Nissan vs Acura, Honda, Toyota

This is my first post on this site, and I have to admit that this is the most knowledgable "Z" enthusiast site I have ever witnessed. My hats off to the host of this forum, the particpants, and their great post.

I will admit that I am taken a back to the Acura, Honda, and Toyota referencing that goes on in here. Especially those once and again post bragging about their superiority over the best Japanese sports car engineer of the 20th (and soon to be of the 21st) century - Nissan.

Shame on you Acura/Honda and Toyota lovers for being so myopic!! Your obsession with blind loyalty is about as fundamental as your rants about NSX's, Supra's, and Accords.... :flipa:

Has the appeal of glourified four bangers & 50-80k not-so super cars made you that nearsighted that you don't realize that you are the one getting taken for the virtual ride? :hehehe:

For instance we are talking sports cars here right? Automobiles who's history and essence were originated and evolved on the sport car enthusiast quest for driver/machine extreme performance? Yet I hear you screaming Honda Civic? Honda Accord? 250HP? Has grocery shopping really gotten that exciting these days? When I was a kid (and it wasn't that long ago) Honda Civic, and Accord was the car you bought because you lived in Jersey, but you worked in the City, and saving gas while having room for the wife, kids, and the dog, and avoiding American made gas guzzlers seemed ideal. And then there was the (Datsun/Nissan) "Z" - nuff said. As the Accord and Civic have evolved the only thing that seem's to be evolving with the automaker (Honda) is how many more "Tech's" can they squeeze out of four cylindar grocery getter, while adding Ferrari style spoilers, 17' wheels, and 1-aplha naming conventions on the back of the car ("S", "SI" what does that stand for anyway? "Slow" "Semi Interesting") to make it sound like the fastest thing to hit the street.... And yet you guys keep buying these 30k + go-carts, and investing 20k more in aftermarket go fast goodies just so you can hang with a stock Ford Mustang? Has there ever really been such a thing as a "true" Honda sports car? Put down your NSX banner... An 80k super-car shouldn't get it's doors blown off by a stock 50k Dodge Viper or a 55k Porsche Boxter Turbo should it???? Alarm bells are ringing here Honda fan.... :uhoh:

But keep your chin-up Honda cheerleaders because if there's anything more annoying than you and your pist-off lawnmowers running up and down the street it's those Toy's.... (dare I give the automaker any respect by typing it's full name trademark) Toyota.... With the re-birth, reinvention, reposturing, re-every damn thing in the book over the new Celica... Life for the Toyota enthusiast is just as hopelessly lost as the Honda crusaders. I can already see the "brilliant" (and I use the term as loosely as possible) engineers at Toyota posturing to make the same move in the 2000's as they did in the 80's by bringing out an expensive, lethargic, sportscar based on it's little brother. That car obviously being the SUPRA!! After all wasn't the first Supra just a higher grade of Celica anyway? For years Toyota fans have bought into this con, and paid for it with their wallets at the dealer, on the street, and right back into the repair shop. While in the meantime having to suffer at Toyota's low setting goal of being able "To make a Japanese sports car better than the Nissan "Z". But they have failed miserably every time they try, and when they succeed their customers whind up paying for it. To add insult to injury.... The automaker took their "true" sports car the "MR-2" and turned it into high school princess mobile at the expense of developing the next great Celica? A front wheel drive, 170+ hp go-no-where mobile priced just over 30k fully equipped (and that's not counting if you want the "looks fast Countachesk" rear and front spoiler) Celica. Toyota fan... You should feel insulted.... Five years in the making and this is the best TRD (Toyota Racing Development) could come up with? Well at least you know you always got that traditional Toyota trade in value don't you? Your local Nissan dealer will be happy to take your illfated decision and sell it to some other poor soul come next June. :crying:

Honda fan, Toyota fan, listen up and listen well.... :finger: When it comes to a true affordable sports car enthusiast machine straight from the showroom. Nissan nailed it way back in 1970, and have continued that tradition through the development and evolution of the legendary "Z" car. Toyota and Honda will continue to try to imitate and surpass this magnificant automobile, but the fact is you just can't beat an original. To all of those who have ever owned a "Z" the moment we have been patiently waiting for is just around the corner.... For those who have never had the pleasure... Get in line, one of life's great experiences is upon you.... There are few "first" things in life you never forget... Your first "Z" is one of them.


Nuff-Said
:greenchai:

Hmmm... I wonder what you drive... :rolleyes:

Oh, well. Welcome to AF anyway!!! :D ;)

Since you did spend most of your post comparing Honda and Toyota to Nissan, I think this thread will be better served by moving it to our Car Comparisons forum...

First of all I think the best Nissan site is FreshAlloy.com!!

You my buddy sounds like a totally ignorant freak. Can you use your brain and make better comparision?

I REPEAT NISSAN DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO BRING ANY REAL CAR TO NORTH AMERICA UNTIL NOW. IT HAS BEEN A LONG TIME SINCE THEY HAD A REAL SPORTS CAR IN NORTH AMERICA.

Why don't you go find out more before you talk? Buy a cheap Honda Civic or CRX for 6K. Invest 4K into T3/T4 hybrid Turbo. You get yourself a 12, 13 daily driven car. Every company makes economy or so call grocery shopping cars. Nissan is included in this as well.

Why you even talking about NSX? That car is outdated everyone knows that. When it came out it scare the shit out of Ferrari until they brought out F360 Modena. I have tons of clips about NSX Type S Zero beating Ferrari F355, Nissan Skyline GT-R V Spec and Porsche 911 etc. Does handmade and aluminum ring a bell? There is reasons why NSX cost 80K just you choose to ignore it.

By the way what the heck is a Boxter Turbo?

Your ideaology isn't very good. Z06 is probaly the best deal on the world today then. Since it only cost 50K and it can beat F360 Modena and go even with 911 Turbo. But if people have money they purchase Ferrari and Porsche for reasons that Z06 will never be FAME.

As for Celica it's a lot more fun than Altima and Maxima. You just cannot get the same handling from those cars.

Why don't you wake up from your world and start looking at the real world ahead. End of dicussion. :finger:

a new skyline GTR R35 will take on a porsche 911 turbo...and some other car

Here are the clips to NSX Type S Zero beating Skyline, Ferrari F355 and 911.

http://www.nsxprime.com/Gallery/multimedia/multimedia.htm

Originally posted by F20C
Here are the clips to NSX Type S Zero beating Skyline, Ferrari F355 and 911.

http://www.nsxprime.com/Gallery/multimedia/multimedia.htm Wow! :D Thanks!

Yah I got your message so I might as well posted up here too. So others can see for themselves.

Now if only I understood Japanese! :hehe:

:o I wish I live in Japan. Not only will I understand what they are saying. I'll get a chance to drive them too. :D

Originally posted by F20C
:o I wish I live in Japan. Not only will I understand what they are saying. I get to drive them too. :D EXACTLY! :cool: Even the Nissans! :eek: (That was just to get us back on-topic) ;)

I like Nissan's but that guy just made no sense at all. He focus on some bad parts of Honda and Toyota and then made up other stuff to support his cause.

The NSX is an exception to the honda, acura, toyota statement made, but that doesn't change the fact that it is plagerized styling, and today in the 2000's plain, and boring like all Hondas. Honda I do respect for making appliances, but not sports cars. Same goes for Toyota, if they didn't make everyone pay entirly too much for a toaster.

Strangely enough, Honda, Nissan, and Toyota are the only manufacturers that have my respect (I'm not talking about supercar manufacturers). The all are good cars, some even great cars.

oh dear will it never end!?

Ignoance of that caliber is so clearly based on an inablity to preform even the most basic reasoning that there is no point in even offering some kind of reply.

Why do you automatically say ignorance if someone doesn't like a company you do. I know a good deal about cars, and I dislike Toyota, and don't like Honda b/c of what I know about them.
What pisses me off about Honda's is that people think they are the greatest thing, and they are the most reliuable cars. My experience however has always been that reliability is all luck, and the manufacturer matters little.
My sisters Honda has had more problems than any car my family has owned. She just spent $2000 on getting the brake system fixed. I don't know what was wrong, because my mom just told me friday, and she didn't know exactly what the problem was, and I haven't talked to my sister since she had it done. 2 weeks before my sister spent $600 on routine maubtenance. I am sorry, but I have never spent more than $50 on routine maintenance. There have been alot of other problems she has had with her 96 accord, but I am not going to bother listing them.
Get this though. When my Dad was looking for a car for my sister for her College graduation present, he asked me what they should look at. I told them to get an accord. I have nothing against appliances. I know that is all my sister really wants from a car as long as it is a manual, and I still have respect for Hondas. I personaly would never get one.
Honda's styling too me is either bland or ugly, period. The RSX is ugly(love the interior though), and the rest are boring. Yes the S2000's styling is boring. Could you put a flatter side on a car. The s2000 looks like a tiny Honda thats it. And I want a car that doesn't sound like a motorcycle. I love motorcycles, but I want a motorcycle sound from a crotch rocket, and a car sound from a car.
One more thing about hondas, is that I hate there manual transmissions. I hate the shifter feel, and the clutch is way too long, and the way it engages I can not get over.
Toyota, you can't deny that there cars are priced $2000-10000 over the rest of the class. The prices I see for Lexus in magazine comparison tests is nothing close to what you can actually talk them down to except maybe the IS 300 Which I like except for the "euro"(not from europe never has been) lights, but I still respect them(the taillights) because they are different.
I have to make a quick statement about the F355 too. A beautiful car, yes. One of my least favorite Ferraris ever made definitely.
Could you maybe think that someone doesn't like cars that you like for good reasons. Nah you all are too thick headed for that.

Oh yeah and F20C yeah you can make a civic a 12-13 sec car, but what is the point it will still be a Civic, which no matter what you do to it is a boring econobox.

Sorry I forgot to make a couple quick statments about Nissan. I have always liked nissans. Recently my opinion for them started to fade, as the only nissan that I like was the Maxima, and they started to give it an ugly ass. However this year they have turned around. Now I like the Maxima, the Sentra, and the altima. God bless the new altima. What took nissan so long to make the Altima interesting? I love the new Z, but it definitelyhas a few things that I would change w/o looking back. But not very many cars a perfect.
Oh yes and to complete my F355 statement, I do realize that it is the best selling Ferrari ever.

Originally posted by Cannabis

Could you maybe think that someone doesn't like cars that you like for good reasons. Nah you all are too thick headed for that.


IF you could provide some kind of a rational argument to back up your cliams we might be a little more interested.
But at the moment your doing nothing more than ranting.

What are you trying to do? start a war between the owners of Hondas, Toyotas and Nissans? Well im sorry but AF members are a bit more open minded than that.

Please don't continue with your current attitude or it may be suggested that you head elsewhere.

I am not tryin to start a war. I am just stating my opinions, not asking others to ditch there cars or whatever. I guaruntee that 90% of the people here don't like my car, but I love my car. Yes I was ranting, but everyone who knows me knows that I love to rant. Take no offense, just take it in stride.

Originally posted by Cannabis
I am not tryin to start a war. . ........... Yes I was ranting, but everyone who knows me knows that I love to rant. Take no offense, just take it in stride.


sweet as! :cool:

Just remember that nobdy here no's you yet. so you may get a few nasty replies to some of your rants, but I dont have a problem with ranting, im prone to it my self sometimes.
No offense is taken. (by me anyway! :D )

Originally posted by Cannabis
Why do you automatically say ignorance if someone doesn't like a company you do. I know a good deal about cars, and I dislike Toyota, and don't like Honda b/c of what I know about them.
What pisses me off about Honda's is that people think they are the greatest thing, and they are the most reliuable cars. My experience however has always been that reliability is all luck, and the manufacturer matters little.
My sisters Honda has had more problems than any car my family has owned. She just spent $2000 on getting the brake system fixed. I don't know what was wrong, because my mom just told me friday, and she didn't know exactly what the problem was, and I haven't talked to my sister since she had it done. 2 weeks before my sister spent $600 on routine maubtenance. I am sorry, but I have never spent more than $50 on routine maintenance. There have been alot of other problems she has had with her 96 accord, but I am not going to bother listing them.
Get this though. When my Dad was looking for a car for my sister for her College graduation present, he asked me what they should look at. I told them to get an accord. I have nothing against appliances. I know that is all my sister really wants from a car as long as it is a manual, and I still have respect for Hondas. I personaly would never get one.
Honda's styling too me is either bland or ugly, period. The RSX is ugly(love the interior though), and the rest are boring. Yes the S2000's styling is boring. Could you put a flatter side on a car. The s2000 looks like a tiny Honda thats it. And I want a car that doesn't sound like a motorcycle. I love motorcycles, but I want a motorcycle sound from a crotch rocket, and a car sound from a car.
One more thing about hondas, is that I hate there manual transmissions. I hate the shifter feel, and the clutch is way too long, and the way it engages I can not get over.
Toyota, you can't deny that there cars are priced $2000-10000 over the rest of the class. The prices I see for Lexus in magazine comparison tests is nothing close to what you can actually talk them down to except maybe the IS 300 Which I like except for the "euro"(not from europe never has been) lights, but I still respect them(the taillights) because they are different.
I have to make a quick statement about the F355 too. A beautiful car, yes. One of my least favorite Ferraris ever made definitely.
Could you maybe think that someone doesn't like cars that you like for good reasons. Nah you all are too thick headed for that.

Oh yeah and F20C yeah you can make a civic a 12-13 sec car, but what is the point it will still be a Civic, which no matter what you do to it is a boring econobox.

We don't even know if you and your family take care of the cars properly. Many times when something goes wrong the driver of the car is at fault. It's like those people racing their car when they just past 600 miles. Or people that always press too much gas only to press extremely hard on brake to slow down when traffic clogs up. You can't say that your family have nothing to do with all the maintenence cost. Also don't let people fool you into changing everything. Dealership are there to make money and they have been reported of writing report of what needs fixture when it really is just a small problem that's easily fixable.

Looks is subjective and there is no right or wrong. What you think it's boring doesn't mean the entire world thinks it's boring.

Honda tranmission are world famous for excellence. It's gives an excellent feedback to the driver and let's him/her control the car.

Try driving a Domestic's clutch and you will feel they are much longer than Japanese cars.

Sorry we are all car lovers here. If you have something to say then bring in the evidience. All the guy did was talk a whole bunch of bullshit.

Nah I never said 12 second Civic is not a Civic. The thread started said Honda people spent 20K more to hang with stock Mustang. Maybe you should read what he said before commenting.

I do drive a domestic manual, and no its shift throws are very short, and the clutch requires very little movement to engage and disengage completly. And actually that gas and break thing is something I do all to often, but hey it is fun. My sister drives like a puss, and takes very good care of her car, except the interior, but hey I'm pretty hard on my interior too. The only car I didn't take care of was my Taurus(changed the oil about every 10,000 miles). But that is b/c I didn't care that much about it, and didn't have the time to fool with it. But hey I got it with 60,000 miles, and got rid of it at 150,000 miles w/o a single problem. Well actually I did break one motor mount, but that was I think $30 and 45 minutes install.

What domestic manual you drive?

1999 Mercury Cougar V-6. I have put in an aftermarket short shifter, but I am mainly talking about Hondas clutch. I can't sit properly in a honda, b/c when I try to disengage the clutch my knee hits the bottom of the steering wheel, and I can't disengage it fully. My sisters 96 accord is that way, my friends old car a 87 accord was that way(worse though), and my x-girlfriends civic was that way. Can't remember what year it was though. Somewhere around a 95.
But I like my shifters feel alot better too, and the throws are shorter. Recently I did feel a stock shifter, and my shifter is alot better, but the stock is still pretty decent.

Your S2000 Probably has a completly different set up, and feel than those though.
Oh yeah and my sisters car is way too lethargic to ever race.
But I didn't mention how I liked my friends 87 accord. I loved the interior, and it was a decent looking car for 1987, but I could still never get one b/c I have to have a stick, and I already told you the problem with that. He never had any major problems with it, a couple of minor electrical problems like the dome light, and if he used the cigg lighter(for anything power point or whatever) he would blow every fuse. And one really wierd problem if he parked his car on just the right slope while it was raining the sun roof would leak, and water would collect in the headliner making it sag pretty bad. Then when we would drive off it would dump out all over us. Pretty funny actually. This was back in 1996-98 by the way. But it was actually faster than my sisters car.

When I test drove Mustang and Camaro the distance clutch travels was longer than Honda.

I never driven Cougar V6 so I can't comment on that. I'll head down to Ford take a look when I get a chance.

mmm the 2001 cougar. I just want to steal a couple things from it the center console(my one fault with my car), the guages, and the steering wheel, but I don't like how they changed the I guess it would be the air damn, rear bumper, and the headlights.
Oh yeah I have one other fault with it. If you aren't careful really bad axle tramp.

Originally posted by Cannabis
. I can't sit properly in a honda, b/c when I try to disengage the clutch my knee hits the bottom of the steering wheel, and I can't disengage it fully.


Did you try adjusting the steering wheel height?
hondas do that you know. :D

(and how tall are you? one problem a lot of older japanese cars have is limited room for very tall people, but then very short peole can have trouble in large American cars.)

only 6'. And yes I adjusted the steering wheel, but driving with the steering wheel up like that makes me feel like I am driving a bus. j/k
I drive with the steering wheel all the way down. I don't feel right unless it is in the right place which is low. And isn't it true that Honda's don't have hydraulic clutches. A friend of mine told me that is why they have as much travel as they do.

Most cars with anything bigger than a 1300 have a hydrolic clutch.
It has little relation to the pedal travel though.
Thats more dependant on pedal length, clutch lever length, etc

Cannabis are you talking about adjustable pedals offered on some Ford cars?

Nope I don't think that is offered on any thing with a manual transmission.

Okay just wondering.

anything bigger than a 1300 are you talking ccs cause I'm not familier with that unit. What is that in cubic inches, or liters? And I don't even know what cc stands for. never had to deal with that unit.

Tisk, tisk, tisk.... So this is what happens when I don't check the forum for a while... Here's the deal people... The thread is titled "Nissan vs Acura, Honda, Toyota" - Not Dr' Seuses "A Clucth Is Clutch Of Course Of Course." Let's compare cars in here!!

To the mentally derranged Honda degenerate who said and I quote, "Buy a Honda for 4k invest 6k, and you have a 12 second daily driver." Hello you myopic Honda loving fool... There is no such thing as a 12sec "daily driven" 4 cylinder car unless you are driving a Lotus Esprit or Porshe Carrera Turbo 4 - the key words here being "daily driven"

Take FC20 for instance... Now see, here's a guy who takes his hard earned pay check down to his nearest go fast goodie mobile shop like "Hocus Pocus Motorsports, Shiver Mi Timbers Performance, Toilet Bowl Racing Dynamics, or whatever the hell those aftermarket retards are calling their "Places of Business" these days, and forks the whole thing over for a really loud exhaust, a couple of bolt on turbos, an intercooler that's way to big, a clutch, some Euro headlights, spoiler, a bad paint job, bubble gum, and a partridge in a pear tree just so he can bolt it all on to Mom's 1991 hand me down Accord LXi. Sure it may sound cool, but after he's bolted all that crap on (whoops, can I say "crap" in this forum?), taken it down to the street car show on a late Saturday night thrill, and gotten his arse blown off by some blond headed sixteen year old in a 85 Mustang convertible 5.0... All he has to show for it is a big repair bill back at Toilet Bowl Racing Dynamics for the crap he blew off Mom's hand me down last Saturday night. Honda's where made for a reason.... What it is I don't know, but racing isn't one of them... Why is it that the fastest Honda's on the street are always in the shop for repairs... The same reason the fat girl in High School never became prom queen.... They just can't live up to that kind of potential...

F20C my friend :finger:, you have been sucking on the tailpipe of your Moms 1991 little ditty way to long.... Again, you can only squeeze so many "V's" out of a V-tech. The best thing that ever came out of Honda was Acura - Whoops, oh wait I forgot, they suck too!!! And while we're on the subject of Acura... Yes I do expect alot from an 80k car like the NSX... I would expect my 80k car to beat stock Saleen Mustangs, Camaro SS's, Dodge Vipers, Porshe Boxters, BMW Z3's, and Corvettes.... Hell, that's what I spent that hard earned 80k on, so that I could beat other cars that were cheaper than mine... I wouldn't expect to buy an 80k car just because it's hand made and aluminum. Golf clubs are hand made and aluminum too, but you don't see people pouring out 80k to own them do you???!!! Too anyone who ever owned an NSX.... Seek psychological help... There are starving children in this world and, you are spending a 80 grand on a car that can't even hang with a glorified Chevrolet. Shame on you NSX fan...

F20C get your head out of your HKS magazine for just one second and listen up:

The Altima has 245 hp "stock" - this means no turbo timer, bolt ons, etc.

The Maxima has 260 hp "stock" - please see above if you didn't understand the first time.

The SuperCharged Frontier has 210 hp "stock" - dido

The SuperCharged Xterra has 210 hp "stock" - dido

The SE-R Vspec has 170+ hp stock - dido

And the new "Z" TT is expected to have over 340 hp stock - and priced under 40k

With an average price of all of these well engineered vehicles ranging between 25 and 35k... Honda's got a lot of caching up to do...

Save your tears for the repair shop FC20 - I just hate to see a grown man cry....

By the way last Saturday night I was cruisin the main drag in my 95' Stillen "Z" TT, and this little Honda Prelude pulled up next to me revving his engine... Now I gotta tell you that I took pride in leaving that little peace of crap (whoops there goes another crap reference) behind, but it touched my heart when I checked my rearview mirror and saw that the 2002 Infiniti Q45 on the other side of me had smoked it also... Now that's "Priceless"

Live and learn FC20

Nuff Said

F20C I going to aplogise for the ignorance of the above post.
It makes us all here at AF look bad so I did something about it, and I trust it won't happen again.

Notice to all AF members and guests:

Disrespect to other AF members will NOT be tolerated!!!

No way, no how.

For nissan2infiniti, and any other closed minded trolls out there, just don't bother.

Find a forum where you can talk about your one favorite manufacturer or model and trash everything else and have a blast; we don't care.

They're just cars, and none of them are perfect. None of them.

I've spent the last couple of days looking at some other forums, some manufacturer-specific, some even model-specific, and AF walks all over all of them, any day of the week.

Thank you, AF members. You all make AF great. :D