Best Turbo upgrades?

If you were going to upgrade your r32 skyline's turbo's.... Would you do a single or dual. I am going to stick to stock block but will do engine managment, injectors/fuel pumps, clutch..... Let me know what you would do for the best value for the money. I have a nitrous system to use to spool up turbo or use with system. I want to have upgrade room when I can afford internals... Any recomendations on turbos....
The engine is out of car now.

Its a direct shot N2O system, it better be or number 6 will be fried. I am not into the singles, meaning I do not know much about them. If I had the funds, I heard very good things about the New HKS GT-RS turbos. If money is an issue, 2530 are a good all around turbo. 2540, have a little more lag, but should be better for the 1/4.

Have at least 600cc with the 2530. Sean mention, get your injector flow checked, put the best flowing in number 6.

What is the purpose of the car?

If your going to keep the stock internals use the 2530's like mentioned above. You can put some pretty serious numbers to the ground and still have a very driveable automobile...Check out Sport Compact Cars Ultimate Street Car Challange...he ran 2530's from my understanding and put 509whp. I've got a Skyline on order as well as an HKS T51 SPO Single Turbo kit. I've got a Single in my Supra and love it. THe only problem with this kit is that it is almost a necissity to use stronger internals. HKS makes a T51 KAI that will put about 800 whp but it is pushing the limits of the internals in the car...and it's about 7 grand

car is gonna be for driving, and some drag and some road coars. Its not a full out race car but want to take to track to put down some good numbers.... Its a demo car for a shop. The Nitrous kit I have from old car is a nitrous express wet system for a corvette. nozzels from 35-150..... My turbo numbers I would like to be upgradble when next season we pull engine and replace internals then. Could a single turbo be still effecient driving around town, and even at low numbers of around 550-650. I know mario put down about 700hp at wheels with no internal upgrades, He just did all fuel nesecarry.

HKS 2530's are great street turbos, but you are not going to see much more than 580 hp total out of them, even with internals done running huge boost. The just won't flow it.

A lot depends on how much lag you can live with, how hard you want the power to come on, and what rev range you wish to live in. Slapping a T51R Kia to the T51 SPL you are not going to see tractable boost until around the 5,500 rpm mark, and that is providing you have a radical set of cams, ported head, extractor (header style) exhaust mainfold, and very solid internals inlcuding ARP rod bolts, conrod, and forged pistons to handle that sort of boost and power levels.

For drivability on the street 2835's is the largest I would go, but honestly 2540 Rspec would be a better choice. They should flow up to about 650 hp total and boost threshold will be around the 4,600 rpm mark. Once you break into that 750hp range you will need to upgrade to a steel forged crank also. Just for a bit more info once you exceed that 550hp mark the factory gearbox will shat it self pretty quickly. An OS Giken gear kit will fix that but again they are bloody expensive and if you have an R32 more so as you need to change over some of the other internal bits as OS Giken only make them for the R33 style box.

Contrary to popular belief the factory block even the R34 block is not that strong. They have a nasty tendency to crack between the #3 and #4 cylinders once you start pushing over 850hp. This is a common fault with the design of the block.
There are two race teams here in New Zealand who run GTR's for drags. Both cars are extremely well engineered, tuned and built. Together they have went through 5 blocks in 2 years. They have even went to the N1 block and still are cracking them. Both are pushing between 1,000 and 1,200 hp using single turbos. One is using an HKS T51R SPL and the other a Trust T8834D. One is into the 8's and the other has run a flat 9 on street tyres.

There are so many variables that trying to put the lot in this single post is something that I am not going to do. I don't want to put you off but if your looking for serious poke out of RB26 engine you are opening a very expensive can of worms. If you can live with around the 550 hp mark as a daily driver you can keep the expense down as long as your not intending to race the car.

nitrous express wet system for a corvette. nozzels from 35-150

That will not work. I mean it will, but your engine will not last very long

I know of a couple of GTRs in the states that are over 600hp with the 2530s, which should be plent of power for what you want.

2530 will be able to push the engine to a safe limit, and still be able to get a lot of driving time. If you start pushing a lot more than that, that is when you start digging into your pockets a lot more. They are direct bolt on, which is why I will probaly go that route.

My tech skills may not be the best, but isn't adding N2O like mixing Red Bull and Tequila. Gets you going strong all night long but at the end of the night it drops you off the edge like Wile E. Coyote. Plus you get a nasty hang-over in the morning.

The RB26DETT intake design is crap, thats why a single nozzle will not work. Only a direct N2O system will work.

N2O is a fine power adder, just have to make sure you know what you are doing. I know of a lot Stangs, and Camaros with over 100,000miles on the engines that run 100shot or greater.

Originally posted by SkylineUSA
N2O is a fine power adder
IF you are a drag racer... :)

Sami,

Yes, and no. It all depends on how you use it, or I should say how much you use it and at what RPM range. It can be very beneficial, if thought out and used right.

Originally posted by SkylineUSA
Yes, and no. It all depends on how you use it, or I should say how much you use it and at what RPM range. It can be very beneficial, if thought out and used right.
Lets say you're going to spend the day road racing at track, how long is the N2O bottles going to last you? I know it depends on the bottles and how much power you're looking to add with them but could you expect them to last you all day of heavy use? (yes, my knowledge of N2O is limited to theory:))

Speaking of the bottle size, how much weight would the equipment add? When you're talking about usable power, you need to make sure it is available to you all the time.

What about street racing. Summer time is gonna be coming up quick. Would it be worth the time to even think about adding a N2O system. Personally I would rather add HP through kit upgrades. What I am asking is it feasible.

Originally posted by Assasin11-17
What about street racing. Summer time is gonna be coming up quick. Would it be worth the time to even think about adding a N2O system. Personally I would rather add HP through kit upgrades. What I am asking is it feasible.
Street racing is pretty much like drag racing so adding N2O wouldn't hurt unless you're building a road race car. Bigger turbos that provide more flow, add N2O to spool them up. Now that would of course create lag when you're out of N2O...

For a streetable R32 GT-R you're going to best off with something like the HKS GT-RS turbos (similar to 2530's, provide the same power but spool up quicker) if you can find them. There really isn't any need for N2O, IMHO.

Ok Im pretty set on doing a dual turbos in the car, Im tryign to keep stock internals and to be able to upgrade tiny bit more down the road as far as internals go and gearbox, what would be better 2530? or 2835r's?
Next is there any other compnaies other than hks? so the gearbox would only be able to hold 550hp? Any recomendations on clutches and then internals would be good till about what hp level or boost level?

Kyle

ORC makes a good twin plate. Thats what I have in mine right now. There was a good thread about it not to long ago on this site. If I remember correctly Singles are good up to about 400 hp plus or minus. Thats where I blew my last one. Twin are good up to about 700 ish. Triple plates are for anything higher. Twin plates take awhile to get used to and then some. Mine still pisses me off once in awhile. I was told that Triple plates take about a month and then some to get used to. It all depends on how much hp you are wanting to go. I am still undecided but I will definatly get a ecu, metal head gasket next, and some increased boost. I was told that would put me up to about 475.

Lets say you're going to spend the day road racing at track, how long is the N2O bottles going to last you? I know it depends on the bottles and how much power you're looking to add with them but could you expect them to last you all day of heavy use? (yes, my knowledge of N2O is limited to theory)

Haven't we gone over this before:p

The whole system weighs about 20lbs, 16 of it is the bottle. R32s under steer, so a little more weight in the back is not going to hurt. With a 10lbs bottle, it can last around 100sec give or take a few total at a 100shot. There is no way I am going to go with a 100shot, I can jet the system down to a 25shot, so that about a 50hp gain for 400sec. The only time to really use it would be the straights, so say you on a 2 mile course for 15 laps, so you have about 28 sec of N2O for each lap. If used properly, it would be very beneficial, just for the spool up, with a window activator, as well.


Ok Im pretty set on doing a dual turbos in the car, Im tryign to keep stock internals and to be able to upgrade tiny bit more down the road as far as internals go and gearbox, what would be better 2530? or 2835r's?


With you wanting to do stock internals, 2530 will be able to push your drive train to the limit, and still make it a very reliable, and streetable car. 2835, are a lot more laggy, and make more power up top, but to get the full benefit from them a cam change would be advantageous, for the proper engine marriage:D

ORC makes a good twin plate. That's what I have in mine right now. There was a good thread about it not to long ago on this site. If I remember correctly Singles are good up to about 400 hp plus or minus. That's where I blew my last one. Twin are good up to about 700 ish. Triple plates are for anything higher. Twin plates take awhile to get used to and then some. Mine still pisses me off once in awhile. I was told that Triple plates take about a month and then some to get used to. It all depends on how much hp you are wanting to go. I am still undecided but I will definatly get a ecu, metal head gasket next, and some increased boost. I was told that would put me up to about 475.

My car has a Nismo single, and I love it. I know you mentioned a single only being able to handle 400hp, but your talking about slamming from a dead stop, launching if you will. I really have no intent to do that to my GTR. I have heard some twins are a little easier than others, but when it comes down to it, its what the car is intended for to make your choice. I want a streetable automobile, first and for most. But, of course that does not mean its right for the next guy. Triples, on the street. I guess if you like stalling at every light, or launching like or at the track, I would never suggest a triple, unless that car was a trailer queen.

Tony

I definatly agree. Like I said My twin still gets to be a pain in the ass, especialy at certain weather conditions. Dang gremlins. Basically To each their own. It is funny to watch other people try to drive my car.

A good single plate clutch with a high clamp pressure plate would be good for about 500-550hp even drag racing.

A local mechanic owns an R32 GTR. He has repeatedly dynoed his car in the 325 - 335kw (435-450hp) range at the wheels. He also ran the same clutch for 1 full season of drag racing. He would have made well over 120 very hard 6,800+ launches. He also shagged his gearbox as was to be expected.

I am running the identical clutch in my GTR and it is such a pleasure to drive even in heavy traffic. The start is just a little bit stickier than a standard hd disk clutch. it is a 5 puck kevlar/ceramic paddle clutch with a 2,300# pressure plate. The pressure plate is a factory one rebuilt to those specs.
I've also put 11,00 kms on it and I do spend a fair bit of time in traffic, and it hasn't given up yet :)

But what happens when the evil demons leek out into your soul and you want to go faster?:devil:

Originally posted by SkylineUSA
Haven't we gone over this before
We have but never got into actual figures before... :)
Originally posted by SkylineUSA
The whole system weighs about 20lbs, 16 of it is the bottle. R32s under steer, so a little more weight in the back is not going to hurt.
Haa, what is understeer? :)

My R32 is actually slightly oversteering. When you're thinking of your next mod, skip the engine parts and get coilovers and springs, that will get rid of the understeer.
Originally posted by SkylineUSA
With a 10lbs bottle, it can last around 100sec give or take a few total at a 100shot. There is no way I am going to go with a 100shot, I can jet the system down to a 25shot, so that about a 50hp gain for 400sec. The only time to really use it would be the straights, so say you on a 2 mile course for 15 laps, so you have about 28 sec of N2O for each lap. If used properly, it would be very beneficial, just for the spool up, with a window activator, as well.
Not too bad I quess but is it really worth the trouble? Power isn't your biggest problem in the track and certainly not out of the corner. With the 2530's for example you're going to have more power out of the corner that you can use. It would have to be a long straight... :)

Actually 2530's are a good upgrade from factory turbos. They spool relativily quickly and the power delievery is very simular to the factory ceramic turbos. Extremely drivable and controllable. :)

Originally posted by RazorGTR
Actually 2530's are a good upgrade from factory turbos. They spool relativily quickly and the power delievery is very simular to the factory ceramic turbos. Extremely drivable and controllable. :)
Yes, they are. Just to avoid confusion I mentioned them because on a track they are small enough to work very well without N2O, you don't need it to spool them up, and at the same time deliver more power than the average driver can handle.

To install a N2O system only takes a few hours, $40 a bottle. I guess it depends on what course your on, if there a a few straight aways, all the hp the better. You should be able to get to topspeed a little quicker, and top out a little higher. It all depends.

sami, I know you are against it, so you have already made up your mind:p

I am going to flow the intake system one day, and try to see if I can come up with away of decresing the airflow to number 6. Then try a normal N2O system. There are ways to do things, and there are other ways to do things. Some work, others blow up your engine:D

Originally posted by SkylineUSA
sami, I know you are against it, so you have already made up your mind:p
I'm not against it, I just think it is inconvenient. :)

I'm not against it, I just think it is inconvenient.

I guess when you already have a N2O system in your garage just sitting there doing nothing, like I do, its a little easier to make that choice.
I just have to figure our what I can do about that number 6, because its not a direct port system.

What is it with americans and their obsession with nitrous? Nitrous is gay. Why not just get more power normally, name some jap workshop cars with nitrous. Even the HKS GTR (fastest in world - twin GT3540's) doesnt run nitrous.
The MINES R34 with twin GT2530's has run a 10.8 sec 1/4 on street tyres. Pretty good for a track car.

Since you put it into such an intelligent perspective Nitrous is gay what makes it gay, other than the fact that you have never used it?

What is it with americans and their obsession with nitrous? That's a pretty ignorant statement.

Americans use a lot more than just N2O to make the fastest 1/4 mile cars in the world. I know of a Mustang running 8s without N2O on street tires, what's the relevance :rolleyes:

I'm not bagging the V8TT, just saying those are not street tyres in the sense I mean, there is no way u can get a wheelie that big on street tyres!
We have V8TT street cars here giving out 1000-1500rwhp, and on street tyres, none of em do wheelies, their tyres just spin.

The pic says that it is on radial tyres, u can get radial slicks, theyre not all bias ply.

"Michelin first produced radial slicks in 1972. Their first use in F1 was with Jody Scheckter and Ferrari in 1979. This was the first time that radial tyres had been used in f1. Michelin pulled out from f1 at the end of 1984, probably partly due to the very high cost of involvement. In those 6 years they had won over 50% of races. This forced Goodyear into producing radial tyres also. Pirelli were the first to introduce radial slicks into F2 in Europe around 1978. Several years later they also entered F1 with radials.

Radial tyres have an inherent advantage of improved traction & braking, and improved compound durability compared to bias ply tyres. This is due to the reinforcing belt under the tread, which promotes a stable, evenly loaded contact area. However this also was directly responsible for making the tyres very difficult to control at the limit of grip. Sudden 'breakaway' was a very serious problem, similar to that problem experienced with the early Dunlop CR70. Developments with radial tyres then were in the areas of making them more 'driveable'. This attribute has not been a factor in developing passenger radials for street use as it is not envisaged that tyres will be driven continually at the limit of adhesion.

Bias ply tyres have an inherent advantage for racing due to their ease of car control at the limit of adhesion. This makes them the most popular tyre for most classes of racing. However increasing limitations in tyre widths is showing the benefits of radial's durability to the extent that this construction is gradually being universally adopted."

So he is a world record holder with Radial slicks?
And it is 9 secs.
Once again, without slicks there is no way u can wheelie like that!
The Prime Garage Supra did a 10 sec flat quarter mile on (my definition of)street tyres with a 1.9sec 60 foot! Bloody slow 60 foot for that time. Wheelspin and a lot of it. With slicks it could do low nines to high eights as far as I can tell.

I've gotten off the main topic a bit, the main point is that pic is not street tyres, street tyres would be no wheelies and lots of wheelspin, this use of semi-slicks is all the japs use when racing. So when a GTR does a 9 sec time, it is on usually, Yokohoma Advans or Nitto Extreme 555R's.

Just had a look at the pics 60 foot too, 1.314secs, that is bloody fast! Faster than some of my friends with full slicks! NOT STREET TYRES.

Originally posted by RazorGTR
Moaning and or carrying on will not change the facts. I say get enough competitors to write in and get the rules changed.
I don't care about drag racing and I don't have any problem with their class structure, I was just curious if the times were run with real street tires. They were not. :)

BFG are the same as NITTOS, they are street tires, that Mustang had street tires on the car when it made that launch. DOT approved, are street tires.

I understand that you want to make sure the AWD cars own such an auspicious record, so you can manipulate what is a street tire any way you want, it does not change the fact that suspension also plays a factor in the grip of tires, and those tires used by that car were street tires, ever how loosely semantics plays in your favour.

Originally posted by SkylineUSA
I understand that you want to make sure the AWD cars own such an auspicious record
I'm sure the AWD cars were running same type of tires with their runs, although most likely smaller width, so I can honestly say that is not my motive. I don't have a problem with the claim that they are street tires as they are street legal, just wanted to know if they in fact were real street tires. Looks like we all agree that DRs are not real street tires.

Looks like we all agree that DRs are not real street tires. To me and you, you are probably right, but to BUBA the redneck they sure are:D

Please move you tyre related questions and comments to the tyre related thread I started cheers guys.

For twin application and street/occasional drag n track usage, the 2530s and 2540s are great. As some of the regulars here might already know, I am using 2540s...car pushes about 504 rwhp...stock gearbox....no problem here...drive it everyday to n fro work place n also through horrendous traffic. Just to chip in with a bit of personal experience....

What clutch do you have in the car with the 2540?s What about 2835 what that work as good turbo till I can upgrade the internals and gearbox but just run lower amount of boost? I have twin fuel pumps, apexi power fc pro, 72 pound injectors.... Twin plate or single plate clutch? Do twin plate ones last, The exedy twin plate nice?

Kyle

I am using OS Giken double clutch...used it for 2 years or so...but now it has shown signs of wearing down...after countless track outings and about 12 quarter mile passes! Have ordered HKS GD double clutch last month. I was using stock internals completely before the 2540s were installed...was running 375rwhp at 1.12 bar of boost. Completely okay!

go the twin t66 :flash:

Twin T66? Oh, that would be good:D

Well if you have any other ideas on turbos or know of places to buy 2530 or 2835 in us please let me know.

Kyle

In HPI 5 I saw a GTR with twin RX6's I think. Thats basically the size of a T66 aint it?

not sure they are bloody good though !!

say no more go the t66

You also might look into the new GT-RS's from HKS. They have a quicker spool time and supposedly put down about the same numbers as the 2530's.

I decided on a gt61 cutom innovative turbo. Any suggestions on a blow off valve or valves. Im gonna be running at about 28psi at max boost. proably 18psi on steet. Also whats a good place to buy them in US.

Kyle

Can someone explain the single turbos to me? Like the 51, 66, 71, 78, 100? Is it just the housing?

Thankshttp://www.garagetuners.com/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif

Don't know a lot about turbos besides power numbers so sorry:( But then again how is a teenager supposed to know that. HKS has good blow off valves and all the stuff associated with that but thats what I heard don't trust me 100%. Then again I think HKS has good everything except exhausts;)

Son,

http://www.garagetuners.com/images/smilies/fumeur7.gif Have you been doing drugs? j/k

Really though, if you don't know, please do not chime in.

T100!!!! Never heard of that!
Basically just sizing. Higher number is bigger. 78 is comparable to 3540. (around there)

phatdex,

Thanks for the info. Yes, a T100 they have been using those in the states for years.

T-88 is the biggest I have ever heard of.
Biggest one they use in japan is the T88H-34D or something like that. I guess the H and 34D stuff is slightly different housings, compressors etc etc.

Yeah...34D is BIG!:silly2: I mean...dontcha just love them D cups...?:D

The T88H is massive, The guy that is helping me do the T51 SPL in the skyline is putting an 88H in his Supra. They make a T100 but it is a special order item that is not typically sold to just anybody. The 88H is the largest "over the counter" turbo that is out there as far as I know.

Is there a benefit of going with a single?

Only for racing mate. For drivability and good power twins are still the choice.

You could go with medium single such as a single 3540 or even a GT42R. They are double roller bearing and spool decent. power out put would around the 700ish hp.

You could go with medium single such as a single 3540 or even a GT42R. They are double roller bearing and spool decent. power out put would around the 700ish hp.

700, that is a little too much.

I'll be happy with some cheap 2530s, set-up right.

I'd be happy WITH a turbo
:(

Yep 2530's are the way to go, but dont expect that much power, around 300RWKW.
2540's will give u about 30RWKW more but a much bigger lull in the centre.

2530's for the street would be perfect.
Saying that a lot of ppl go single for the simple fact it is cheaper because u only need one turbo.
Most ppl in OZ seem to get single T-78.

Heck, by the time you do a single it cost just as much as a straight bolt-on twin.

You have to change all the exhaust plumbing, don't you?

I would easly give 50hp, for a more streetable power band.

I will always tune an engine on the safe side, because I know there will always be someone out there faster than me:D

a single turbo has just as easy as a tune factor as 2 turbos. Your simplifying everything.

Most much larger than standard turbos u will nedd to redo exhaust etc - but getting custom manifold etc isnt THAT expensive.
And who said tuning single turbo was easier than twin?, looked back and couldnt see anyone who said that.