97 with 3 speed transmission question

I have a 97 grand voyager with the 3.0 and 3 speed tranny.The other day it started acting up.When I go to take off in first its like first is completely shot,the enging rps's go up but I hardly go anywhere.I assume 1st is slipping.But here is the strange part,if I shift it down into first and manualy shift it through the gears rather than leaving it in drive it seems 80% better.Any ideas why this is or what the problem is?Thanks

I'd give the tranny a dose of auto-rx and fluid/filter change. When was the f/f last changed?

The last filter/fluid was about 30k miles ago,and I just did one yesterday.That was my thought as well.I thought if nothing else I could at least see if there is metal or anything in the pan.It didnt look too bad.I did some reading and it looks like the 3 speen doesnt use a transmission computer like the the 4 speed so I can rule that out.I thought about cranking up the throttle valve adjustment.Any other idea's?

Like I mentioned I'd use a bottle of ARX. A 97 what kind of miles on it?

Could be govenor sticking; or thrrottle pressure linkage obsruction. Throttle pressure linkage is a metal rod that goes from the throttle body to the trans at the same location as the shift cable. This should be able to move freely. Check for any interference to this rod. The slack is taken up by a spring on the throttle body; to keep the rod tight at the throttle body. The slot in the likage at the throttle body should be forward or to the left as you look at it. Possible acid drippage from battery can jam it. See if this moves freely. Check this and post back what you find. Additives in any Chrysler trans are not recommended.

Thanks for the info guys.It has 157k on it.I did check the throttle linkage earlyer today it moves freely and looks good.What do you think?

Throttle pressure has to go higher than governor pressure for the trans to upshift. If you increase the throttle pressure it would shift at a higher speed. Could be govenor sticking or bad sealing ring causig a pressure loss in that area. Try driving it at about 25 to 30 and manually downshifting it a few times. Manually moving the shift lever all the way to 1st. You have to worry about timing belt slop if you do this though. If the gov is sticking or has a burr on it it may clean it up. If the timing belt is original I would not recommend doing this.

The foreward clutch is damaged,,,,,needs rebuild,,,,The reason it will work better when shifted to low,2nd then drive is because line pressure {this is what applys clutches}almost doubles when shifted to low range or d-2,,,thus will seem to work better...this will soon slip when friction material is totally gone

I will try the down shifting thing just for the hell of it but I think trannyman is probably right.Thanks for the info.Let me ask you something though,if the forward clutch is going is only first affected because it takes so much to make it move from a dead stop?Like I said 2nd&3rd are fine.Thanks

Right front clutch is for rev and 3rd gear. 1st is oneway clutch (over running) and rear clutch. 2nd is rear clutch and kickdown band. I haven't overhauled one of these in about 10 yrs.

Say what?????Are you saying trannyman is right?Im not following all the 1st one way clutch talk.

I see a lot of confusion, bits of proper information and bits of improper information, so its time for Torqueflite 101.

The three speed automatic used in your van is a miniturized version of the old 727 & 904 Torqueflites found in the old RWD Mopars of the past. They function in the same way.

This transmission has four major, hydraulically operated components. These are the front clutch pack, the rear clutch pack, the front or kickdown band and the rear or low/reverse band. There is also a fixed clutch, known as the "sprag clutch" or the "one-way clutch", which keeps the rear drum from rotating in one direction at all times.

This transmission has four gear ranges and each gear requires the operation of specific components to operate correctly.

Low Gear - There are two operating variations of low gear, "drive breakaway low" and "manual low". The operation of "manual low" occurs only when the selector is in "1". When "1" is selected manually, the rear clutch engages and the "low/reverse band" engages to hold the rear drum in both directions. The application of the "low/reverse band" allows for engine braking in manual low. The operation of "drive breakaway low" occurs when the selector is in either "2" or "D" and begins at a dead stop. In "drive breakaway low" the rear clutch engages and the "spag clutch" holds the rear drum while accelerating.

Second Gear - This gear range requires the simultaneous operation of the rear clutch and the "kickdown band" only.

High Gear - This gear range requires the simultaneous operation of the front clutch and the rear clutch only.

Reverse - This gear range requires the simultaneous operation of the front clutch and the low/reverse band.

It is very easy to diagnose a problem with these transmissions. I will break this down by component.

Rear Clutch - If this device was malfunctioning, you would not engage any gear, automatically or manually.

Front Clutch - If this device was malfunctioning, you would not engage high gear or reverse. Manual low, drive breakaway low and second gear would operate normally.

Kickdown Band - If this device was malfunctioning, you would not engage second gear. Manual low, drive breakaway low and reverse would operate normally. You might engage high gear if you were lucky. This band is adjustable with the adjustment bolt located on the exterior of the transmission case.

Low/Reverse Band - If this device was malfunctioning, you would not engage reverse and you would have no engine braking in manual low. All forward gears would appear to operate normally. This band is adjustable with the adjustment bolt located inside the transmission pan.

Sprag Clutch - If this device was malfunctioning, you would not engage drive breakaway low. The forward gears would appear to operate normally only if you start out in manual low and upshift. Reverse would operate normally.

Now you have what you need to diagnose your transmission problem. The bands can be adjusted to a point, but malfunctioning clutches will require a rebuild. Let us know what you find and what you do.

I have some additional thoughts now that I have reread all the posts again.

From post #1, the lack of engagement in drive breakaway low with an "80% improvement" in manual low leads me to believe that the sprag clutch is not holding and the rear clutch pack may be weak. The former might be expected if this van was driven hard. The latter could be expected at 157K miles.

Question, did you adjust the bands at the last fluid/filter change??

From post #5, a sticking govenor would prevent the automatic downshifting of the transmission when you come to a stop. The symptom would be a transmission stuck in high range when starting from a dead stop. This is caused by fragmentation of metal parts within the transmission, where small bits of metal stick in the bore of the govenor, preventing free movement of the govenor valve. A transmission with a sticking govenor must be disassembled, cleaned and rebuilt so that the disintegrating metal pieces can be replaced and all excess metal pieces are removed from the unit.

Holy crap KManiac,you are a walking repair manual!First of all thank you soooo much for the reply and all the info.From your first post I was thinking it must be the sprag clutch as well.Let me ask you,is there any adjustment or temporary quick fix for this problem?My wife took out the van today and she said she put it in drive and it was a lot better than it has been in the past few days,I wonder if she is just getting use to it.I am going to pick up dinner in a few min,I will see for myself.I didnot adjust anything when I did the filter change,transmissions are not my strong point.I didnt know I could adjust them or how to.But from the sounds of it thats not my problem.So if its the sprag clutch will it need to be rebuilt?

Ok so I took the van out for a drive and sure enough my wife was right,it seems to be back to normal.I fear it wont last for long but its working fine for now.Before i had to put the peddel down about 1/2 way and bring the rpms way up to get it to move in drive,does this make any sense?

If it seems to work like normal now, I would continue to drive it. Should it start to slip again, DON'T WAIT, shift it to manual low IMMEDIATELY! Don't force the tranny to slip anymore than it has to. If your sprag clutch is indeed the problem, manually shifting is the temporary work around until you decide what to do with the tranny. If the slipping continues when you shift to manual low, the rear clutch is the problem.

Also, unless its absolutely necessary, I would suggest YOU drive the van and let your wife drive something else, until you regain confidence with the vehicle or it fails completely.

Keep us posted on the condition over time.

Thats what I was thinking also,Ill keep driving it and see what hapens.I hope it can hold out for a few monthes,cash is a little tight right now.Thank you so much for all the info and advice.Ill keep you posted.

Ok I have been driving the van for a while now and have realized my transmission problem is it just isnt down shifting sometimes by itself.When going from 3rd to a stop once in a while it will try taking off in third.If i manually even for a split second shift into first its fine.And the wife said a couple of times it had trouble shifting from 2nd to 3rd.Any ideas what would cause this?Thanks

The failure or reluctance of your transmission to automatically downshift to "drive breakaway low" when you come to a stop is the result of a sticking govenor valve.

The govenor valve is mounted on the output shaft of the transmission. The valve is spring loaded and works by centrifugal force as the speed of the output shaft increases. The movement of the govenor valve outward, with increasing road speed, causes automatic upshifts. When the van comes to a stop, the spring is suppose to pull the govenor valve back in, automatically downshifting the transmission to low.

What is happening in your case (as happened to me in my Dodge Shadow five years ago) is that a piece of metal debris has lodged in the bore of the govenor valve, restricting free movement of the valve. You can work around this one of two ways; first by shifting to N for a couple seconds then back to D, or by shifing to 1 for a couple seconds then back to D. Either way will cause line pressure to react against the govenor valve, returning it to the "stopped" position and returning the transmission to low.

The metal debris causing the govenor to stick is not from normal wear and tear. Something metallic has shed metal fragments inside your transmission and it may be shedding more metal fragments over time.

The best remedy for this situation is to rebuild the transmission and be sure that all metal fragments are thoroughly flushed from the case and valve body. Replacement of the torque converter is required, it could be harboring metal fragments.

Some might suggest just replacing the govenor valve. This will require removal of the transmission, but not complete disassembly. However, what ever metal fragments that remain inside the transmission will must likely damage the new govenor and you will be no better off than you were before.

Or you could just continue the drive it using the shift lever work around. It could last you a few more months or a few more years.

Whatever decision you make, I am sure will be for the best economic reasons. Good luck!

The govenor can be removed without pulling the trans. You can remove the valve body to get to it.Then three small bolts and the valve housing can be removed. Be careful to get the governor tubes back in proper position when you reinstall the valve body.

Thank you so much for the info.I dont know that much about transmissions but I thought it might be the govener as well due to a experience I had with a brand new transmission I put in my camaro.Well I went to a auto auction saturday and bought my wife a 2001 grand caravan,it has 135k on it.I got it for 3300.00 not a bad deal I hope,time will tell.I part cars for a living and am unsure if I should just part our old van or sell it and tell the new owner about the problem.The rockers are getting REAL soft so I lean to parting it.But aside of that it is and has been a great van.It sure is nice to have people like you who dont mind taking time out of your day to help others like me.Like I said before money has been tight and transmissions are not my strong point.Thank you so much.