Accident about ZeroPaint 2 Pack Clearner

Dear All,

Just I paint ZeroPaint 2 Pack Clearner with 10:5:1.5 to mixed.

Please see this picture.
http://www.imx365.net/images/forum/2009/06/200906041500077457_500.jpg

http://www.imx365.net/images/forum/2009/06/200906041500508134_500.jpg

why the R8 looks like a toad？

I'm very confused about this.

Please,tell me how to paint it.

why the R8 looks like a toad？
Because it was designed that way......?

Because it was designed that way......?

lol, I think he means the toad like finish he's getting... particularly visible near the front of the hood.

I've never had that with 2k paints....
guessing here: not mixed will enough? dirty surface?

@empire4th: maybe some close-up picks would help? 有近拍的照片吗?

Sprayed from too far back?

lol, I think he means the toad like finish he's getting... particularly visible near the front of the hood.

I've never had that with 2k paints....
guessing here: not mixed will enough? dirty surface?

@empire4th: maybe some close-up picks would help? 有近拍的照片吗?

http://www.ucmanager.org/empire4th/DSC00721.JPG

http://www.ucmanager.org/empire4th/DSC00722.JPG

I think I mixed it enough,and surface has been clear when I paint the 2x clearner.

:crying:

I guess it is to thick, did your airbrush got clogged in the process? I usually mix it 2:1:2 or 3 where 1 is hardener. It looks like you got small drops of clear all over because mixture were not atomized enough (to thick).

What did you use for the basecoat? Looks like paint reacted with the clear. In fact, it looks like as if 2K clear was applied over water-based acrylic paint.

What did you use for the basecoat? Looks like paint reacted with the clear. In fact, it looks like as if 2K clear was applied over water-based acrylic paint.

That's exactly what I'm thinking. I don't use 2K clear so I'm certainly not an expert with it, but it looks like the clearcoat has dissolved the paint below it.

I guess it is to thick, did your airbrush got clogged in the process? I usually mix it 2:1:2 or 3 where 1 is hardener. It looks like you got small drops of clear all over because mixture were not atomized enough (to thick).
Thanks for your reply.

I used "Finisher's super tool wash clearner" to wash my airbrush. I think it will be washed cleanlily.

This is second time I was use ZP's 2x clear coat.
In the first time. I use 2:1:1 to mixed clear coat.It has some cratered.
In the second time. I use 2:1:1.5 to mixed, more thinner in the clear coat. the picture is result. Too much ceatered. Oh my god~

I have a question. My mix step is hardener inject clear coat, thinner inject them,and mix it. The step is right? When I mixed it, should I wating a few minutes or paint it as soon as possible?

What did you use for the basecoat? Looks like paint reacted with the clear. In fact, it looks like as if 2K clear was applied over water-based acrylic paint.

Thanks for your reply.
I use gunze #1200 gray putty to base,and paint Gaia Ex-02 gloss black.the silver is "Finisher's Fine Silver".

Thanks for your reply.
I use gunze #1200 gray putty to base,and paint Gaia Ex-02 gloss black.the silver is "Finisher's Fine Silver".

how did you mix the clear paint?
did you boost the paint in your air brush? or did you mix it too vigrouisly making bubbles with the paint itself?
i did see some other local (HK) modelers around(including me...:mad:) doing Finisher GP2 with similar results....
i guess that is the way you mix the paint that matters the most.

another idea around us as we discussed about the 2K paints is that, did you clearn or polish the surface before the clear coat? or did any thing that did landed on the surface like grease or oil from your fingers?
i try very of my best not to even touch the surface after the base color is ready and before i do that clear coat layer. and most of the time i did it over the night so any "barriers" can be avoided between the two layers of paint.

I definitely think you use it too thick (as per manuf. indications, but the stuff is designed for the automotive market, to be applyed with wide (1.5-1.8 mm diam) spray gun): I done reducing experiment with this HI solid coating, I reduced until 2/1kat/4th (read 4! it is suggested almost nothing...) without troubles over a basecoat like Zeros: but I got troubles with decals and using much thinner it is necessary to take "hand". Reducing ratio I'll reccomend would be around 2/1kat/1.5>2 th

BTW: this kind of 2K are exetremely sensitive to ambiental sylicons and syl. contaminations on the part: sometimes a great cleaning wouldn't be sufficient, I got recently a trouble coating my F575 evo after having no troubles with primers, basecoats... I think a good solution would be the barrier done by a good 2K primer.

I definitely think you use it too thick (as per manuf. indications, but the stuff is designed for the automotive market, to be applyed with wide (1.5-1.8 mm diam) spray gun): I done reducing experiment with this HI solid coating, I reduced until 2/1kat/4th (read 4! it is suggested almost nothing...) without troubles over a basecoat like Zeros: but I got troubles with decals and using much thinner it is necessary to take "hand". Reducing ratio I'll reccomend would be around 2/1kat/1.5>2 th


I use Mipa brand basecoat and the same brand 2K clear. My thinning ratio is about 2/1kat/3 thinner, much more thinner than the manufacturer recommends (20%). No troubles with decals (Tamiya, Fujimi, Revell). Only drawback is that the final curing takes longer than with less thinning.

http://www.ucmanager.org/empire4th/DSC00721.JPG

http://www.ucmanager.org/empire4th/DSC00722.JPG

I think I mixed it enough,and surface has been clear when I paint the 2x clearner.

:crying:
YYYYYikes that doesn't look good!:eek7:

Do you use your airbrush with a compressor? If so does the compressor have a "water seperator", from the looks it could be some water in the air system.

If I remember correctly the instructions from the Finisher's 2k paint say that water in the air system can cause the clear to make "pinholes" (translation :wink:), bubbles etc...

how did you mix the clear paint?
did you boost the paint in your air brush? or did you mix it too vigrouisly making bubbles with the paint itself?
i did see some other local (HK) modelers around(including me...:mad:) doing Finisher GP2 with similar results....
i guess that is the way you mix the paint that matters the most.

another idea around us as we discussed about the 2K paints is that, did you clearn or polish the surface before the clear coat? or did any thing that did landed on the surface like grease or oil from your fingers?
i try very of my best not to even touch the surface after the base color is ready and before i do that clear coat layer. and most of the time i did it over the night so any "barriers" can be avoided between the two layers of paint.
I use a utensil to mix them, and mix round carefully, no bubbles in liquor.
I clearn the surface before the clear coat, and my friend tell me maybe some oil in the surface like your said. But if that is right, I didn't touch all of surface before paint. Today is raining in bejing, I'll try to paint next day.
I want get to the bottom of this.How to make this result and how to avoid this.

I definitely think you use it too thick (as per manuf. indications, but the stuff is designed for the automotive market, to be applyed with wide (1.5-1.8 mm diam) spray gun): I done reducing experiment with this HI solid coating, I reduced until 2/1kat/4th (read 4! it is suggested almost nothing...) without troubles over a basecoat like Zeros: but I got troubles with decals and using much thinner it is necessary to take "hand". Reducing ratio I'll reccomend would be around 2/1kat/1.5>2 th

BTW: this kind of 2K are exetremely sensitive to ambiental sylicons and syl. contaminations on the part: sometimes a great cleaning wouldn't be sufficient, I got recently a trouble coating my F575 evo after having no troubles with primers, basecoats... I think a good solution would be the barrier done by a good 2K primer.
Thanks!

I will try 2/1/2 to paint clear coat.

Urethane color base looks exactly like that when it's too thick or sprayed from too far away.

But 2K urethane clear acts differently. Sprayed too thick or too dry, it doesn't look all lumpy or "toady." Instead, it looks way too smooth, like the car has just been dipped in thick, sweet syrup. Sorry, but your car does not look sweet at all.

So it's my guess that you have a compatibility problem, not a thickness problem.

1. What kind of thinner did you use? The correct thinner for 2K urethane clear is low temp reducer. Ordinary lacquer thinner can sometimes cause 2K urethane to curdle. It separates into tiny clumps. Curdled urethane clear would still spray, but it could look exactly like the paint on your Audi. If you still have any thinned clear that hasn't hardened, take a close look at with a magnifying glass.

2. What kind of paint is Finisher's? (2K urethane, 1K urethane, synthetic lacquer, enamel, water-based acrylic or a complete mystery?) Did it dry flat or glossy? The urethane should do okay over either of the urethanes or over the syn lacquer, but I'd definitely worry about the water-based acrylic.

So at this point I'd guess that the color base is okay, and that the problem is the thinner.

I suggest contacting Steve at Hiro to find out if his Zero 2K clear is compatible with the thinner and base coat you used.

Hope you can recover your car. Unlike some people, I think the R8 is a beautiful, well-balanced car. Show us the model when it's done!

Ddms

Do you use your airbrush with a compressor? If so does the compressor have a "water seperator", from the looks it could be some water in the air system.

If I remember correctly the instructions from the Finisher's 2k paint say that water in the air system can cause the clear to make "pinholes" (translation :wink:), bubbles etc...

I like your DBR9 so much!Great job.

My compressor have a water seperator,and a GSI PS288 water seperator under my airbrush.

Urethane color base looks exactly like that when it's too thick or sprayed from too far away.

But 2K urethane clear acts differently. Sprayed too thick or too dry, it doesn't look all lumpy or "toady." Instead, it looks way too smooth, like the car has just been dipped in thick, sweet syrup. Sorry, but your car does not look sweet at all.

So it's my guess that you have a compatibility problem, not a thickness problem.

1. What kind of thinner did you use? The correct thinner for 2K urethane clear is low temp reducer. Ordinary lacquer thinner can sometimes cause 2K urethane to curdle. It separates into tiny clumps. Curdled urethane clear would still spray, but it could look exactly like the paint on your Audi. If you still have any thinned clear that hasn't hardened, take a close look at with a magnifying glass.

2. What kind of paint is Finisher's? (2K urethane, 1K urethane, synthetic lacquer, enamel, water-based acrylic or a complete mystery?) Did it dry flat or glossy? The urethane should do okay over either of the urethanes or over the syn lacquer, but I'd definitely worry about the water-based acrylic.

So at this point I'd guess that the color base is okay, and that the problem is the thinner.

I suggest contacting Steve at Hiro to find out if his Zero 2K clear is compatible with the thinner and base coat you used.

Hope you can recover your car. Unlike some people, I think the R8 is a beautiful, well-balanced car. Show us the model when it's done!

Ddms
Thanks for your reply!

1,The thinner is from 2k clear coat package. I mixed it when I paint.
2,I think the finisher's "fine silver" is synthetic lacquer, it smell like zero-paint.

thanks for your advice, I'll try it next day.

I will show it when R8 finished.

What pressure are you using for your Air Brush? I've had a similar look from to low air pressure.

1,The thinner is from 2k clear coat package. I mixed it when I paint.

Well, so much for that theory. Aaargh!

Please let us know when you solve this mystery.

Ddms

I think the clear is too thick. I've used the 2Kclear also without problems, but I've mixed the clear with twice the amount of thinner mentioned on the instructions. Never had a problem spraying and it gives a clean clear shine even without polishing.

What did the base coat look like before you applied the clear? Thick? Thin? Glossy? Flat?

BTW, Zero Clear Coat is not synthetic lacquer; it's two-part urethane.

I've seen that exact effect from color coats sprayed too thickly, but never from urethane clear. So I still think there's a compatibility problem, either with the base coat or with the thinner.

I have the feeling we're not going to get to the bottom of this.

Ddms

I've sprayed the Zero 2K over Finisher's paints before with no adverse reaction, although not over the Finisher's Silver and I know from experience that sometimes silver can be a real pain for reacting with clear coats.
I find it easier to try and keep to the same brand of base coat and clear coat to avoid possible complications and compatibility problems. So Zero base coat with Zero Clear, Finisher's paints with Finisher's clear etc. I know it's not always ideal but it does save on problems in the long run.
If I remember correctly the Finisher's paints are synthetic lacquers, much like Tamiya TS sprays but in jar form instead of aerosol cans.