sway bar ends , body roll

This symtpom just started a few weeks ago and just a few months after getting new tires. I think it is mostly new tires fault.

It's best described as wishywashy, body roll, tires, or like there is a big weight on the top of vehicle. It is mostly thought to be on the right front though.

I first thought a stabilizer bar link was broken , but it isn't. The tire shop said the link was broken and there's a front arm bushing that's coming out (which won't affect this symptom)

Stryts and shocks seems ok and equal side to side. No obvious loose or broken components. The stabilizer bar has a funny two piece end swedged together (cracked or seperated on both right and left) This may allow the end of the bar to flex a bit.

My question is two fold really:

what could be the problem ?
how are the ends of the bar suposed to be?

I'm pretty sure you have thought of this but have you checked the tire pressure and made sure the lugs are tight?

Tire pressure yes, I had thought of lug nuts. I better go check them, I forgot. They're probly ok cuz we've had two heavy people hanging onto the luggage rack on both sides rocking back and forth lookin' for stuff. Nothing seems loose or broke. No noises either.

These are tight, really well handling vans. Since you say the tires were changed, and a couple months went by before this began I doubt its tires and I assure you its not loose lug nuts (had that happen before, it makes a thumping noise as the rim bangs the rotor). My thoughts are the front end struts and shocks.
You don't say the year or the milage, but the entire front suspension is sitting on those struts. You mention no noises from the front end--when the lower A arms wear they start to bang around, when the stabilzer bar gets loose it slaps quite a bit and can cause the van to 'hop' when you hit a pot hole, but sway like you describe sounds just like bad struts.

Thanks, struts may be a good guess. It's a 99 with something over 100,000 miles. It did get new rear shocks about 6 months ago (they were leaking air)

I sure did a lot of pressing down on the front end when we were checking it, I didn't see any oil from struts. Both of them made the same reaction and noise as well. They did't really bouncy bouncy like bad shocks would. I figured they were ok , but if I am going to throw money at it then front struts might be where I start. In addition I may weld the ends of the sway bar together or replace it.

It seems odd that she (driver) would notice the symptom all of a sudden.

The ends of the stabilizer bar are split like you see. One side is up, the other down. Not sure why its done that way, but thats how it should be. While you are looking, get the front end up in the air (both tires) and see if you can rock the steering left or right. I'm thinking tie rod ends, linkage in steering, etc. There just isn't much to play with on these vans, its pretty much all in the strut and the A arm/ball joints.

If the shop said that a lower control arm bushing was bad, that could definitely cause handling issues. If you are handy, the bushings are cheap and can be changed fairly easily with an air hammer. I'd get the bushings repaired first before searching for other problems especially if they are bad.

Thanks, both. I'll probably jack it up and check stuff out a lot more thoroughly this weekend. And then maybe wind up doing a number of things if they need done in addition to welding the ends together on the bar.

Is it customary to check struts with a "bounce test" like checking for bad shocks?

It doesn't always catch a bad strut. If you have more than 50k-60k miles on the van, struts wouldn't be a bad idea anyway. Replace the bearing plate while you're at it also.

At 10 years old, the springs are weak and probably sagged. The auto parts stores have "quick struts" that come with springs, bearing plates, and of course the strut. Bolt 'em in and get an alignment.

I did a complete front end rebuild of my 2000 Venture in Nov 2008...quick struts, lower control arms, sway bar bushings, sway bar end links, brakes & rotors. You can buy replacement lower control arms for about $65 each at RockAuto. The new control arm has both bushings plus a new balljoint so you'd be addressing several potential problems at once. While you're at, replace the sway bar bushings & the sway bar end links. The sway bar diameter will have to be measured because there were several different sizes used...mine was 1.34". Make sure to use polyurethane bushings, not rubber. I picked up Moog poly sway bar bushings for $11 for the pair & Moog poly end links for $5 each...got em at Carquest. I got Monroe quick struts thru Amazon for about $160 each/shipped.

Here's two tricks that will save you some hassle when removing/replacing the stuts.

1. completely remove the wiper linkage to give you some room to work. The upper strut mounting nuts are a bitch to get at. You *should* be able to get at 2 of the 3 nuts with a socket, but the 3rd will have to be remove with an open end/box wrench. And because the nuts used are the nylon locking type, you pretty much have to wrench them out all the way.

2. before installing the new strut, look at the two lower mounting holes. If the uppermost hole is just that, a hole, not a slot, take a rat tail file & elongate it slightly in the "in-out" direction (not "up-down"). This will give you the play you'll need to get the camber adjustment done. If you don't do this step & take the van in for an alignment, the shop will charge a hefty fee to do it for you.

The following diagram will show you what I mean about slotting the hole, however, it has the lower hole slotted. You should actually do the upper hole as shown in the 2nd picture (obviously a performance strut). The slotting doesn't have to be nearly as drastic as shown...1/16" to 1/8" is all you'll need.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m232/bikewiz/156937.gif

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_JoN9797qIes/SNj3JYRiISI/AAAAAAAAAxs/ity_PLuYpkQ/s400/Dog+3+-+KW+Front+Shock+Assy.jpg

Good luck.

We really checked a lot of stuff out on the front end of this. The only problem that is seen is the sway bar ends are "cracked" or split in two pieces. My helper says it is a hollow bar that is just squeezed on the ends to make it flat.

I think it is flexing because the part that is squeezed is cracked on both sides and can be replaced or welded. It's liek a pipe that was squeezed flat and then the sides cracked.

The sway bar is solid, and the end links must hold the bar firmly in place or the vehicle will... sway ;)

I thought all bars were solid too. I will soon find out. I suppose all one has to do is pick one up to see how heavy it is.

If bar is solid then what are the ends of it made from? different peices welded or pressed in?

The Chevy dealer picked one up for me today and he said it was hollow. I had guessed that it was solid. If it really is hollow then I can see why it is split on all four sides since a hollow pipe has a tendancy to do that when squeezed flat and should be very easy to repair. The bars are about $100.

Cool, I guess that answers that! I've never seen a hollow one before, sounds pretty cheezy to me.

I finally got the bar out and is definately a hollow bar. Both bottoms halfs of the ends were broken. No broken links. It would act like a bar that was only about half strength. Now I have to decide whether to weld the original or pay the $97 dollars to buy new.

I suppose I can have it repaired in an hr or two with labor figured at about $50. I'd be mad if it broke very soon though. If the new one broke within a year I'd be mad too. New links and bushings are in order regardless of which way I decide.

I have heard of hollow sway bars. I think they are used to save unsprung weight. I wouldn't weld it. This sway bar acts like a torsion spring bar and welding on it might change it's temper and spring rate tendencies. Besides, since it broke it was probably defective and should be replaced with a new one anyway.

Welded bar and we'll see how it holds up and if it really fixes the original complaint. I'll be mad if it breaks , but is stronger than the original I think.

The brackets had rust that was twice as thick as the braket itself. :screwy:

At least I get all new bushings,links, and the one front lower a-arm bushing that is coming out will be replaced or repaired.

Wouls someone please post whether the center of the bar bends UP or Down? It's about 4-8 (length) inches of bow in the middle and I can't find my note from when I took apart. douhhuhoh. I'm guessing it goes (bows ) UP ^^

Thanks very much.

It goes UP ^^ and job is done. I've since seen another one broke same way on a camaro. Same guy who fixed mine for me fixed this one too on the vehicle.

The original complaint was fixed by the sway bar. Broken bar really was the problem.