weird issue ?????

I have an 02 Astro AWD and for the past couple of days it has been acting up on me. We just went to Florida from Canada with it and had no problems going south. On the way home, we made it to Winchester Virginia where we spent the night. The following morning it started fine but as we were about to pull onto the highway it just died like it ran out of gas. I tried and tried to restart it with no luck. The fact that the wife was %^%$##@ at me did not help. I could not hear if the fuel pump was working or not due to the traffic noise. I called AAA for a tow and as I was on the phone I decided to give it one more try, after about 10 minutes from when she stalled. She started as if nothing had happened. I took it to the local GM dealer where they were nice enough to take me right away and scan it for codes. The only code that came up was one I was already aware of P1345 - crank/cam sensor correlation. I don't think this should have caused the van to die like it did since this code has been on for almost a year with no issues. The tech at the dealership agreed with me and said that I might have a fuel pump relay issue but could not see anything wrong with the van. I drove it back home from there with no issues until I got a few miles from home where it started to hesitate but never stalled on me. Checked it all out yesterday and again found nothing. I drove it to work today - about 40 miles and had no issues going there but on the way home it started to act up again. When I would accelerate from a light it would start chugging and if I let go of the gas and pressed it again it would go as if nothing had happened. I am getting afraid to take it out of the driveway now.

plugs have about 40,000 miles, wires are new, cap and rotor is new.

I was thinking that there might be a fuel filter issue??? Anyone have any other suggestions??? If it is the filter, where is it located?

Thanks for any help!

Until you can determine if it's a fuel problem or an ignition problem, any suggestions would be a guess. Driving with a fuel pressure gauge connected would eliminate or confirm a problem with fuel delivery, if /when it acts up. From your description, it sounds like a fuel issue. It could very well be something a simple as the fuel filter being clogged. It is located in the left frame rail just ahead of the fuel tank.

My '94 acted like yours- took me over 4 months to figure it out- it would die- then start back up- sometimes go for 2 wks without issue- then sometimes 2 or 3 times in one day--- I ended up replacing the wiring harness to the fuel injector pulsator (spider assembly) - the old wires were brittle and one had broken at the connector harness- being held on by only a thread- the dealer wiring harness was $87- but I made my own- once I figured out what was wrong. What was sad, was that there was no way to test that connector without running the van- and no way to run the van without having that plenum on- so over the 4 months- I had that upper plenum on and off over a dozen times- trying to understand what was failing- hopefully you can figure your problem out sooner- I drove mine with a fuel pressure gage attached and a spark tester handy for a couple of weeks....

I will start with a fuel filter, that is pretty cheap and seeing it's an 02, it is probably due anyways. One of my neighbors suggested that maybe someone dropped something like a tissue into my tank and as it floats around it catches on the fuel intake in the tank. I just find it hard to believe that considering the openning to the tank and mine has that little flap where you fill it anyways??? There's really no way of seeing that unless I drop the tank which I don't want to do unless I have to. It's just frustrating, everything is at least 10 miles away from my house and work is about 40 miles, so I need a car that won't let go on me and this van has been good to me so far. I just find it weird that we don't get any codes what-so-ever regarding this failure. Even in -10 weather she starts right up.

Fuel delivery problems don't set codes-- the vehicle does not monitor fuel pressure or injector flow- it is more likely to set a code if the problem is electrical- like cam/crank signals and synch etc. My biggest problem was that the wife was always the one it failed on- while she went to town- usually it would just stall- then she would pull over - try to start it several times- and it would fire up- usually after 5 or 10 minutes- and she would continue. She would always complain about it- and when I took it out- of course it would not act up- boy did I catch a lot of **it. Also it would act up when pulling a long hill- sometimes even backfiring through the exhaust- all this quit after I got good connections to the fuel injection. I was sooooo happy when it finally failed all together- came home on a flatbed- that now I had something to work with- that the problem would there to find- It was then that I finally wiggled the injector wires- that made it run- then wiggle again- made it shut off- like I said I had numerous hours in this- I can feel your pain- You may have to drive it- until it fails completely- just have a cell phone and Triple-A tow service number handy- and a spare car available for when it decides it's time to quit altogether.....you can't fix it when it is running fine-- you will have to force the failure- by noting all conditions when it happens and try to reproduce them or live with it until it fails on its own...I do it almost every month- friends and family give their cars to drive until I figure it out- they don't care- they just want it fixed- so I use their gas and vehicle- carry a cell phone- have access to a car hauler- and AAA- and go from there. It can be quite frustrating- the Dealer or whatever shop you take it to won't spend much time trying to find the problem- you'll get it back with-- everything's okay- no trouble found- unless you get lucky and find a mechanic who will drive until it acts up. But you can bet it will take more time to find than he can spare.. oh well - just my opinions for what it is worth.. good luck

I guess I don't have much choice! I will change the fuel filter this weekend; it's supposed to warm up to the mid 20s. From there I just hope that will solve the problem. Luckily I have AAA just in case!

I had the p1345 code also and it would hesitate and stall occasionally , I advanced the distributor by four or five degrees and it all went away.

How did you adjust the timing? I was told that there was no adjustment on mine, that everything was done by the computer???? If I can adjust the timing I would definately do it and try it out. But it does not always act up.

Checked fuel pressure - got lots of it and it holds, checked wiring - it's new and looks good and is not rubbing on anything, checked new cap and rotor - all good. As I mentionned before I have a crank/cam correlation code that is still there even after clearing. So just for kicks, I disconnected the cam sensor on the distributor - it had no effect at all, still starts fine, revs up fine and sounds fine. Could that be the cause of my issues??? One of my neighbors told me he had a problem on his pick-up with a 4.3 with the coil. I know on the older oil filled coils when they got warm some times they would quit, but my van does not seem to care whether it is hot or cold, when she does not want to go, she doesn't go! Would the coil give a code?? Should I look at replacing the coil???

I went to bring the kids to school this morning, the van started right up, I let it idle for a few minutes while I scraped the ice off the windows. When I got in and shifted into reverse she died and refused to restart. I took the wife's car and when I returned the van started as if nothing happenned?????

What was the fuel pressure reading? How long does it remain above 55psi after the pump shuts off?

Secondary ignition, (spark plugs, plug wires, distributor cap & rotor, ignition coil & coil wire) and fuel delivery are not directly monitored by OBD, so they cannot set a DTC or illuminate the SES.

Fuel pressure held steady at about 58 and held steady with engine off but key on.

I went through the basics I learned in shop class in high school - you need compression and spark and gas and air to make any gasoline engine work. There is no restriction in the air flow, plenty of gas and lots of spark. I just wish she would be constant on having this issue. It happens cold - hot - in gear - at idle speed - while cruising.

All electrical connections look good to all plugs. There does not seem to be any poke holes in any of the wires. Battery is good.

I just pulled all of the plug wires off and did a full inspection, thinking maybe they were not on well or loose, but all is fine. Found nothing loose.

I just got back from my local parts store, trying to see if they had any suggestions. The person there told me the ignition modules sometimes fail on the Astro and would give a similar situation as I am having. Is this true or is that person trying to sell me an ignition module??? Is there any way of testing the module??? Would it pop out a code if it were defective???

They want $150 for the new module, I don't want to dish out that kind of money unless I have too.

If you have spark, it's not the ignition module or the crankshaft position sensor. Ignition module problems will not set a DTC, a faulty crankshaft position sensor will. Fuel delivery will not set a DTC either.

How did you adjust the timing? I was told that there was no adjustment on mine, that everything was done by the computer???? If I can adjust the timing I would definately do it and try it out. But it does not always act up. I removed the clip holding the distributor down and ground the hole for the bolt opposite the direction of the rotation of the rotor (about half a hole) then put it back at the advanced timing. Yes the computer does time the engine but from wear in the timing chain and the slack in the distributor the engine senses that the cam sensor and the pick up in the distributor are out of whack and thus gives the code. I had 195,000 km and did not feel like pulling the engine and had read about this on other sites and decided to give it a try and it worked excellent for me , and the engine ran incredibly smoother right away. The clip is rather on tight on the shaft but I think you can remove it without lifting the distributor as if you do that the you have to get it back in the correct slot and also get it to drop back on the oil pump , I used a file for a chainsaw to expand the hole. I some older GM engines you used to be able to disconnect a wire that would allow you to time then engine to zero degrees then plug it back in to let the computer take over again and that helped withe the drivetrain slack , here you just kinda guess but everyone said about 3 or 4 degrees is good.

I will definately try that. Not today - it's minus 17 celsius plus wind chill right now.

I had the van die on me again on wednesday night. Almost came home on a tow truck. But after about 15 minutes she started up like nothing happened. Today, I made it to the kid's school - about 4 miles, drove home and when I went back to pick them up she really started acting up on me. She started bucking like running out of gas. I picked up the kids but never made it home - she died on me again about a mile from the house. Waited a bit and got her started, this time she was running really rough - made it home and she died again in the driveway. I waited a bit and she started right up as if nothing happened. All this time I was listening for the fuel pump and it was cycling the way it should.

Is it possible that the pump works when it feels like it and doesn't when it doesn't feel like it. Is it possible for the pump motor to run while not pumping? Everything looks good, but I did not drop the tank to look inside.

How bad of a job is it to drop the tank without a hoist? Any tricks I should know about before I release a few unwanted words at this van?

Thanks for any help!

I found the problem!!!!!!

When I replaced the spark plug wiring not too long ago, I decided to install Bosch wires - now that was a mistake. I removed the dog house tonight to have a good look at what the issue was before I did something stupid. Turned the key and got huge fireworks coming from the coil and coil wire to the transmission dipstick tube. So I had a closer look and saw that the coil was arking from everywhere I could see. Luckily, I had a coil assembly handy, replaced it and the van started. She still sounded a bit rough, so I turned off the lights and admired the fireworks in front of me. The new spark plug wires that I installed about a month ago were arking from everywhere they could.

Other than the need to replace the coil I learned a valuable lesson today:

NEVER BUY BOSCH PARTS FOR MY VAN!!!

Any suggestions as to what kind of wires I should get?

I found the problem!!!!!!

When I replaced the spark plug wiring not too long ago, I decided to install Bosch wires - now that was a mistake. I removed the dog house tonight to have a good look at what the issue was before I did something stupid. Turned the key and got huge fireworks coming from the coil and coil wire to the transmission dipstick tube. So I had a closer look and saw that the coil was arking from everywhere I could see. Luckily, I had a coil assembly handy, replaced it and the van started. She still sounded a bit rough, so I turned off the lights and admired the fireworks in front of me. The new spark plug wires that I installed about a month ago were arking from everywhere they could.

Other than the need to replace the coil I learned a valuable lesson today:

NEVER BUY BOSCH PARTS FOR MY VAN!!!

Any suggestions as to what kind of wires I should get? Remember that electricity always takes the path of least resistance , meaning you should check your plugs and the gap as wires will arc if the power has nowhere to go. OEM would probably work well for wires , good luck with it.

For wires, caps, and rotors, I always goe OEM-- AC Delco in this case......

I found an article on the web about an independant testing lab that tested several different brands of ignition wires. From cheapie no names to the expensive name brand "high performance" wires. The Autolite Professional Series wires have the best specs, and as luck would have it, they're cheaper, go figure. AC Delco wires come in a very close second. I've installed the Autolites on countless vehicles with ZERO problems, as long as the silicone dielectric grease was used as directed.

Don't get totally down on Bosch. Although their plugs and wires are not the greatest, you can't buy a better oxygen sensor!

Another perfect example of "Just because it's new, is no guarantee that it's good". Glad you got her going!

My 1999 Astro had the same problem - ran poor in moisture- the coil was the main problem.

We found the problem. This time we really did. MAF connector was broken by someone who serviced the van in the past, the contacts were green from corrosion. I cleaned them and reconnected with good readings. The distributor gear was stripped and was slipping, so I replaced the distributor gear. Distributor looked good with no play found in shaft. The cat converter was also limiting flow, I took out one of the O2 sensors and she started right up. I had the GM dealer replace the cat converter since I get discounts there due to my company, I do industrial shrink wrap, like the stuff on boats, and I wrap accidented cars and other stuff for them on a regular basis. One of those I scratch your back you scratch mine arrangements.

The MAF connector on the sensor is broken and the only way I was able to get it to work properly, after cleaning it, was to use a zip tie to hold the plug in proper position.