehicle. Refer to Vehicle Lifting.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292373
Remove the tire and wheel. Refer to Tire and Wheel Removal and Installation in Wheels (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/34865429), Tires (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/56265948) and Alignment.
Disconnect the wheel speed sensor electrical connector (2).
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292374
Remove the wheel speed sensor electrical connector from the bracket.
Remove the brake caliper bracket with the brake caliper. Refer to Brake Caliper Bracket Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control.
Remove the brake rotor. Refer to Brake Rotor Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control Disc Brakes.
Remove the wheel drive shaft nut. Refer to Wheel Drive Shafts Replacement.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292375
Use three wheel nuts in order to attach the J 28733-B to the wheel bearing/hub.
Use the J 28733-B in order to push the wheel drive shaft out of the wheel bearing/hub.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292376
Remove and discard the wheel bearing/hub bolts. Important: Ensure that the wheel drive shaft outer seal (boot) is not damaged.
Remove the wheel bearing/hub. Installation Procedure
Install the wheel bearing/hub. Caution: These fasteners MUST be replaced with new fasteners anytime they become loose or are removed. Failure to replace these fasteners after they become loose or are removed may cause loss of vehicle control and personal injury. Notice: Refer to Fastener Notice in Service Precautions.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292377
Install new wheel bearing/hub bolts.
Tighten the new wheel bearing/hub bolts to 130 Nm (96 ft. lbs.) .
Install the wheel drive shaft nut. Refer to Wheel Drive Shafts Replacement.
Install the brake rotor. Refer to Brake Rotor Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control.
Install the brake caliper bracket with the brake caliper. Refer to Brake Caliper Bracket Replacement - Front in Brakes and Traction Control. Important: Ensure that the connector clip engages the bracket properly.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292378
Install the wheel speed sensor electrical connector to the bracket.
http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOB0%7EP3R0H%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888/129305393/83292379
Connect the wheel speed sensor electrical connector (2).
Install the tire and wheel. Refer to Tire and Wheel Removal and Installation in Wheels (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/34865429), Tires (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/56180732/34865428/56265948) and Alignment.
Lower the vehicle.
http://alldatapro.com/images/blnk_spc.gif © 2009 ALLDATA LLC. All rights reserved. Terms of Use (http://alldatapro.com/alldata/PRO%7EV140698200%7EC33962%7ER0%7EOD%7EN/0/77993956/78154671/78154933/78154935/34853741/34860071/34861355/34872107/34861618/85784888#foot)
pjw73nh
10-27-2009, 04:36 PM
Motorwerks,
Thanks for this. You just helped a WHOLE lotta folks with these wheel bearings...
Tnx
Thanks for this. You just helped a WHOLE lotta folks with these wheel bearings...
Tnx
oldblu65
10-27-2009, 10:45 PM
If you'll go to youtube and put " richpin " into search , you'll get many videos of auto repairs the richpin has done and posted . One is the replacement of a front wheel hub bearing on a 2000 Impala . It's a different car from the one you're working on but essentially it's the same as yours. It will show you how easy it is to do . I replaced mine two days ago with no problems . Good luck !
pjw73nh
10-28-2009, 11:52 AM
OldBlu65, tnx for the tip. Great vid. If I can't do this job with relative ease, I may have a whole bunch of tools up for sale.... It looks pretty straight forward.
I certainly appreciate all the help here. Weather permitting, I am going to make the attempt either this afternoon or Friday. My garage is currently occupied with a partially torn down motorcycle that needs a new clutch and a transmission rebuild (winter project).
From the manual post above, it looks like if I use the "proper" tool to push the shaft through the hub, It should give me enough room to get at and remove the bolts. Thus negating cracking the ball joint and tie rod end. I'll post my results here.
Oh yeah. One more thing. Everyone says to replace the 3 bolts and the spindle nut. Necessary? I am guessing the spindle nut is a dealer only item. What about the bolts? Dealer only? Grade 5? Grade 8? Stainless? Does anyone know what size they are so I can get them in advance ?
Tnx
I certainly appreciate all the help here. Weather permitting, I am going to make the attempt either this afternoon or Friday. My garage is currently occupied with a partially torn down motorcycle that needs a new clutch and a transmission rebuild (winter project).
From the manual post above, it looks like if I use the "proper" tool to push the shaft through the hub, It should give me enough room to get at and remove the bolts. Thus negating cracking the ball joint and tie rod end. I'll post my results here.
Oh yeah. One more thing. Everyone says to replace the 3 bolts and the spindle nut. Necessary? I am guessing the spindle nut is a dealer only item. What about the bolts? Dealer only? Grade 5? Grade 8? Stainless? Does anyone know what size they are so I can get them in advance ?
Tnx
mhall02
10-29-2009, 09:20 PM
I re-used the spindle nut and three bolts that hold the bearing assembly on. Last one was a Timken, first two were cheapies and one of them went bad pretty quickly. Don't recommend cheapie, go Timken. Make sure you torque that spindle/axle nut the correct amount.
pjw73nh
10-29-2009, 09:27 PM
mhall02, Tnx for the reply. I bought the Timken yesterday. $145 Autozone. Gonna do the job tomorrow afternoon. Will post results here...
pjw73nh
11-04-2009, 10:05 AM
Not sure of the best way to post this, but I have a 1.9 MB PDF with 15 pix and instructions of my procedure. It took longer to create this than it did to do the actual job.
It is a pdf and is about 2 MB. Can anyone tell me the best way to post it? Or can I send it to someone and have THEM post it? I don't have the time to recreate it, and some of the images have text embedded so I can't shrink the pix.
Start to finish the job itself took me about 2.5 hours and that included a trip to the auto parts store to buy a replacement 6 pt 13mm impact socket. Mine broke loosening a bearing bolt.
I DID NOT have to open the tie rod end or ball joint. :)
Tnx
It is a pdf and is about 2 MB. Can anyone tell me the best way to post it? Or can I send it to someone and have THEM post it? I don't have the time to recreate it, and some of the images have text embedded so I can't shrink the pix.
Start to finish the job itself took me about 2.5 hours and that included a trip to the auto parts store to buy a replacement 6 pt 13mm impact socket. Mine broke loosening a bearing bolt.
I DID NOT have to open the tie rod end or ball joint. :)
Tnx
Airjer_
11-05-2009, 12:32 PM
pjw73nh (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/member.php?u=418434)'s step by step photo's
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/1.jpg
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http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/9.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/10.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/11.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/12.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/13.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/14.jpg
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/airjer/AF%20Stuff/15.jpg
dewaynep
11-06-2009, 11:40 AM
Nice job!!! And clear pictures. That should help a lot of people with this job.
pjw73nh
11-06-2009, 11:46 AM
Thanks Dwaynep.
It was my first time writing a piece like that. I guess I made the pix too big, so it was hard to get on the forum. Airjer posted it for me. I hope it helps a lot of people. The internet is fantastic for this kind of sharing. The job would've taken me much longer if I had only had just the manual. But with Youtube and the resources here in the forum, I was able to get enough info ahead of time, and get the job done correctly and efficiently. In the future I am going to post all the jobs I do in the hopes they'll help others in the same boat...
It was my first time writing a piece like that. I guess I made the pix too big, so it was hard to get on the forum. Airjer posted it for me. I hope it helps a lot of people. The internet is fantastic for this kind of sharing. The job would've taken me much longer if I had only had just the manual. But with Youtube and the resources here in the forum, I was able to get enough info ahead of time, and get the job done correctly and efficiently. In the future I am going to post all the jobs I do in the hopes they'll help others in the same boat...
mhall02
11-06-2009, 01:36 PM
Bravo!! Well Done!!
oldblu65
11-06-2009, 02:19 PM
Great job !
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