93 Head Removal

hey whats up---- i think i bent a few valves in the head and im going to try and rebuild it----i have both the intake and exaust mani off already as well as the valve cover-----i see 4 head bolts by the exaust mani which i have removed--- and 2 on each side (left to right) of the head-- i removed one of those, but the other is blocked by a rollor rocker( i think thats what its called)---how do i get that one out, and im figuring there is 4 more head bolts on the back side by the intake mani but i cant seem to see anything----it looks like at the bottom of the head there is 4 spots where there are bolts but they look imposible to get too----how do i get to these other bolts??????? im thinking i might have to drop the oil pan, and the bolts will go all the way though to the bottom of the engine block?????? i dont know-- please help!!!!!!

Which Engine?

hell i dont even know--- im not a cavalier junky yet---im a honda head but i also have a cavalier and i wanna fix her up----i guess i can check the engine code or something---- but its a 4 banger in ther if that helps

Well if its a 2.2 there should be 5 on the outside and 5 under the valve cover and yes they will be blocked by rocker arms but they come right off.

alright--- your the man-- i see them now--- i did not nitice them before------ok great----when i pop off those rocker arms, there not gonna go flying right--- they dont seem to have much tension on them----ok--after that the head should pop right off-----now i being from the honda world am used to the whole dual overheadf cam thing----obviously this engin is not an overhead cam---so--can u tell me anything about this setup----am i gonna screw up the timing once i pop the head off, and how will i reset the timing----im not exactly sure if ill ever get her running again--- i think is really badly bent valves---that will cause an engine not to run for sure i know----cause before it died the valve tap was horrible---alright--hope u can answer those questions----thanks alot for the help

joe

Like the new avatar bowtiebandit:D

Sorry no help here JWT

Actually you couldn't have picked a better engine to learn on!! Timing will not be affected by removal of the head. They did however have serious timing chain problems also. There is a cup plug that oils it and it gets plugged up hence no oil to chain. Rocker arms wont fly off at ya like an overhead cam will. These engines also are famous for leaking headgaskets in the right front corner so make sire you get a quality set.
If the rest of the engine is ok you may want to look into a new head from GM, I believe they come fully assembled allready with the redesigned valve springs. It may be cost effective to go that way, also be carefull when putting the intake bacl on as to not pinch it and create a vauum leak and lastly DO NOT forget the o'ring on the fuel line that goes up to the left side of the intake! BTDT and its ugly if forgotten.

awesome info bro----ok i just got the head off----- but i think ive gotton a little ahead of myself-----------here is my situation--------when the car was running, my compression was 110-110-70-40---yeah----wow!-------ok--and i also had a really terrible valve tap=----ok--so it sounds like i might have bent valves, and there not sealing and im loosing compresion---i know that i was also leaking coolant into the engine----this was confermed when i say the bad condition of the head gasket just now-------ok---so before my engine died, we were kinda drunk and went out and flogged the hell out of her---on the way home the valve tap was horrible and then she just died---also, when she was at the shop once, they said they heard a clunking noise comming from the bottom end--------=-----so now what im asking u is, how do i find out if my valves arent seeling right---i cant visualy see anything------should i try running pressurized whater through it to see if the valves leak-----i dont know----also, what could be that noise in the bottom end, and now that i have my head off is there anyway to check if my piston rings are sealing properly------thanks again!!!!! youve been very helpful

joe

Since the head is off I'd turn it over and fill each combustion chamber with water, if you see bubbles or the water disappears you have a sealing problem. But what you said happened if it was a valve it should be pretty evident. Checking rings with the head off isnt that easy. Since you are allready this far I think I'd drop the pan and take the timing cover off. I'll bet the timing chain snapped, if you drain the oil you may see signs of the plastic tensioner in the oil. It may seem like alot of work but your really only about an hour away from having it completely apart except the crank. We use to overhaul these engines,barring any heavy machining, in less than a day.

ok----sounds god----but as for my valve tap----is ther away to figure out which valve or valves are tapping?---should i replace the valves????---im not lookin to build the engine up, just get it running nicely--so its reliable---and u say the timing belt may have snapped----ok ill check that out----but keep in mind the bad valve tap and the coolent leakin in----can u explain what could have caused the 110-110-70-40 compresion before she blew up????and how do i fix it----furthermore---the car used to stall every time i clutched after the car was warmed up for about 15 mins---maybe that will help u figure it out--- i dont know if its a common thing with this motor----once again, thanks alot, youve been very helpful

Have any of the pistons been steam cleaned by the coolant? If you do not see any noticeable color difference in the pistons the coolant hadn't reached them yet. Should all be black with carbon and not a yellowish color from coolant. Hard to say what the tap was without seing the engine. Going off of what I see here everday I'm still betting on the timing chain but I have seen them wipe bearings also.

ok i put water into the combustion chambers and so far i dont see any air bubles----which totaly kills my theory----the only other thing that could kill my compresion like that is the pistons right????---probaly wont get to look at the chain till next weekend---now i might have to put new piston rings in????-- i dont have the proper tools for that---and its not that easy to get pisonts out of the engine while its still in the car is it????

If the chain jumped it can cause this also. When rings go they usually dont make noise. The only other thing is if it bent a connecting rod. If you can see the piston tops try spinning it and see if they all come up the same distance. Actually once the head is off the hard part is done, dropping the oil pan the pistons will come out with ease. The only other tool you'll need is a piston ring compressor and you can pick one up from your local parts store pretty cheap.

ok--- u say the chain jumping could cause valve tap n stuff----ok--but would it creat bad compresion in only 2 of the cylender----probaly not right-------sounds the only other thing would be a rod, or most likely bad piston rings right???

Believe it or not it can do that. Last 2 I did the 1st had 125 across the board and the other had good compression on 1 and 2 but 3 and 4 where very low. Guess it just depends on where the chain lands on the cam gear. Heres how it should look.

ok cool----so first thing i should do next weekend is check the chain---about how much does a new chain cost,and how do i make sure i have the timing correct when i put a new chain on?---and im not used to pushrods----when i put the head back on to check compresion do i just kind of lay them in place???i dont know when i took the head off they kinda fell all over the place ya know

Align the crankshaft sprocket timing mark with the tab on the timing chain tensioner.
Align the camshaft sprocket timing mark with the tab on the timing chain tensioner.

Use this with the pic of the chain above. Parts I cant imagine can be over 100 but I'm not sure.Pushrods just sit on top of the lifters.

ok---great---ill get to it this weekend and ill let u know how things are going------thats again!!!

Not a problem...Glad to help:)

hey after leavin the water in the chambers for about 2 days, i lost about a little more than a table sppon of water, which ran down the intake size and froze at the bottom-- and 2 of the others dripped a little dont the intake side---- u think that bid enough leakage to be creating a problem???

Nah.. That shouldn't present a problem. Valves probably have some minor pitting that could be taken care of by relapping them into the head.

thats kinda what i figures-- yeah i know about valve lapping-- no problem

Any new news?

nah--- sorry man--- as luck would have it---- my daily driver broke down on me, so i had to shell out big bucks for a distributor, so i may not get to workin on it agian till next weekend cause i have to work this weekend--- ill keep ya posted when i get back on it though----- thanks