Various electrical issues 98 Voyager

First, background.

I purchased this van for my wife in 2001. It is a Grand Voyager 3.3 Flex with Expresso package. About 6 months after I purchased, the gauge cluster went out, but quickly came back. About 6 months later it did the same. It continued to have speratic failures over the years to the point that it would happen every few weeks.

Two major transmission repairs later and about 5 years later, I purchased her a 2005 model and I started using this van. The gauge cluster would was then going out for extended periods of time. I could not pin point a trigger, but it seemed to happen more when it rained, or when it was hot (living in GA, that is half the year). For the last two summers, it has stopped working completly during the summer and would come and go in the winter.

Recently, I started having new issues. When the gauge cluster is working now, the transmission goes into limp mode. When the gauge cluster is not working, the transmission works fine. In addition, when the cluster is working the speedometer bouces all around when coasting but when ecelerating it works.

My machanic did some extensive diagnostics on it and told me the Body Control Module was the problem. It stead of paying him $800 to repair, I pulled the BCM and sent it to directauto.com and had it rebuilt. I reinstalled tonight, but same problems.

In addition to the gauge cluster going out, the computer in the overhead console will stop working at the same time, the check engine light comes on (according to the machanic the code simply says short), the auto door lock feature will not work (when you get over 15 mph), and the lights in the overhead console with sometimes work sometimes not.

I am at a loss. Any thoughts?

Some are fairly common issues all over this and other forums.
> Your cluster issue is likely a bad solder joint on the instrument cluster circuit board. Smack the top of the dash next time it dies. If it springs to life, you have confirmed it. You'll have to remove the cluster and resolder the joints.
> Your flacky speedo is likely the output speed sensor on the transmission. This could also be the cause of your tranny limp mode issue. The sensor is cheap and easy to change. Remove the air intake and look down. It's on the drivers side of the tranny between the two tubes leading to the tranny cooler. If you decide to change it double check it's connection first.
> The auto door lock feature can be turned on or off. Have you confirmed it's on. I believe your drivers manual tells you how.
> The on/off overhead console lights are likely just a bad connection in the circuit. Are they just randomly on or does something trigger them to turn off. Use more monkey logic. Smack it.

Sure would be noice to know what that code was. You can read then in your driveway with a set of keys and eyes. Next time the SE light is on cycle the key from off to run 3 times leaving it at run (not start). Now count the SE light flashes. All codes are two digits. A code 21 would be flash, flash, pause, flash. Multiple codes will have a longer pause between. Code 55 means end of test.

Why would I have all of these failures at once? When the dash doesn't work, everything else seems to. When the dash does, the trans acts up.

I spoke to the tech support at the place that rebuilt the BCM and they claim that the BCM was having issues. They stated that there was corrosion on the board that was cleaned and repaired. Did I waste $200, or could this have been part of the problem as the mech said?

i ran across something similar awhile back on a Caravan. cust complained dash would quit intermittent. I pulled a code, I dont remember what code anymore,
but it was a data comm code, possibly similar to yours. I drove the vehicle until the ploblem sufaced and noticed when it did the overhead quit working.
I found that the cluster, overhead and the HVAC controller were all connected to BCM on the same data link wires. I pulled the HVAC controller and disconnected all wiring to it, found melted wires related to blower motor. cluster and overhead came back, all was good. Got a new controller and my local dodge parts guy found a new wirng pigtail. Installed it all and works great.:thumbsup:

Why would I have all of these failures at once? Did I waste $200, or could this have been part of the problem as the mech said?

Yup, good question and I think fixitall hit on it. The HVAC panel and harness are well worth looking into but, the overall problem is the CCD data link bus he refers to. This bus system is a set of wires the computers/modules (including the HVAC panel) talk to each other on. An open or high resistance anywhere on the bus can effect several systems at once. The BCM is a major player on the Bus. Can't say for sure you wasted the bucks.

CCD stands for Chrysler Collision ?Detection

I was looking at pulling the cluster and checking the solder today. Would it going bad cause the overhead cluster to stop working at the same time? Or is it more likely the data bus? My machanic claimed he ran all of the wireing and did not find anything.:banghead:

I would just pull the HVAC control and unplug it. See if the instrument cluster and overhead computer come back. If it does then you have a problem in your HVAC controler. Rarely do you have problems with your bus wiring, it is usually related to one of the components. On this vehicle I would also open the wiring loom under the battery and look for acid contamination on wires. Clean off acid with battery cleaner and alot of water. This problem is probably not related to the BCM or its components but it is a common problem with all of these vehicles.

I have pulled both the cluster and the HVAC controller. I will disassemble the cluster tomorrow and see how the solder looks. As for the HVAC controller, I cannot see anything wrong with it. There is no melting and not any apperant problems with the wiring harness. I will let you know what I find with the cluster.

It is official. There was definetly some issues with the solder points on the cluster. We do soldering under maginifacation where I work, so I brought it in and had one of the engineers look at it. The bottom left and right pins (according to the engineer) had obvious damage where the solder had overheated. He showed me both pins and they were cracked all the way around the tip. If I had waited until after having my coffee, I would have been awake enough to ask him to photograph it before he fixed it. Several other pins were also either compromised or close in that they had started to crack. I will put everything back together and see if she will run right now. Keep your fingers crossed for me.

Well, I put part of the van back together tonight. I reattached the repaired cluster and the HVAC controller. I put part of the dash back together, then decided to take it down the road to see what happened. Aside from a dead battery (it is about 3 years old, so may not be related to this, but to sitting for 2 months) it seems to be working now. I drove around for 45 minutes and the dash worked like it was suppose to and the transmission shifted correctly without going into limp mode.

I still cannot beleive that I fought with this thing on and off for the last 4 years trying to get this to work. All that for a bad solder joint. Not to mention the money I spent on the BCM and machanics trying to figure this out.

Thanks

Great news. Are all issues fixed; cluster, speedo, tranny, door locks, and overhead? Sounds like you fixed the big ones at least. As for your frustation, chalk it up as a learning experience, and you learned quite a bit. As for the bucks on the BCM, I think you can still look at your wallet and smile. You fixed it, not some high priced dealership or mechanic. Congrats!

One thing I should have pointed out; my theory on the solder joints is the wire harness to the cluster is routed in a way that applies torque to the connection and stresses the solder joints eventually cracking them. I found this situation on a climate control panel on a Camry recently. I rerouted/secured the harness so it wasn't pushing the connector up or down

Was everything on the cluster dead or just a couple indicators? Someone else I'm working with has a completely dead cluster.

I learned several somethings today... Thanks RIP and thanks everyone!

I learned several somethings today... Thanks RIP and thanks everyone!

:cheers:

It was everything on the cluster, but the light bar above with warning lights / high beam / etc. was still working. I could even still hear the low fuel warning, but the light did not work.

So far, it seems everything is working right, but the tranny. I started driving this morning and it went into limp lode and the check engine light came on.

Going to see if I can get an error code now.

I could not get turning the key from off to on three times to give me any codes, so I took the van to the local auto parts store (less than 1/2 mile from the house, too bad they know me by name). They checked and it came up with several codes related to the transmission. Two codes repeated, P0720 - speed sensor failure, and another code that stated error in transmission control module. I am going to pull the output speed sensor and see if that will fix it.

God I hate this van, at least when it is on the fritz.

> Your flacky speedo is likely the output speed sensor on the transmission. This could also be the cause of your tranny limp mode issue. The sensor is cheap and easy to change. Remove the air intake and look down. It's on the drivers side of the tranny between the two tubes leading to the tranny cooler. If you decide to change it double check it's connection first.


I went to the store, purchased the socket I needed to remove the sensor and an output speed sensor. Went home, pulled the part, and discovered that the part I pulled out did not match the part I purchased. The sensor between the two tubes leading into the tranny is the input speed sensor (based on the auto parts store listing). Either way, this did not seem to solve the problem.

I took the car down the road and the speedo was bouncing all over again. The tranny did not go into limp mode, but I only went about a mile down the road. Sometimes the limp mode would start right away, some times a few miles down the road.

Any more suggestions?

Hey this is my first time trying this so i hope i don't tic anyone off. My mother has a 98 voyager. It turns over but will not start. Then, after a few attempts, the thing quits turning over. The starter relay under the hood does not receive voltage when the key is activated, battery is not dead and the gauge cluster is not lighting up. Any Ideas? Thanks.

I also have a '98 Voyager with basically the same problem. Intermittantly I lose all dash lights, tach, speedometer, temp gage and fuel gage. The ABS light comes on as does the Check engine light. The door locks will not automaticly lock but the engine and cruise control work normally with the exception of the cruise control light. It has worked normally for most of the winter but came back for a short period of time (15 minutes) the other day. It does seem to go out more often in warm wet weather.
The code that I get is P1698 "NO CCD message from the transaxle to computer (check harness)"
Got no idea what a CCD is or where the harness is.
I have been driving it if it works or not as I just go several miles to work and back.

Update. I replaced the input and output sensors. I have driven the van for about 100 miles without any further issues. Hopefully this will keep her running for another year or two.

Rebuilt BCM - $250
New Battery - $75
New Input Sensor - $20
New Output Sensor - $20
Deep well socket to remove Sensors - $10
Working van - Priceless!!

Until it breaks again. :(

I went to the store, purchased the socket I needed to remove the sensor and an output speed sensor. Went home, pulled the part, and discovered that the part I pulled out did not match the part I purchased. The sensor between the two tubes leading into the tranny is the input speed sensor (based on the auto parts store listing). Either way, this did not seem to solve the problem.

I took the car down the road and the speedo was bouncing all over again. The tranny did not go into limp mode, but I only went about a mile down the road. Sometimes the limp mode would start right away, some times a few miles down the road.

Any more suggestions?

Wow. I really said that. Guilty as charged. I appologise for the bumb steer on the output sensor location. I've given the location for that nugget countless times but got it backwards for you this time. Happy to hear you got it right inspite of me. So which of the sensors actually fixed it?

I also have a '98 Voyager with basically the same problem. Intermittantly I lose all dash lights, tach, speedometer, temp gage and fuel gage. The ABS light comes on as does the Check engine light. The door locks will not automaticly lock but the engine and cruise control work normally with the exception of the cruise control light. It has worked normally for most of the winter but came back for a short period of time (15 minutes) the other day. It does seem to go out more often in warm wet weather.
The code that I get is P1698 "NO CCD message from the transaxle to computer (check harness)"
Got no idea what a CCD is or where the harness is.
I have been driving it if it works or not as I just go several miles to work and back.

Post this as a new thread. You'll get much more attention.

Hey this is my first time trying this so i hope i don't tic anyone off. My mother has a 98 voyager. It turns over but will not start. Then, after a few attempts, the thing quits turning over. The starter relay under the hood does not receive voltage when the key is activated, battery is not dead and the gauge cluster is not lighting up. Any Ideas? Thanks.

Post as a new thread. You'll get more attention.

I have the 98 caravan too. I have found that this model of van has had alot of tranny problems. I had mine rebuilt right after I bought it (not by choice) but it has been pretty good after that. All sorts of other wierd things though. I have resoldered the panel too. Seems to work. Watch out for the ignition key to lock up.That's another one of this vans qurks. It's really easy to replace. Just did it today. Replace the "ignition cylinder with key and tumblers". might be a good thing to do before the key won't turn when your out somewhere.
$15.99 at Autozone. Instructions are in box. 15 minute job.
Just giving you my 2 cents worth.........Good luck

many caravans have this problem and if you let it go your guages and spedo etc wont work. take out the 4 screws that hold on the a/c stuff and unplug it and inspect for a burnt terminal I JUST did one 5 min ago. Clean it up and plug back in or get one from the junkyard