Headlights on a 95 Metro

Hi Gang,
I am having trouble figuring out the headlights on my blue 95 2 Dr hatchback, 1L 5spd. :banghead:

Here are the symptoms so maybe someone has a clue or two...

Daytime running lights come on when running, as the emergency is released, with pulling the lever giving brights (passing lights?)

Parking lights function correctly.

I turn on the headlights & the running lights go off and I get parking lights only.

The only way I can drive at night is to use the parking lights and rely on the running lights function.

All bulbs and relays seem to test out good.


Thanks,
Mark

I have the same symptom on a '96. There is either a headlight switch problem or a wiring problem at the fusebox. Check for melted plastic at the fusebox or heavily oxidized or burnt wires/connections. I did temporarily resolve my problem once by de-oxidizing the wires for the headlight circuit. I think quite a few of the Metro's circuits use wires of insufficient gauge and connections for the loads involved.

The bad news is that rebuilding the harness is quite a pain, but it has solved some people's problems. The headlight switch is not cheap. I do not know if it can be rebuilt.

In my case, on a very rare occasion the problem will resolve itself for a few moments. I've learned to live with using my headlights in the middle position.

There are a few posts on this and 'headlights' related issues, if you search.

It is a problem with the fuse block. The connector that plugs into the fuse block has a tendency to corrode which increases resistance and causes heat to build up. This then causes the plug and fuse block to melt and the connection to become intermittent and eventually fail. You may be able to work the plug around and get it to connect again but eventually that will fail as well. You can either try to find a replacement or attempt a repair. I came up with a way to alter the connection/ fuse block and improve the size of the connection for that particular wire but I don't currently have a spare I can alter to the improved design.

Wow, I love this place and love my little Geo,

I got under the dash looking at the fuse block and pulled the plugs and inspected them. One had some blackening on it but had not melted I plugged it back in and the lights worked. I will get some electrical contact cleaner on it later today.

Thanks for the help!! This probably would have cost me dearly in a garage.

meharty

I came up with a way to alter the connection/ fuse block and improve the size of the connection for that particular wire but I don't currently have a spare I can alter to the improved design.

Hi MMM,

I would love to know what you did here as I want to fix this problem once and for all. I pulled the wire (white with black stripe and brown bands) out of the connecting harness as it is badly melted. I cleaned the corroded terminals. Can I take a 16 gauge wire with an in line 20 amp fuse straight from the battery to the headlight wire? And at the battery, do I attach directly to the post, or can I splice into another hot wire near the relay box? I'm not sure how this is usually done.

Thanks for any advice,

Jai

Without looking at a wiring diagram what you are suggesting may work. I preferred to keep things as close to stock as possible. I removed the fuse block from the car, opened the housing/ removed some plastic to access the copper stip that supplies power to the connector (it's about 3 times larger), soldered a wire to the power feed for the melted connector and connected it to the wire with standard crimp on spade connectors making the contact area and metal for heat dissapation much larger. The fix has been in place for a year and a half with no evidence of heat damage or flickering from the headlights. If I ever make it to a junk yard and can pick up a couple of fuse blocks for a reasonable price I plan to offer altered fuse blocks for sale with everything needed to install it. I would also be willing to add this alteration to a fusebox sent to me for $15.00 plus return shipping.

The geo uses a grounding system on the headlights,
the wires often bad in the fuse box do not
go to power, they are grounded by the headlight
relay. Make sure the black/white wire
is okay and it connects to a brown/yellow wire
which runs to the headlight relay. Any break
in these wires results in no headlights.

I like mighty mouse's solution, which is a lot more discrete than what I have done to fix this problem. In short, I by-passed the fuse panel by cutting the wire coming from the headlight switch (burnt) and joined it to the corresponding wire on the other side of the panel (the two wires mentioned in the post above whose job it is to control the H/L relay) with a good solder joint and some shrink tube. Haven't had any trouble since on the metros I've done this to. Be sure to use a wiring diagram for reference so you don't cut and join the wrong wires.

-MechanicMatt

Thanks MechanicMatt, I've had the repair in place for over a year and checked it for signs of heating up and there are none. Been no problems with the lights since.

Hello all,

New to the forma and was surprized to see my question already answered (sort off). Not being ouch of a wiring person, I have the following question.

My problems started with using the middle position for headlights on, but last night all headlight functionality stopped. No High Beam, no LB and no day time runnig lights. Fuses all okay, relays function, but all I get is 12V on all the connectors at the head light plug. Is this the melted connectors you all are talking about?

I took off the bottom of the relay box to see if there was a loose connection last night (tight with battery in the way), it looked okay. Do you have pictures of what wiring need to be modified or is my problem completly different.

P

Thanks for the insights MMM. I can picture what you have done. I will practice on the old fuse box.

I scored at the pick and pull today. Here's pics of the new fuse boxes. They both came off of 95's, though one was a firefly, and the other a metro. both had about 130,000 kms (81,000 miles) on the odometer. It's become rather obvious to me that this is a common problem.

Here's the question. What circuit does that pin belong to? I had always thought that was for the lights, but the wring diagram says that white wire with black line is for the ignition. Each headlight should have it's own circuit I believe.

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7425/car028ie7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7425/car028ie7.d6c9eb5380.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=521&i=car028ie7.jpg)http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/4451/car032sx8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/4451/car032sx8.d6c3cf84e6.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=527&i=car032sx8.jpg)http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/8154/car034gn2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Jai

Just a quick reply without looking at the wiring diagram. What you are showing is what I remember and that wire is supplying power to the switch for the headlights. The wire is just large enough but the connector is just too small. The copper bar supplying the power to that connector is on the outer edge of the fuse box and can be accessed by seperating the fuse block halves and then cutting a hole for the new wire to go through. It sounds as though you are definately capable of making the modification but just as an offer to you or anyone else; since you got two spares, I would be willing to modify and return one to you in exchange for your second spare.

I've modified the wiring on my 93 so that the connector and fuse box do not carry the full headlight current. Instead I put in aftermarket relays and wired them directly to the battery, through a fuse of course. Now the fusebox/connector only carry the relay coil current which is well under 1 amp.

This mod also makes the lights brighter since there is very little resistance in the circuit so the bulbs get full voltage. Before the mod I measured 11.2 volts at the bulb with engine running and system voltage at 14.2. After the mod the voltage at the bulbs is 14.2. Makes a noticable difference.

Q

Hey MMM,

Thanks for the offer, but I am ready to put this thing back together this weekend. I will do the mod as you explain. I have two metros and want to fix them both. Next time I'm at the pick n pull, I'll grad another fuse box. I can send it if you like. They cost us $8 (Can) here. Used to be much cheaper at the lot, but they have really jacked the prices considerably.

Jai

Headlamp Circut

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c83/MrBBody/HeadlightCircut.gif

Ignition switch and Starting and charging (Part 1)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c83/MrBBody/StarterAndChargingPart1.gif

Ignition switch and Starting and charging (Part 2

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c83/MrBBody/StarterAndChargingPart2.gif

These are better diagrams than the ones in Haynes. Thanks! I have wondered a few times whether there are any diagrams that just show what each wire entering and exiting the fuse box are. Also, is the junction box the one under the hood next to the relay box?

Jai

I've modified the wiring on my 93 so that the connector and fuse box do not carry the full headlight current. Instead I put in aftermarket relays and wired them directly to the battery, through a fuse of course. Now the fusebox/connector only carry the relay coil current which is well under 1 amp.

This mod also makes the lights brighter since there is very little resistance in the circuit so the bulbs get full voltage. Before the mod I measured 11.2 volts at the bulb with engine running and system voltage at 14.2. After the mod the voltage at the bulbs is 14.2. Makes a noticable difference.

Q

Utilizing a relay for this is just absolutely brilliant. Good thinking man, why didn't I think of that? :wink: From now on, I'm going to relay the circuit when these things meltdown.

-MechanicMatt

The relay box and fuse box are under the hood and the junction block is under the dash.

I finally got time to try MMM's fix and it worked! I have some photos that I will post later.The mystery problem I was having with the ignition fuse blowing is gone and when I tried it started up great. The only problem is now the rear turn signals are not functioning. Neither are the rear hazards. I know they worked before and that the problem is back near the junction block.

Does anyone know of something that could make the rear turn signals not work? I took all the harnesses out of the block and hooked it all up again looking for bad connections but could see nothing.

Jai

Does anyone know of something that could make the rear turn signals not work? I took all the harnesses out of the block and hooked it all up again looking for bad connections but could see nothing.

Jai
Turn the key to the ON position, click the turn sig arm to L, then R then check and see if your FRONT Turn sig bulbs light up and flash like their suppose too? Engage the hazard switch and check again? It's doubtful with both bulbs BUT, did you try a new bulbs in the rear Jai? Get a 12V Test light, do the the turn sig arm test again, then start at one of the Rear turn sig bulb sockets and check for voltage at the GREEN Wire, repeat at the other socket....If your getting 12V's at the wires, then bulbs are gone and need to be replaced. ALSO, The grounds for these lights and harness need to be checked to ensure their clean and making good contact? If no voltage (And front lights are flashing)....The green wire(s) need to be traced back to the front for a open or shorted wire with the 12V Test light. If the fronts DONT flash either.....I'd suspect a bad flasher unit is the culprit. (The turn signal and hazard flasher is located under the left hand side of the instrument panel near the fuse panel) You can usually locate the flasher unit, engage the flashers and touch or hear the flasher unit and tell if it's "Clicking" inside? Here's the wiring diagrams for the Turn signals and Hazards.

Turn Signals and Hazards wiring #1

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c83/MrBBody/TurnSig-Hazardcircuts1.gif

Turn Signals and Hazards wiring #2

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c83/MrBBody/TurnSig-Hazardcircuts2.gif

I know this an old thread and an old problem, but I'm having it now on my 95 Metro. I tried MrPink's method of soldering a new connection, but it didn't work for me, probably because I don't solder so well. Can anyone tell me where that yellow/brown or brown/yellow wire that runs to the headlight relay is located on the fuse box to bypass the fuse block directly to the black/white burned wire? Is it on the back of the block opposite side of the black/white connector? What exactly does it look like? Brown with yellow stripe, yellow with brown stripe, yellow with brown rings? I have a temporary fix now, but it won't last long I'm sure. Need someone smarter than I am to find this headlight relay wire. I'm thinking that bypassing the fuse block is all I can manage.

Thanks,

rja87