Alclad Chrome

I'm starting to build a Lotus 25. Tamiya supplied a large "chrome" sprue tree with all the suspension parts plus the exhaust trumpets and some other stuff. Except for the rearview mirror surfaces, I don't want anything on the car to have that fakey-doo plastic chrome finish.

My initial plan was to Soft-Scrub the entire tree and airbrush most of it with Alclad II Chrome lacquer. But then realized I don't have any Alclad base coat. I don't need any other stuff just now, and just placed a big order with Scale Hobbyist, so I'd have to pay shipping for just the base coat.

1. Will I get the same results if I substitute glossy black acrylic for the Alclad base coat?

2. Is there an LHS-available paint that will give me a chrome finish that's as realistic as Alclad II?

Ddms

Yes, You can use any black paint on base for alclad.

1. Will I get the same results if I substitute glossy black acrylic for the Alclad base coat?


Yes, gloss black acrylic will work fine. You can use gloss in other colors also, if you want a slightly colored look tot he chrome.

The quality of the finish of the base acrylic will determine the look of the chrome- so do what you need to get it 'perfect'. If the base finish is good, the Alclad itself is easy to apply.

does the base have to be enamel?..i read in one of the mags(tamiya)that youre supposed to use a black gloss enamel to really make it pop?..also dont you just kinda mist it onreally light?i dont have an airbrush so i use their can alclad chrome

Thanks, koksik and MPWR. I'll just airbrush the pieces with Tamiya gloss black acrylic, thinned with Tam thinner.

Ddms

I'm starting to build a Lotus 25. Tamiya supplied a large "chrome" sprue tree with all the suspension parts plus the exhaust trumpets and some other stuff. Except for the rearview mirror surfaces, I don't want anything on the car to have that fakey-doo plastic chrome finish.

My initial plan was to Soft-Scrub the entire tree and airbrush most of it with Alclad II Chrome lacquer. But then realized I don't have any Alclad base coat. I don't need any other stuff just now, and just placed a big order with Scale Hobbyist, so I'd have to pay shipping for just the base coat.

1. Will I get the same results if I substitute glossy black acrylic for the Alclad base coat?

2. Is there an LHS-available paint that will give me a chrome finish that's as realistic as Alclad II?

Ddms

That's quite funny - I just stripped the chrome tree on my Lotus 25 last night too LOL

I'll be using Gunze Gloss Black as the basecoat for the Alclad.

I'd be very wary of applying Alclad chrome over anything but black enamel.

I applied it over black Tamiya TS spray and it did not stick (looked nice, but you couldn't touch it). Regardless of whether it was applied over dry or wet or damp TS paint. I can't say I've tried acrylic. But Alclad specifically says to apply over black enamel or their own base. It certainly doesn't bond w/Tamiya lacquer. It does bond well w/enamel.

Some hobby shops carry Spaz Stix chrome; it's made for applying inside of clear R/C bodies. It's slightly better than Alclad chrome, and it will stick very nicely to Tamiya TS lacquer.

Regardless what chrome you use, the quality of your base coat is the most important. If the base coat isn't perfect, the chrome won't be. Also you must buff off the dusty overspray from the chrome with an exceptionally soft cloth.

It's easy with practice.

Alclad also becomes more resilient to rubbing off after a few days, so don't touch it too much for the first few days after spraying.

I'd be very wary of applying Alclad chrome over anything but black enamel.

Now that comes as a surprise! According to the label, Alclad is a lacquer. Spraying lacquer over enamel is traditionally a huge no-no. I realize that the new synthetic lacquers are not as "hot" as the old cellulose lacquers, but it still comes as shock.

Oh well, whatever works!

Actually, I'd rather use an enamel undercoat because it's harder than acrylic and it covers better. But I think I ought to let it cure for several days before spraying the Alclad.

Do you think it needs primer? I hesitate to put so many coats of paint on small parts with so many details.

Ddms

A little off topic, but still speaking of Alclad, I just picked up a bottle of their Holomatic Spectral Chrome. I was intrigued, despite the $19.75 price. Anyone use this, and what's so special about it? From my basis research, it offers true 7 color spectrum paint. What's so special about rainbow chrome?

That's quite funny - I just stripped the chrome tree on my Lotus 25 last night too LOL

Great minds etc. Let's keep in touch and compare notes. Are you adding any upgrades?

How did you strip the chrome? I hadn't planned to do that; I've just scrubbed it with Soft Scrub like I do all plastic and resin before painting. I thought that would be sufficient, but maybe not.

What do you guys think? Is the Full Monty really necessary?

Ddms

How did you strip the chrome?
Mr Muscle oven cleaner in spray in a plastiv bag.
I personally will be using primer - mostly to check if I have removed all the seam lines and my putty filling is not visible.

After reading Bob's advice, I have changed my plan and I'll be undercoating the Alclad Chrome using Alclad black base coat. I have a tin but I just never use it for some reason - which is pretty stupid of me because I do have problems with the Alclad finish being very delicate. Time for me to stop cutting corners, I think :D

Yes, I do have a few detail parts for the kit but I won't be doing the 63 box version. I shall be doing a 62, pre-yellow stripe version.

Now that comes as a surprise!

Ddms

Before Alclad sold their own black base coat, their only recommendation for Alclad Chrome was to spray over enamel. The other Alclad finishes could be sprayed over a wider variety of base coats. The chrome needs to "bite" the surface chemically. Alclad Chrome doesn't "bite" into Tamiya TS, that's for sure!

Sometimes following directions is a good thing :sunglasse

Spaz Stix works just the same, is slightly more reflective, and chemically bonds w/black lacquer, so it's become my hobby chrome.

Chrome Test (http://public.fotki.com/grdeyed/model_cars-1/chrome-test/)

Hmm...I just finished putting Alclad base coat on the parts.

I am not an expert on enamels because I never use them but I always thought that they can be thinned/cleaned with White Spirit. However, when I tried to use W. Sprirt to clean my airbrush, it had absolutely no effect at all :o A strong celulose thinner removed it in a jiffy. Also, the base coat seems to become touch-dry rather more quickly than I would have expected from an enamel.

Does that mean that the base coat is not an enamel? Or was I wrong about the W. Spirit? Or are there different kinds of enamels?

I shall be interested to see if the Chrome will be more resilient to handling when applied over this base.

I'd be very wary of applying Alclad chrome over anything but black enamel.

I applied it over black Tamiya TS spray and it did not stick (looked nice, but you couldn't touch it). Regardless of whether it was applied over dry or wet or damp TS paint. I can't say I've tried acrylic. But Alclad specifically says to apply over black enamel or their own base. It certainly doesn't bond w/Tamiya lacquer. It does bond well w/enamel.

Some hobby shops carry Spaz Stix chrome; it's made for applying inside of clear R/C bodies. It's slightly better than Alclad chrome, and it will stick very nicely to Tamiya TS lacquer.

Regardless what chrome you use, the quality of your base coat is the most important. If the base coat isn't perfect, the chrome won't be. Also you must buff off the dusty overspray from the chrome with an exceptionally soft cloth.

It's easy with practice.

Well a few years ago I sprayed all the Alclad colors I had on a styrene sheet to have a color chart. I applied the chrome, stainless steel and polished aluminum over TS14 black and I would leave fingerprints and even rub off pretty easily the first few days, a week later the paint settled pretty well. Recently I tried to rub off the chrome applied on that sheet and nothing came off.

On the other hand I think the first Alclad Black Base I bought was from a bad batch. The paint in that bottle never ever dries completely, the Alclad metallic applied over it would crack after a few weeks, so I stuck with using Tamiya TS14 Black instead and never had problems if I let the chrome dry for a week.

Well, I've settled on a method:

1. I'm stripping the parts with my stand-by: alcohol + purple cleaner.

2. I'll use Testors glossy black spray enamel to prime the parts. They are small and delicate and need to be painted on all sides. That makes it tricky to hold them while I paint them. With parts like that, I'll hold the part with a tweezer, hit it once, let it dry, move the tweez, and hit it again. (I put a little cardstock cover inside the tweezer jaws and fold the edges back. That blends the painted and unpainted areas.)

3. I'll let the enamel cure for just a couple of days.

4. After I airbrush the parts on both sides with Alclad, I'll let them sit for a week before handling them again.

Ddms

I am not an expert on enamels because I never use them but I always thought that they can be thinned/cleaned with White Spirit.

Thinned yes, cleaned no. Once enamel is dry, mineral spirits (aka white spirit) has no effect on it. Lacquer thinner, on the other hand, will dissolve lacquer or enamel even if the paint is 20 years old.

It's similar to the situation with waterborne acrylics. Water won't affect them once they're dry.

Ddms

Thinned yes, cleaned no. Once enamel is dry, mineral spirits (aka white spirit) has no effect on it.

I expressed myself badly. It wasn't dried at all, it was totally fresh and wet paint immediately after tipping out the paint cup.

Mr Muscle oven cleaner in spray in a plastiv bag.


My paint removing stage hasn't been entirely successful. The chrome color came off, but beneath it there's a clear brownish film of some kind. I can get it off by sanding or scraping, but those suspension pieces are fragile, and I don't want to risk breaking them with a lot of handling.

I'm continuing to soak the parts in the alcohol/purplepower mix, but I'm not sure it will work.

Did your oven cleaner method strip off that film completely?

Ddms

My paint removing stage hasn't been entirely successful. The chrome color came off, but beneath it there's a clear brownish film of some kind. I can get it off by sanding or scraping, but those suspension pieces are fragile, and I don't want to risk breaking them with a lot of handling.

I'm continuing to soak the parts in the alcohol/purplepower mix, but I'm not sure it will work.

Did your oven cleaner method strip off that film completely?

Ddms

That clear base can be nearly impossible to remove sometimes, no matter what chemical you use. If that clear wasn't on the plastic, the plating would be a matte finish. It provides the gloss/reflection. Just like a perfectly glossy black base for Alclad.

99% of the time I strip chrome w/Easy Off, it only takes seconds to remove the plating. I leave the clear underneath, it's usually smooth enough to be a good base for the Alclad base coat. You can still remove mold lines and clean a part up w/o having to strip all of that clear base.

I don't go into OCD stress over that clear, and usually only the worst AMT parts from the Mexico era would really need all that clear removed.

I leave the clear underneath, it's usually smooth enough to be a good base for the Alclad base coat.

Yep, these parts are really smooth. And definitely black. So maybe I should just skip the Testors Black Enamel and go directly to Alclad?

Will it stick to that coating?

Ddms

Yep, these parts are really smooth. And definitely black. So maybe I should just skip the Testors Black Enamel and go directly to Alclad?

Will it stick to that coating?

Ddms

That's the million dollar question. No guarantees. You can test it...

Alclad really needs to chemically bond to whatever it's applied to. It does that best with enamel (I don't have the luxury of waiting a week to handle parts shot in Alclad over TS black to see if that theory works...when I know I can shoot Spaz Stix over TS black and be wiping off the overspray in 10 minutes and be done with it, or the same with Alclad over black enamel).

My paint removing stage hasn't been entirely successful. The chrome color came off, but beneath it there's a clear brownish film of some kind. .....

Did your oven cleaner method strip off that film completely?
No, the oven cleaner didn't take it off. I just scraped away the mold lines with a fresh blade to clean up the parts and filled a couple of ejector marks and then put the base coat black over the varnish.

No, the oven cleaner didn't take it off. I just scraped away the mold lines with a fresh blade to clean up the parts and filled a couple of ejector marks and then put the base coat black over the varnish.

Done. Looks good, like enamel should.

Ddms

Try dip the chrome parts into some bleach (Javex), it works very good for removing the chrome.

Try dip the chrome parts into some bleach (Javex), it works very good for removing the chrome.

I try to use the least destructive and least toxic stuff that will do the job, so I think I'll stick with 91% isopropyl alcohol with some Purple Cleaner mixed in. If a drop of bleach goes astray, your shirt has a white spot forever.

I'm done with that stage, by the way. My stripper mix worked just fine. Then I sprayed the stripped parts with Testors Glossy Black Enamel. The Alclad II looks terrific, the best chrome I've seen on models. All in all, the Alclad process went very smoothly; I see why Chilly recommended it. Get well soon, Chilly!

(For certain parts, BMF is great, but for small chassis parts like these, it would be hopeless.)

Ddms