Ignition Control Module? Help?

All,

So a few days ago my check engine light came on and I checked the code and had a cylinder 6 misfire. Since I hadn't changed the plugs for a couple years, I figured I'd change those and the wires and see if that solved the problem. I also found out that the plenum gasket was leaking and replaced that, resealed the injectors and all that jazz. The check engine light never came back on and the car seemed to run fine. I'll admit that it didn't purr like it has in the past, but no one would even notice but me.

Well a couple of days ago, I got a recall notice from Pontiac saying that the front rocker gasket was leaking oil on the exhaust manifold and causing fires. I took it to the dealership for the free repair and they called me saying that my ignition control module was bad and that it would cost $600 to repair. I called Auto Zone and they told me the part was $130 with a lifetime warranty. I then called my usual mechanic and he told me that if the ignition control module was bad, the car would be running horrible and would be dying when the engine got to normal operating temperature.

So I'm going to pick up the car this afternoon and I'm trying to decide if I should tell the dealership to go to @#$# or if I should go ahead and replace the module. My mechanic told me that if I decided to replace it, that it was an easy job (I have NO clue; this is the first car I've owned that didn't have a distributor). I'm embarrassed to say it, but I don't even know where the ignition control module is on this car.

Does anyone have any experience, pearls of wisdom, advice, etc?

Thanks for the help!

OK 1ST NO on module!!with out diagnosing 1st.why did dealer say it was bad??im guessing u didnt go through the history of car & if its running good
i dont no why u were told module was bad.

The ignition control module is what triggers the coils to fire via inputs from sensors feeding the PCM. As your mechanic stated, if the ICM was bad, the car would be running bad, missing, etc... It sounds like the dealership was trying to soak you. Even a Delco ICM only costs $180 or so, and takes about 20 minutes to install, so $600 is rediculous!!

1st things 1st - don't let the dealership change it for $600.

Next - there's no reason to give the dealership any lip, just ask why they think it needs to be changed. I'm guessing they removed it to change the valve cover & saw something they didn't like. Let us know!

The ICM is the module that the coils are mounted to. Remove the 6 5.5mm bolts holding the coils & loosen the 7 mm bolt that holds the wiring harness. Pull the wiring harness out of the module & you're half way there. Seriously, 7 bolts & about 15 minutes is all it takes to swap modules. If you want an AC Delco module they're about $200 online.

Here's another question; how exactly do they "test" an ignition control module?

I'll definitely get more info from the dealership to find out why they think it needs to be changed. He said that the car wasn't running well and it was due to the ignition control module. He didn't say anything in regard to finding damage or corrosion, or anything like that, but I'll ask when I pick it up. Thank you for the pointers! I'll make sure to update this tomorrow and let you know how it turns out.

You can test it by removing it and bringing it to the neareast autozone or advance. They will check it for free.

:banghead:

SO!! Are you ready for part two of our series?

So yesterday I go to pick up my car from the dealership. I declined having them change the control module. After considering all of the facts, I figured that perhaps they discovered that I was losing 1/4 of a gallon on my MPG and wanted to get a quick $600 for it; an inconvenience I was willing to live with.
I walk into the office and I begin going over the "invoice." I notice that on the invoice, they had documented, "customer complains of a burning oil smell,":sly: which when I brought it in, I said NOTHING of the sort! I asked to talk to the tech because I wanted more info on this module situation. He came to the service office and I asked him how much the part was and he said $350, and labor would take 2 hours at $100 per hour. Then I asked him how they determined that the control module was bad. He said, "we can just tell by how it's running." :runaround:
After receiving those gems, I decided to take my keys and go. Well I went to my car, started it up and surprise, surprise, it ran worse than it ever has since I've owned the thing. Keep in mind that it was running absolutely fine when I brought it in there! My car ran how I imagine it would it all of the spark plug wires were incorrectly matched with the spark plugs. It sputtered and struggled and ran like absolute garbage. I called my usual mechanic right there and told him what had happened and he said they would be happy to look at it for me. He said that where it was running completely fine when I brought it to the dealership, it was unlikely that the module was bad.
Although the car was running like it was underwater, it was still "running," and I decided to quickly run it over to my usual mechanic as he was not far from the dealership. I got about 300 yards from the dealership and became deeply concerned about damaging anything when I discovered that I practically had to floor the gas pedal to get the car to go anywhere. I quickly pulled over and called the service department manager and played the entire story for him. He said to bring it back and they'd look at it again (they were about to close so that's one more day without a car). I pulled my car in the garage and had a brief chat with our manager friend. He said that they'd take a look to see what was the matter and mentioned trying to get GM to help pay for repairs since this problem came from servicing a recall repair. I have my doubts that GM will be so generous.
So here I am awaiting news from the dealership. Needless to say, the chances of me ever going there again are about as good as my chances of me becoming president of the United States.:mad:

Once I get a call from these...people...I'll fill in the rest. Stay tuned for PART III of "The Dealership from the Black Lagoon."

Although the recall involves just replacing the front valve cover gasket and cover bolt grommets plus a few of the ignition wire retainers, I recall the coil packs and ignition control module to include mounting bracket should be removed since it blocks the far right valve cover bolts.

So technically if the problem developed after their work they could be responsible. Maybe they did not install it back properly or use proper sealant. Also, check the ignition control module ground wire.

Although the recall is well known by the dealerships they have to annotate a trouble such as customer complains of burning smell. Without it they may not get reimbursed from GM.

Yes, the service manager did mention that they did have to remove the coils, etc. I'm really holding my breath on this one.
What do you think the chances are that any damage was caused as a result of my driving the car 300 or so yards? My usual mechanic said that there was a risk of damaging the cat. converter.
I can somewhat see the logic to their putting that there was a problem (burning oil smell) for GM to pay for the recall, but I would think that the simple fact the GM themselves sent me a letter and told me to go get it fixed would be reason enough!

PART III - A New Hope

So I just received a call from the service manager. He said that after they've looked into it, they discovered that the problem was in fact the ignition control module. He said he's figuring that it was old and because it was "disturbed," it could've been enough to finish it off. He said that he's confident that it's now running better than it was when I first brought it in (we'll see). He said that GM wouldn't help with cost or anything. He said they aren't going to charge me for any labor, and his cost on the OEM module is $240. He asked if I'd be willing to just cover the cost of the part. I told him that I just barely poured $900 into repairs two weeks ago and couldn't go that high. I asked him if I could get the part from Autozone and he said he couldn't do that. He then offered to split the cost and have me pay half (which is about what the Autozone part would cost). I agreed and thanked him for being willing to do that.

So do you think I got a fair deal or do you think I got screwed? (Pending my picking up the car and actually seeing for myself that it's running well.)

i think you got a pretty good deal. sounds to me like this service manager is actually a pretty nice guy and not afraid to admit to his employees mistakes. you said yourself it wasnt running "like it used to" before you brought it in. i would say if it runs like it used to when you get it back...you got yourself a pretty da*n good deal, considering the fact that you would have had to replace it at one time or another.

I'd agree with that. Now let's just hope it runs well when I pick it up! :iceslolan

I disagree. Ignition modules either work or don't. They don't fail from being unbolted and rebolted down unless they did something wrong. I would make sure you get the old part in your hands before you pay the bill. If it's cracked or chipped, don't give them a dime for the new one. They broke it, they replace it. That's what you're paying them for. What if they snapped off some bolts removing the valve cover gasket? Would you be willing to split the cost of a new head or the labor to extract the broken bolt(s)? I'm thinking you wouldn't. Just because they messed up a part they claim was ready to go, that's crap. They said what they said because they broke an expensive part, and didn't want to have to eat it.

He'll probably just say that they've thrown it away already. I'll try when I pick up the car.

Most states have laws governing this sort of thing. In Michigan, the consumer has the right to the return of all replaced parts, except those deemed too heavy or bulky, or that require a core deposit from the manufacturer. On those parts, you have the right to inspect them before you pay the bill. This keeps unscrupulous dealerships and shop owners from claiming the replaced parts that they didn't.

:rolleyes:

I recall some of us that know better made mention in the Recall Thread that the recall notice was going to be disregarded since the primary issue which is the front valve cover gasket and bolt grommets were already replaced way before GM decided it was an issue. This is a prime example of why I do all my work DIY and do not depend on any of the local GM dealers for service or parts. The recall notices are in the trash bin.

BTW - Just my two cents worth but I don't see where this was a good deal. :grinno:

00GTP4ME, how easy would it have been for the dealership to have just switched around a couple spark plug wires, just to make your car run bad, and claim its the ICM? Now you go on and "pay" for a "new" one, and all they do to "install" a new one is to switch the wires back the right way?

just thinking out loud... I'd be curious

I watched a documentary one time about (Goodyear?) I think it was. They were pushing their mechanics to sell parts to the consumer that werent really needed, then not replacing anything and pocketing the cash.

Wish I had a copy of that video, it was quite interesting.

:rolleyes:

I recall some of us that know better made mention in the Recall Thread that the recall notice was going to be disregarded since the primary issue which is the front valve cover gasket and bolt grommets were already replaced way before GM decided it was an issue. This is a prime example of why I do all my work DIY and do not depend on any of the local GM dealers for service or parts. The recall notices are in the trash bin.

BTW - Just my two cents worth but I don't see where this was a good deal. :grinno:

Yeah, how stupid is that? Both valve cover gaskets are made of the same material, and there's an exhaust manifold back there too...Idiots

I think I'm gonna have them replace it for me just cause I'm an A$$hole and want to see what the "redesigned" spark plug wire clip looks like.

My valve cover gaskets dont appear to be leaking, but I think I will replace them both again this summer anyways.

Yeah, how stupid is that? Both valve cover gaskets are made of the same material, and there's an exhaust manifold back there too...Idiots

No doubt in my mind Tim the GM valve cover gaskets are crappy. :grinyes: None of my L67s or L36 have the original valve cover gaskets and I switched over to the FelPro brand.

I would definitely ask for the old ICM module and at least run it over to Autozone and get a bench test run on it. May not reveal anything but you never know for sure. Plus out of curiosity I'd probably test it in one of my other cars since the ICM modules are the same. :sly:

Bob, how hard is it to change the rear valve cover gasket? Lot of stuff have to come out of the way? I guess I never really looked. It cant be that bad

Bob, how hard is it to change the rear valve cover gasket? Lot of stuff have to come out of the way? I guess I never really looked. It cant be that bad

its easy if you have the tool that connects to the front motor mounts and pulls the motor forward. if you dont have that tool, its a pretty big bi*ch cuz you dont have much room to work with. other than the working room issue, its pretty much the same difficulty as the front

Bob, how hard is it to change the rear valve cover gasket? Lot of stuff have to come out of the way? I guess I never really looked. It cant be that bad

Not really Tim. IMO it is easier than the front cover gasket since you don't have to mess with the engine mounts or the coil packs/ICM module. The biggest item to get out of the way would be the alternator and mounting bracket which is an easy job.

PART IV - FINALE

I made it to the dealership and went to the service office. I paid the agreed amount and decided that if my car ran any less than acceptable I was going to raise hades and demand to see the old part. They brought the car around and it seemed to be running rather smoothly. I sat it there and felt for vibrations, sputters, or anything else and I was relieved when there weren't any.
After driving it around for about an hour I would say it's now running a little better than when I brought it in. If on a scale of 1-10, 10 being running perfectly, I would say that when I brought it in, it was at an 9.0 and now it's probably a 9.2 - 9.3. Good enough for me.

Thank you everyone for your advice and input, it was VERY helpful! :cheers:

Bob, today I had a look at my "leaking oil pan gasket", not sure if your aware, but I'm down about a half a quart of oil between changes.

I just assumed it was my pan gasket since every time I fill up, it always seems covered in oil. Today I had a look and noticed its coovering my firewall, and rack and pinion, and realized its coming from my back valve cover gasket. HA

Hows that for irony? Just recieve the stupid recall notice in the mail for the front valve cover gasket, and it turns out, that my back one is leaking. Just my luck!

So, I bought a set of valve cover gaskets (fel-pro) and I'm gonna change the rear gasket, maybe tomorrow or saturday after work if its not raining outside. I am going to leave the front one alone, and have the dealer change it, and get the updated spark plug wire retainer, then after they are done, come home and replace the one they just put in with the fel-pro one.

How long do you think it will take the dealership to change the gasket? I really hate having anyone other than myself working on my car. Especially the punk teens that work for the dealership that think they know how everything goes.

Gosh thats stupid,.... (replace one valve cover gasket) Still pisses me off.

Bob, today I had a look at my "leaking oil pan gasket", not sure if your aware, but I'm down about a half a quart of oil between changes.

I just assumed it was my pan gasket since every time I fill up, it always seems covered in oil. Today I had a look and noticed its coovering my firewall, and rack and pinion, and realized its coming from my back valve cover gasket. HA

Good thing you found the source of the leak Tim. Could have been a real fire hazard. Also, don't forget to replace the bolt grommets which should come with the FelPro kit. Whatever you do, do not over torque. 89 in-lbs only. Crosshatch pattern from the inside to outside bolts. I use strictly 1/4" drive tools only on valve cover gaskets and a 2-200 in-lb 1/4" drive clicking off torque wrench.

If you have the Mitchell's guide it should list the hours. IMO with a good auto tech around 1.0 hrs with cleaning. The problem I hate about taking it to the dealer is drop it off at 8 am and pick it up sometime in the afternoon routine. :screwy: