Brake light issue

Hi all,

I have the issue where the third/center brake light works fine, so do the parking and turning lights, but the back two brake lights don't work. I tired replacing the bulbs this morning, but no luck there.

I searched through some old threads and it looks like maybe I have the bad multifunction/turning signal switchbox issue. Bnaylor gives all the others good advice but then the thread just stops. Has anyone heard back from these guys to see if replacing the bad switchbox corrected the issue? Also, I guess I should check the fuse first before assuming it's a bad switchbox? Where's the fusebox located?

Know of any good places to buy the switchbox? I have a 2002 Grand Prix GTP Coupe.

Thanks for all the great info!

GT

Actually we do get replies that the MFS switch corrected the issue but not in some of the threads. The part that goes bad causing the lack of the two stoplights less the third is the 4 way hazard switch part of the MFS.

On a few occasions it was wiring at the main engine compartment fuse box and on another one of the lamp sockets but that was blowing a fuse. The fuses are either at the engine compartment fuse box or the one by the glovebox. There are maps/placard to go by.

The MFS is expensive at a GM dealer. You can get one used from Ed Morad and someone on the forum may have a spare and looking to get rid of it. They have new aftermarket on EBay for around $125.00.

It is about a one hour DIY job.

And welcome to AF.

Thanks for the quick response bnaylor! I can check the fuse to see if it's blown, but is there a visual way to check the MFS before I order a new one, since it almost might be the wiring as you suggested?

You're welcome.

No real visual way even if you remove the MFS. It is sealed and hard to disassemble. Color coding of wiring varies between Grand Prix models. With GM wiring diagrams you have to ohm out (check resistance) point to point from the MFS connector block electrical connectors (gray & black colored) all the way to the lamp sockets. I'll double check the wiring diagrams when I get home and let you know if I see anything better as far as troubleshooting.


http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/lizzywiz/mfs.jpg
MFS Removed

Thanks, much appreciated. Looks like the replacement is the MFS and the entire lever.

I found another symptom over lunch. After reading the past threads I tried the hazard lights and the "button" sure enough is jamed so it won't go down at all. IIRC, this is another symptom of a bad MFS.

Yes. The brake light output goes through contacts of the hazard switch as I mentioned earlier. The pic shows everything you will get with the MFS including the hazard switch part and the complete wiring harness.

Called a dealer today. They wanted $415.00!!!!! Help, where can I find one for (hopefully) much less? My Ebay search skills failed me or there isn't one on there. Any websites where I can get one? Ed Morad site is down atm, but I emailed them.

Thanks,

GT

you could just get a whole, lightly used, steering column from the wrecking yard for under $100. takes about 40 mins to an hour to swap out. just be sure to get the ignition keys with it and pull the airbag fuses and disconnect the battery before you start or you're in for a big oshit story.

Called a dealer today. They wanted $415.00!!!!! Help, where can I find one for (hopefully) much less? My Ebay search skills failed me or there isn't one on there. Any websites where I can get one? Ed Morad site is down atm, but I emailed them.

Thanks,

GT

EBay Used $65.00 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-Grand-Prix-Turn-Signal-Switch-97-03_W0QQitemZ190091066450QQihZ009QQcategoryZ50459QQ rdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem)

Ed Morad EBay Used $69.99 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/00-02-Grand-Prix-Wiper-Cruise-Turn-Multi-Function_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33598QQihZ013Q QitemZ230062342019QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW)

EBay New GM $189.95 Includes Shipping (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2000-2003-Pontiac-Grand-prix-new-GM-turn-Signal-Switch_W0QQitemZ220110518868QQihZ012QQcategoryZ504 59QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

GMPartsDirect.Com PN:26084696 $215.92 (http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/)

EBay Used $65.00 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-Grand-Prix-Turn-Signal-Switch-97-03_W0QQitemZ190091066450QQihZ009QQcategoryZ50459QQ rdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem)

Ed Morad EBay Used $69.99 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/00-02-Grand-Prix-Wiper-Cruise-Turn-Multi-Function_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33598QQihZ013Q QitemZ230062342019QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW)

EBay New GM $189.95 Includes Shipping (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2000-2003-Pontiac-Grand-prix-new-GM-turn-Signal-Switch_W0QQitemZ220110518868QQihZ012QQcategoryZ504 59QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

GMPartsDirect.Com PN:26084696 $215.92 (http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/)

Thanks. They only one I ended up finding last night was the $189 one. Discovered this morning that the fog lamps don't work either. Man, I hope this is all related to this bad switch. :)

Thanks. They only one I ended up finding last night was the $189 one. Discovered this morning that the fog lamps don't work either. Man, I hope this is all related to this bad switch. :)

As far as the brake light problem most likely the MFS, specifically the 4 way hazard switch part. Your foglight problem could be another issue or possibly related to the MFS low/high beam control. Remember the fog lights turn off with hi-beams on so that part of the MFS would have to be stuck in hi-beam mode. Of course, you should have an indication of that such as the hi-beam indicator on and head lamps in high. The foglights have a relay so check that out.

Got the part in and started the process to remove the old one, but I can't get the steering wheel column cover off because of the steering wheel tilt lever. Any ideas how to get this off?

Got the part in and started the process to remove the old one, but I can't get the steering wheel column cover off because of the steering wheel tilt lever. Any ideas how to get this off?

On the tilt steering lever to the right side is a tang. Insert a small screwdriver and pry outwards. The lever should pop right off. Good luck.

Well, after a few hours, a bunch of noob mistakes, several curse words, and a trip to True Value to buy some new tools (YEAH, new tools!) I got the new, read used, turn signal switch installed.

Thank you bnaylor for all your help.

Man, it's a PITA working underneath the dash! :) I saved a bunch of money doing it myself though which is especially good because we just dumped a bunch of money into my wife's car this past week.

Unfortunately, I think I screwed up something else while in the process, but I'll open a new thread for that. :(

Thanks again.

GT

Thanks for the feedback and you're welcome. So where did you decide to get the MFS and how much?

Yeah, I recall Torx T20, T25 and the small 7mm socket for that bolt holding the electrical connectors to the connector block under the dash for the MFS and ignition switch. I agree it is a PITA under there. Hard to beat DIY and saving money. :thumbsup:

I got the part used from the Ed Morad Ebay link you posted. So $80 for the part shipped and $30 in tools. Did it myself for $100. Saved A LOT of money!

Thanks again!

GT