Boosting plan, tell me if im doing the right thing...

So i was thinking about this ebay turbo, yes i know what everyone will say by now but hey, i dont have $3000 on a hahn, so im gonna spend $888 on this kit, it comes with everything except a turbo manifold and the downpipe... its a T3/T4 Hybrid turbo so its good, hmm i have a question tho...

Im planning to build up my engine, but i wanna build it up after i get the turbo kit, because i wanna boost it first, its stupid i know... i know that on a stock eco, it can only handle about 7 psi on a turbo this size, but my question is, how do you adjust the psi in a turbo setup? cuz i wanna build up my engine after i setup the kit, such as forged pistons, rods, rings, and etc, but can i adjust the psi to like 15 after i build up the engine, so that i can maybe run about 260+ HP later?

*EDIT* Heres the link to the Ebay Turbo kit...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/95-02-03-05-SUNFIRE-T3T4-AR50-CUSTOM-TURBO-CHARGER-KIT_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ36475QQihZ002QQitem Z120139292468QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

I read the first paragraph and I didn't click the link. I don't need to. I can already tell you it's a dumb idea. If you don't save up for a good set up, you're wasting your time and money. Do yourself a favor and A) Save up or B) Give up the boost plan.

Read the second paragraph and answer my question lol...

how do you adjust the psi?

From Cody...
To control how much boost the car can run is done by a spring in the wastegate. Dosn't matter whether is an internal or external one. There are different size spring that you can run. Its just a matter of swapping a new one in.

So the wastegate controls it huh? well so i can always buy a good quality wastegate and adjust the psi then, the ebay one can only go up to 7... and if i get a HKS BOV, if anything, i will sell the ebay turbo and buy a good turbo for like $1000 or something, that is still cheaper then the hahn kit... how about that? i will just run a crappy ebay turbo for now... at least i can run about 220HP

Its not THAT bad is it?

MY friend actually bought one of those ebay kits just to see what would happen and so far so good, no problems. sounds good, runs good. but who knows

Well im also buying it because the guy that repaired my car after the accident, his son has a 9 second crx, and the turbo it has is a crap one like this one for my car but was for his crx and it was off ebay... so i really dont think they are THAT bad...

Posts like these make me chuckle ....

... I'm not even going to contribute anything because, well... i don't need a reason.

Well it might not be the RIGHT thing, but its really cheap and it is not THAT bad, at least i get a intercooler setup and if anything, i can change out the wastegate, the bov, and even the turbo to a better/bigger turbo if i needed to but the pipings will be there already, this is a universal kit and thats why its cheap, its just alot of custom work needed to be done thats all...

It's cheap because it's typical low quality parts from ebay. Dude, why bother asking if you're set on getting it anyway? I could care less if you didn't take my advice but Cody knows his shit about turbos, especially turbo'd Jbodies. So whatever, it's your car and your money. There are certain things to do not buy off ebay, that's one of them.

I didnt say i was SET, lol... well i did say "Im buying it" but i didnt mean it like im buying it, i meant the one that i MIGHT going to buy lol... sorry, im just saying my point of view to see if it make sense or not thats all...

You might as well just dump 2 gallons of water into your crank case and just get it over with now.

Okay... i see where this is going...

I am going to add one thing and then I am done.

Yes, you see where this is going. You can spend $.50 on a gallon of water from a store to pour into the throttle body and hydro-lock the engine, destroying it. Or, you can spend $<1,000 to send it out in a blaze of glory (or not). If you really want to blow it up, why not save the $$$ and do what this guy did (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCc3SOcNGxY).

If you are intent on spending money to turbo it, do what others above are suggesting so you don't have to spend double $$$ on a new engine, let alone the money wasted on your EBAY kit.

you can piece together your own kit for around 1500 if you know where to look and do somethings yourself. 900 kit or a $7-8 vehicle with a blown engine. Seeing its your daily driver... i suggest you re-think this.

Well, instead of saying i am dumb or i should buy water and blow up my engine, why dont you guys say HOW this ebay kit WILL blow up my engine? just by saying buying a bottle of water and dump it in my engine doesnt help anything.

Another question... Right now im working on my Exhaust, im gonna buy a Dynomax glasspack and a magnaflow hi-flow cat, but im thinking about getting a header or not, so if i want to turbo my car, will the turbo mess with the header? like does it affect the header and do i need to buying a turbo header or exhaust manifold kinda thing? or i can keep my pacesetter 4-1 header...? I dont know much about this...

First off, where is it made? If it's Chinese (and there's no reason to believe it isn't given the price), then it's probably not going to be of the highest quality. Do you know how fast turbos can wind up? 100k RPM is not uncommon, but more likely the norm. The turbo needs oil, this comes from the engine. If the turbo fails ...

You should be able to put a mental video clip of that together.

Use only a turbocharger of known good quality - this is not an area to skimp on. If the turbo frags, then it could conceivably force-feed the engine debris (assuming the compressor side is the fail point), or worse yet - injure and/or kill you. At the least, the bearings might not be that good and will eventually sieze. Oil leaks can develop - just think of the mess that'll result if the engine starves for oil at a high (say, 4,000) RPM. Think of the possibility of oil/and or gasoline fires.

All for a $<1,000 eBay turbo kit.

Sorry, I'll pass.

Another thing you REALLY need to do is to get your priorities in order. Build your engine first for durability and THEN turbo it. If you give it 7 lbs. of boost, you're going to like that and you're going to want more. I remember what it was like to be 17. Your engine can't handle it - you haven't prepped the bottom end. You're going to need to find a way to give it more gasoline (enrichen the mixture) as the turbo will otherwise lean out the mixture with catastrophic results. Serious lean detonation is nothing to sneeze at, my friend. Engines don't like that sort of thing. Any boost will also cause an increase in compression, so you need to run lower compression pistons in order to let it live on anything less than avgas or racing gasoline. You need to do some serious research here.

True story to all of the above. Also, the header and exhaust maifold are the same thing. You need a trubo exhaust maifold if you are going to put a turbo on it.
The 4-2-1 or 4-1 header is not made for a turbo.
On the turbo manifold the tubes come out from the engine then they have a bend to go to the turbo. Then you need a downpipe to let the exhaust go to the rest of your tubing underneath the car.
Thats why it would be a waste of money to buy a 4-1 then put a turbo on it and have to buy a new manifold.

Thank you silicon212 and notaricajustfasta, your replies are what i was looking for, not the other ppl's "put water in your engine, dumb kid" comments...

Now i wont buy a header, i will save up and build up the engine first then piece a turbo together, and buy a good quality turbo. Still dont have to buy the Hahn kit... ahahah

I'll sell ya my t3/t4 turbonetics turbo, jdm intercooler, hks bov and all the flanges to go with it for 700.... :)

I'll sell ya my t3/t4 turbonetics turbo, jdm intercooler, hks bov and all the flanges to go with it for 700.... :)

Why are you selling them?

ebay turbo kits are shit....end of thread

If you want a good turbo kit, save up and start reading now. I can get you links to any kind of info you want...if you want to learn, i can give you a hand because i was once in your situation.

cuz I blew my head gasket and I need money cuz I'm moving, plus I'ma trying to buy a piece of crap car for my "family".

Seriously? Wow... You just bought your entire kit and just got it running too...

ebay turbo kits are shit....end of thread

If you want a good turbo kit, save up and start reading now. I can get you links to any kind of info you want...if you want to learn, i can give you a hand because i was once in your situation.

Thanks for offering the help, i would love to learn... hmm, should i buy Derk's turbo setup? He is selling his...

I'll sell ya my t3/t4 turbonetics turbo, jdm intercooler, hks bov and all the flanges to go with it for 700.... :)

Hmm, what about all the pipings and nuts and bolts, are you going to include them also?

keep in mind you guys have different engines, its not gonna just bolt right up

Still, my plan now after the ebay one is to buy parts of a turbo setup and just piece everything together, so if he sells me parts of it, then im willing to do some custom work, but thanks for the heads up tho...

The most important thing to do when you decide you're going to turbo your car is to make a budget. You ALWAYS need to budget more than you think because something WILL come up that requires immediate attention. Until you know exactly what goes into a setup, you're going to have little stupid problems here and there.

We can definately talk it over and work out a setup/budget/goal for your car. I can't say i know a ton about the Ecotec engines, but it can't be TOO far off from my Honda.

I would need to know a few details about the internals though...how are the pistons made?? Are they forged or cast? What is the bore and about how heavy are they? What is the stock redline on your engine? How thick/strong are the stock rods? Does ARP make a rodbolt upgrade for your engine? ETC...





add me on MSN or AIM and we'll talk....this goes for any of you guys if you need help or whatever....

[email protected]
turbo99DC2 on AIM

You'll need fuel upgrades, like injectors and a GOOD tune, or a FPR....

it's like alegbra, you have to balance the equation...

you're adding air, so you have to add fuel too, to make more power :)

and a manifold, and IC piping (have a shop make it for you)

and oil return (I can give you my feed, but my return won't work, it's Jerry rigged anyway, lol.)

Okay so after i buy your everything, i need:

Bigger aftermarket Fuel Injectors,
Oil Return Line,
Do i need a FMU? Like HpTuner?
Intercooler Pipings,
Turbo Exhaust manifold, where do i get that? I looked on ebay, none...
Good tuning... how are you suppose to get good tuning on the boringest island in hawaii? lol...

lol If you get hptuners you won't need a good tuning you can tune your own car like I can :).... I don't know anything about the ecotech engine tho... the intercooler is a small one perfect for the size of the turbo so you're good there...now all you gotta decide is if you want 2.5" or 3" IC pipe :) which is a whole new argument all together. btw the IC is 2.5" wide but I dunno how tall or wide until I take it off....

You bought all the turbo stuff new right? Or did you buy them from someone?

Should i do 2.5 or 3 inch?

Yes i wanna know your intercooler size please...

Whats your innovate tuning module thingy? Is it a wideband sensor/controller? What does it do and do i need it? Are you going to include that as well?

Its a HKS Blow off valve that you are going to give me right?

I need turbo spark plugs right? 1 or 2 steps colder? Which brand is the best and should i get iridium or platnium?

Will i be able to run 250+ HP with this setup? on stock engine? and can i go over 300 HP after i build up the engine?

What kind of boost controller should i get? Greddy, apexi, HKS??

Also, i really dont understand how the downpipe is bolt onto a turbo setup and how it works, can you tell me?

Ok...i'm going to make you a list of what you need for your car....you can use it as a kind of checklist if you want.

1. Manifold/dp/dump-----($500-2000) now you're going to want something that does a few things here. You want to keep your accessories like ac and ps, but dont want to sacrifice too much power by doing so. A log will do fine, but a shorty ramhorn is the best for the money on a lower HP street setup. Also, i would recommend a 3" exhaust, but 2.5" will suffice. This is a big step so dont half-ass it!!

2. Turbo-----($100-1200)again, a big choice. Most people think that you can just slap any old turbo on and go. You can, but there are turbos that are better than others for your setup. I've been testing one on my car lately and i can tell you that changing a few little things makes a HUGE difference. Dont rush or half ass this step at all!!

3. Injectors-----($80-300)your injector sizing will dictate your power more than your turbo/manifold/exhaust/etc...you can only make as much power as you can provide fuel for. Once you decide on a power goal, we can talk about injectors. I think you'd be safe w/ a set of 550cc injectors as they're good for about 350whp at stock fuel pressure.

4. Intercooler------($100-300) Most people think they know a lot about intercoolers, but are commonly misled. A larger intercooler and larger diameter piping will increase lag and pressure drop in a system which means your turbo has to work harder to make the same power. A good intercooler is one that is thick and not very large overall. Mine is a 28x6x3 and it is fine at 350whp. DO NOT get the biggest one you can find because it looks cool or whatever...you're just making your setup inefficient.

5. Piping-----($150-350) I would suggest mild steel piping because it is fairly inexpensive and will do the trick so to speak. If you have the bank, get either stainless steel or aluminum. Couplers are important in this step. Make sure to spend the extra money to get the good ones. I use Vibrant 4ply couplers and tbolt clamps on my setup. The trick w/ tbolts is to order them larger than your piping by 1/4" or you'll have fun putting them on....

6. Wastegate----($200-300) A wastegate is a very important part of the setup. You're going to need a 38mm. I can say that without even knowing your power goal. That wastegate is a very common and versitile one. I would get Tial because the TurboSmart, Deltagate and all that other crap is just not worth your time.

7. Boost controller-----($50-400) On your setup, you could use something like what i have. I'm using a Hallman MBC. You're not going to need some fancy EBC (electronic boost controller) because it has more options than you're going to need and is a luxury. You could better use the money elsewhere. My personal advice is to pick a light wastegate spring (.4-.5 bar) and get a good MBC.

8. Blow-Off Valve-----($100-250) My personal recommendation is a Tial, but if you're not making more than about 250whp, dont bother with it. At that power range i would get either the Greddy Type RS or the HKS SSQV. The HKS is the ricey choice though....it is very loud!! Tial is the best for functionality so if you're planning to make more power one day, invest in one now.

9. Oil Line Kit-----($80ish) I can get you one for a very good deal through StealthmodePerformance. If you want to look at their inventory and check out my car while you're at it, just put a www and .com on either side of the business name. Oil lines are turbo specific to a point...some require a little different fitting on the feed side. Steve will know and help you out.

10. Management (EMS) and tuning----($a lot)ABSOLUTELY CRUCIAL is an understatement!! Most people think they can half ass a management system. Those are the people who blow up their engines. I cant say that i'm familiar w/ what is available to you guys w/ Cavaliers, but for Hondas there is a huge following. I know that if nothing else, you can use MegaSquirt. Personally, i would invest in a management that doesnt suck; therefore, AVOID the SAFC/VAFC, FMU and all those other bandaid fixes. For my personal setup, i've spent about $1000 in tuning and the system itself....be prepared to spend money here because this will make or break your setup.



If you decide to half ass any of these steps, you're going to have a bad setup or a lot of problems. Be sure to budget accordingly. When you need help, ask! If its worth doing, its worth doing right....the first time!!

Good luck

that's the stuff you NEED....other than that, there are things that make life easier like boost gauges, vac manifolds and such....i'm sure i forgot something too...i usually overlook the small stuff

Im trying to sell this and you're not helping, lol.

let's see what questions did I have to answer again *looks up*...

yes it was all new

yes it's a wideband, no you can't have it, lol. I need it to tune my car, plus Iit's always good to know you're true a/f. I have a crappy piece of shit narrowband one you can have but it's not going to suffice so I dunno why I offered, lol.

yes hks

I bought zex plugs, they're for boosted/nitrous applications. But I've heard some other ones are real good...can't remember the name for the life of me now...

I don't know the slightest thing about your engine so I can't tell you want you should and shouldn't do... But I can tell you where to look, but please don't ask this question on their forums you wil get flamed to the end of the world and then dropped off... www.j-body.org go to the boost section.

he answered your boost controller thing

on this turbo it had a downpipe adaptor, basically you welded the downpipe to it and attached it to the bolts on the turbo... but I don't know if I can get that piece off or not, seeing how it is welded.... You might be able to find a flange to get on the end of it so the downpipe will work easily.

I'm not sure on the wastegate part though, it's internally gated so I wouldn't know how to get around that if you plan on more than 7psi... ask schister, lol.

this is the only video I have of it, which pisses me off, lol. but whatever. I got bored one day and decided to mess around with my camera...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIPMEXXFz0g

You could make Dark Eliso's turbo setup for well for you. Personally i would change a few things, but thats me. If you are serious about getting a setup, i think his turbo kit is a great place to start. I remember him piecing it together actually.

For starters:
1. You dont need a wideband...just get it professionally tuned and forget it. Use that extra $250 to get a better tune/tuning software.
2. Use all the same size IC piping....either all 2.5 or all 2.25. I noticed in your vid that the HKS flange and pipe is smaller which is a constriction. If you get all the piping that small, you'd have less lag, but less power up top...provided you ever made enough power.
3. I dont recall what size exhaust he had, but i would get a full 3". It spools faster and makes more power overall
4. A boost controller works just the same on an external gate as an internal gate....

Holy shit i like the sound of that...

Hmm, so you will include the downpipe too then?

So i need to buy:

larger fuel injectors,
turbo/boost spark plugs,
exhaust manifold,
some piping that i need for the IC,
HPTuner,
Maybe a external wastegate 38mm TIAL,
nuts and bolts,
couplers and clamps,

If i need more please add on to my list...

if he's not including the manifold, then you have no use for the downpipe....every manifold sits differently

wouldnt fit on a ecotec anyways. its mounted 180 degrees from the way the 2200 is and im pretty sure the manifold bolts wont line up. it looks like a nice setup. i would think about it for my car and leave it a sleeper if i had the money.....but i dont, so good luck

why can't I find any info on your stupid engine, lol. Um My entire exhaust is one piece now :) So I don't think that would be possible. On the same token, Look where mine goes, and what are the chances that yours would be in the right spot after you mount the turbo.

how about some teasers? :D

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_129_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_130_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_131_full.jpg

This is what it looks like without the downpipe adaptor...

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_146_full.jpg

and then the downpipe welded to the adaptor...

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_164_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_170_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_174_full.jpg

the IC

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_175_full.jpg

If I can get this off in one piece you can have this too, lol... :(
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2362000-2362999/2362121_183_full.jpg

yeah even if I could include the manifold, even it WAS the same engine...

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/Derk_eliso/DSCI1395.jpg

LOL...your turbo is a bastard child....it's half Garrett/AirResearch and the other half Turbonetics.....nice

Thats a pretty good checklist there Schister :grinyes:. Derk_eliso, why r u sellin the kit u just got it on?

LOL...your turbo is a bastard child....it's half Garrett/AirResearch and the other half Turbonetics.....nice

So is it a good turbo?

Here's my engine bay, your turbo is in the front, mine will be in the back behind the engine cuz that's where my exhaust manifold is at...

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01023.jpg

That, you cant see the exhaust manifold lol, i will take a picture of the exhaust manifold that is behind the engine tomorrow morning and upload it so you can see...

If anything, just give me everything that you dont want and i will have my shop cut and weld everything to make them fit...

Should i do 3 inch pipings and 3 inch exhaust then?

Here's a shot of the front of the car and the mouth after the front bumper...

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/Bomex7.jpg

Here's the Bomex front bumper...

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC00119.jpg

His Exhaust manifold wont fit on mine right? Can i have mine made outta the stock manifold or should i buy the ones that RDFABs is making?

I believe this is the manifold you want:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Turbo-Manifold-Cavalier-Solstice-ECOTEC-2-0-2-2-2-4_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ002QQitemZ1 20140825366QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

I believe this is the manifold you want:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Turbo-Manifold-Cavalier-Solstice-ECOTEC-2-0-2-2-2-4_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ002QQitemZ1 20140825366QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

o0o0o0o Thanks for finding one for me, it is the only one that is listed on ebay right now, im gonna get it... :lol:

Yeah i will take the "turbocharged" sticker too lol... :grinyes:

Here i just took 6 pictures behind the engine... well sort of behind the engine... take a look guys, it shouldnt be hard to bent some pipes and make it fit...

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01040.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01041.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01042.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01043.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01044.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b230/FlexHehe/DSC01045.jpg


Hope these pictures help... :banghead:

I was wondering about the ebay item that Jerseycavyz24 found...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120140825366

2 Questions:

Should i get a external wastegate? Is it better than just using the internal wastegate?

Should i buy the turbo manifold from this guy? Apparently he is in Canada, and he had sold alot of cavalier and sunfire turbo exhaust manifolds... Im not familiar with ebay and paypal, am i covered with protection?

same guy that sold me mine...mine cracked...... make sure you bolt the turbo to something so that it isn't weighing down your manifold and causing pressure + heat = crack....

you're going to have fun squishing that turbo behind your engine....nice clean bay though :grinyes:

To answer your previous question, yes, it is a good turbo, i merely noticed that it had two different brand housings....no big deal though

Yeah, okay, im going to buy that manifold then...

Should i get a external wastegate flange for $30 more? How do i use a external wastegate with his turbo? What do i need? Is it a good idea to use an external wastegate?

no, for 30 dollars more he'll add a FLANGE for an external wastegate.... negative you don't need it. The spring in the internally waste gate works great and with a boost controller you can add more boost. So not needed I would say....

yeah I think almost every turbo has some garret parts in it :)

Okay, i will buy only the turbo manifold then, how's your turbo manifold? Is it good quality? u said it cracked only because your turbo was sitting on it... The crack is fixable right if mine cracks?

I will buy the turbo manifold before it ends, you wont back out on me right? i dont wanna buy it and then no turbo and it will be a paper weight lol...

lol no chance of that happening. I am a broke fucker that can't even afford a headgasket right now, lol.

no the crack is not fixable. unless u weld it and it seems like a pretty shotty "fix" to me. i dunno how ur gonna mount the turbo to anything, im sure there arent many, if any, extra holes to mount anything to it for support, but i could be wrong...

just as long as it's not like dead weight, maybe he could slip in some kind of surface for it to be bolted to and then bolt that to the firewall or the engine block....just SOMETHING is better than nothing. By the way, it's all coming off tomorrow and I'll take pics :)