The arrogant Empire

I know that I said I was going to stay out of here, because I tend to be somewhat of a hothead about politics, but after reading this LONG article. I have to post it here.

After reading I began to feel very different about many things. Especially the Bush Administraition, also I am also terrified that this could really be true of what the Bush Admin has in mind...
The author of this article seems to back his story up by a lot of facts, figures ect.

My way of thinking now is that all the Bush admin cares about is to create and win wars to demonstrate his (our) power and could care less about international cooperation.

I'm not very good at talking about this kind of thing but I just had to get it off my chest.

Give it a read. I don't think you will regret it.
THE ARROGANT EMPIRE (http://www.msnbc.com/news/885222.asp)
Then again I could be wrong though.

I am beginning to regret the Bush admins strike first and ask questions later policy.

Give the link awhile to load it takes a while even on a DSL connection.
It is a super long article.
:D

Originally posted by John
Give the link awhile to load it takes a while even on a DSL connection.
It is a super long article.
:D

Well, I'm less than 1/2 way through it, but it is VERY interesting thus far.

This is excellent stuff :eek: Definitley creatse an excellent case for the anti-war lobbyists

I've read the whole thing. It does a pretty good job of explaining why the Europeans are fucked off (though doesnt really explain why the Americans should care) but what does any of it have to do with removing Saddam?
Until someone comes up with a better idea than removing him by force (and no, doing nothing, believing his bullshit and generally being his bitch isnt a better idea), I will support the US and Britain

saddam :rocket:

Originally posted by XXstealth
I've read the whole thing. It does a pretty good job of explaining why the Europeans are fucked off (though doesnt really explain why the Americans should care) but what does any of it have to do with removing Saddam?
Until someone comes up with a better idea than removing him by force (and no, doing nothing, believing his bullshit and generally being his bitch isnt a better idea), I will support the US and Britain

saddam :rocket:

I wish that the Bush Admin would have given the UN inspectors more time. I thought that they were doing a fine job of inspecting IRAQ's nuclear, chemical, and Bio technology after all they are supposed to give an unbiased report of what saddam has in his arsenal.


Thoughts?

Originally posted by John


I wish that the Bush Admin would have given the UN inspectors more time. I thought that they were doing a fine job of inspecting IRAQ's nuclear, chemical, and Bio technology after all they are supposed to give an unbiased report of what saddam has in his arsenal.


Thoughts?


i may be wrong on this.......but i thought that saddam didnt let them check the nuclear weapons and tahts why the war started?

Originally posted by De$i Gank$ta



i may be wrong on this.......but i thought that saddam didnt let them check the nuclear weapons and tahts why the war started?

IRAQ(Saddam) was allowing the inspector in at least.

But according to the news, the Bush Admin and Colon Powell said Saddam had moved all of the banned items on the UN list to sites that were off limits or out of reach of the inspectors.

I sure would like to know the full story, or the truth on this for that matter.

I just have a bad feeling about this war.

Are we taking it a little to far?

I think maybe we should have just quietly removed Saddam rather than rampaging over there and blowing the hell out of everything especially since very few supported war with IrAQ.

I for one sure the hell hope we can find something awful over there to justify our actions against them....

The US will not look good if all they have is a few hundred 40 year old jets, some 30 year old tanks and ect ect.

I personally think the UN should have done more to persuade US to seek a more peaceful resolution to the havoc that is going on now.

Sure the US seems to have unlimited pockets when it comes to blowing up ppl that don't see things our way but I wish they would work a little harder at bettering our own country and finding homes and jobs for the less fortunate, how about spending some of the war money on things like education, homelessness and healthcare.

I love America, it is my country but lately it seems our prioritys are a little off.

since 911 and the Bush Admin we have taken on a fuck with us and die campaign.

I just want to live in piece let bygons be bygons and drink my beer and eat fatty foods and be merry.

Ya i have to agree with John, but it was North Korea that kicked the UN inspection guys outa their contry not Iraq. Iraq was working along with the UN gave reports and everything but the US said its not enough, and that Saddam was lieing outa his fat arss and has the funds to HIDE it any where he wants to. Iraq has alot of money hidden there, well maybe just Saddam but just like the US Government, spend it unwasely and wast alot of the money on crap instead of helping our own ppl we go and try to be heros... Hey there is alot of ppl outa jobs right now im lucky to have work i have lots of friends with no work, but hey lets go kick some tyrant's butt instead of helping our own ppl out first!!

Im not saying Saddam shouldnt be taken outa power but Hey takeing him and his son's out would of been alot easier and cheaper then all out war!! against guys with pistals and rifles. Our military power is so overwelming to them, but ohh well i just hope our gas prices goes back down :bloated: :bloated:

getting late and im outa work WHOO HOO friday nite!!!

:D :D :sun: :flash:

Very good article and I agree with most of the authors points. However, I think the part about economics needs more explaination.
As America continues to be the largest producing country and other nations are carrying the constantly growing burden of socialism this economic "gulf" will continue to widen.
What America needs to export is more capitolism. Without potential financial reward creativity, risk, and innovation suffer. We create and produce more because we have more potential reward. Shops in Europe close in the early afternoon because after a certain number of hours they are working simply to line the governments pockets.
We do need to abolish our tariffs and allow for more foreign products to come in, even if it means some job losses. But, we also need to build-up our manufacturing as too not "enslave" the 3rd world as our labor. Not as easy as it seems, is it?
We do need to work with other nations more appropriately and I'm betting the Bush administration will soon see the light. After Saddam's removal we will have to forge a stronger bond with other countries and mend fences.
I've said it before, Bush was bluffing the entire time before the attack and trying to scare Saddam out of Iraq without a war. Who expected so much opposition and protest, which only served to steel Saddam's will to stay. The protesters are as much responsible for the war as Bush is...

originally posted by Murco
We do need to work with other nations more appropriately and I'm betting the Bush administration will soon see the light. After Saddam's removal we will have to forge a stronger bond with other countries and mend fences.
I've said it before, Bush was bluffing the entire time before the attack and trying to scare Saddam out of Iraq without a war. Who expected so much opposition and protest, which only served to steel Saddam's will to stay. The protesters are as much responsible for the war as Bush is...

Very good point. I don't think Saddam would have sat it out to the point of no return, had it not been for so much opposition to the war from all of the other countries that were opposed to conflict in the M East.

Sure we have the power to pummel him but and everyone knows that.

But what did he have to gain by ignoring Bush's warning to leave Iraq or face war? and end up almost killed.

This is what I cannot figure out.

Was it another strategic move to gain more allies or what?

Input please...

i owuld like to make the pint that saddam has kicked the inspectors out of iraq many times. the point is not to show the weapons by the way it is to show and destroy them also just today patriot missiles have shot down iraqi missles that saddam "didnt have" and claimed were gone. interesting i htink.

-GTi-VR6_A3

THE STORY, WHICH examines the United States’ rise to economic and military world dominance and how the current administration’s foreign policy is squandering good will among its natural allies, drew reactions from all over the world, not all of it positive. One woman in Atlanta reminds us that “President Bush went to the United Nations, not as the head of an ‘arrogant’ country, but as the leader of a country at serious risk for further attacks by terrorists.” And one man from Austin, Texas, writes “What the author forgot to tell us is that during the last 100 years America has given the world everything, and the world has done nothing for America! Nothing!”



The rebuffs make much more sense

Originally posted by 1985_BMW318i




The rebuffs make much more sense

No, the U.S. hasn't bought oil from the Middle East. No, the U.S. hasn't imported a SHITLOAD of steel from foreign shores. No, the U.S. hasn't used cheap labor from over seas to keep "competitive pricing" at a low. I agree, the world has done NOTHING but help bolster our economy. (This in response to the second guy's quote in your quotation)

Were there points in the article that I didn't agree with? Sure, but I will say I do mostly agree with most of the points raised.

The U.N. gave him 12 years to comply with it's resolutions from the first Gulf War and he chose not to. If the U.N. had done what it was supposed to do maybe we wouldn't be doing it ourselves. My personal view is this whole mess could have been avoided but the U.N. failed in it's very reason for existing. This was also on the internet...


> Here are 10 things to consider when voicing an opinion
> on this important issue:
>
> 1) Between President Bush and Saddam Hussein. . .
> Hussein is the bad guy.
>
> 2) If you have faith in the United Nations to do the
> right thing, keep this in mind. They have Libya
> heading the Committee on Human Rights and Iraq heading
> the Global Disarmament Committee. Do your own math
> here.
>
> 3) If you use Google Search and type in "French
> Military Victories," your reply will be "Did you mean
> French Military Defeats?"
>
> 4) If your only anti-war slogan is "No war for oil,"
> sue your school district for allowing you to slip
> through the cracks and robbing you of the education
> you deserve.
>
> 5) Saddam and Bin Laden will not seek United Nations
> approval before they try to kill us.
>
> 6) Despite what some seem to believe, Martin Sheen is
> NOT the President. He just plays one on TV.
>
> 7) Even if you are anti-war, you are still an
> "Infidel" and Bin Laden wants you dead, too.
>
> 8) If you believe in a "vast right-wing conspiracy,"
> but not in the danger that Hussein poses, quit hanging
> out with the Dell computer dude.
>
> 9) We are trying to liberate them. He is trying to
> kill us.
>
> 10) Whether you are for military action, or against
> it, our young men and women overseas are fighting for
> us to defend our right to speak out. We all need to
> support them without reservation.
>
Now I do not condone war, nor some of what I posted above but it brings up interesting thought's. From what I've seen in here there are alot of you that could be drafted and my prayers go out to you if you are. My true feelings are the U.N. needs a total revamp and needs all countries involvement. The one thing I have trouble with is half the countries not giving support sure didn't mind it when we helped them in their time of need IE WWII and the whole European theatre.