Changing Injectors
89civic_sedan
05-03-2007, 10:57 PM
I just bought a 93 accord and he told me that the injectors need to be leaned or changed. Im going to just buy some new ones. I wanted to know how hard is it to change the injectors or just get it done at a shop.
jeffcoslacker
05-04-2007, 07:13 AM
If you can change spark plugs, you can probably change the injectors...
REMOVAL & INSTALLATION
See Figures 1 and 2
Disconnect the negative battery cable.
Relieve the fuel system pressure.
Remove the fuel rail assembly (refer to the procedure outlined later in this section).
Carefully pull the injectors from the intake manifold.
Discard the seal rings, cushion rings and O-rings.
To install:
Slide new cushion rings onto the injectors.
http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/jpg/small/0900823d800d0833.jpg (javascript:pop()
Fig. 1: Always use new cushion rings, seal rings and O-rings
Coat new O-rings with clean engine oil and put them on the injectors.
Insert the injectors into the fuel rail. Be sure to align the center line on the injector with the mark on the fuel rail.
http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/jpg/small/0900823d800d0834.jpg (javascript:pop()
Fig. 2: Be sure to align the center line on the injector with the mark on the fuel rail
Coat new seal rings with clean engine oil and insert them into the intake manifold.
Install the fuel rail assembly.
REMOVAL & INSTALLATION
See Figures 1 and 2
Disconnect the negative battery cable.
Relieve the fuel system pressure.
Remove the fuel rail assembly (refer to the procedure outlined later in this section).
Carefully pull the injectors from the intake manifold.
Discard the seal rings, cushion rings and O-rings.
To install:
Slide new cushion rings onto the injectors.
http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/jpg/small/0900823d800d0833.jpg (javascript:pop()
Fig. 1: Always use new cushion rings, seal rings and O-rings
Coat new O-rings with clean engine oil and put them on the injectors.
Insert the injectors into the fuel rail. Be sure to align the center line on the injector with the mark on the fuel rail.
http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/jpg/small/0900823d800d0834.jpg (javascript:pop()
Fig. 2: Be sure to align the center line on the injector with the mark on the fuel rail
Coat new seal rings with clean engine oil and insert them into the intake manifold.
Install the fuel rail assembly.
89civic_sedan
05-05-2007, 04:27 PM
OK ive changed the injectors and spark plugs and wires and im still having the same problem.....the car sounds like its running off 3 cylinders and alot of blueis smoke is coming out and when i go to take off in first gear it soundls like its bout to die...its not getting enough fule but i dont know how to fix it.
jeffcoslacker
05-06-2007, 02:06 AM
Blue smoke is oil....you need to do a compression test before you waste any more time with it...sounds like you have a dead hole with little or no compression.
Did one plug have oil on it?
Did one plug have oil on it?
89civic_sedan
05-06-2007, 06:39 AM
NO.....how can i fix a dead hole?
jeffcoslacker
05-06-2007, 08:04 AM
Have to identify the source of the problem first....
Your first place to start is a compression test. If you can verify acceptable and even levels of compression on all cylinders, you can then proceed with trying to find a performance problem. If you have a hole that shows low compression compared to the others, you have an internal mechanical problem, and it won't run right until it's corrected.
EXCESS fuel will make them run bad at low rpm and smoke, but it would be a black sooty smoke that comes out hard when you step on the gas, along with the motor misfiring and possibly backfiring until it begins to clear out as revs increase.
Hazy blue smoke indicates the presence of oil in the combustion chamber, which can only get there a few ways...through the rings, through a bad valve guide/seal, bad head gasket, or through the PCV system. A PCV problem will not generally cause a single cylinder misfire, though. You might check it anyway. It should rattle when shaken.
The person you got it from didn't mention a new timing belt, did they? Sometimes if you run them until the belt breaks, a piston will dink a valve and bend it, and can cause problems like you have...people like to sell cars after having a $600 timing belt and water pump job done, only to find it has valve damage and doesn't run right anymore...
Anyway, you need to confirm that the engine is mechanically solid internally before chasing your tail in circles...any smoke other than sooty black fuel smoke is an indication something is wrong with the motor outside of general performance problems.
A quick and dirty way to check it also is with a vacuum reading...a vacuum gauge costs about $25 and can spot internal trouble pretty quick...I take one with me when looking at cars to buy....
Vacuum reading is just the flipside of compression, a cylinder that can't hold compression can't create as much vacuum on intake stroke as the others either, and it shows up in the reading as a steady dropout in the reading each time that cylinder inhales, which produces a rhythmic shake in the needle at idle, that increases with engine speed and really makes the needle buzz. Other problems can cause readings that are low or wandering, but a dead cylinder's reading is very distinct...when you buy the gauge, they will include a very easy to understand chart that explains the causes of all the possible readings. I find it to be the best $25 I ever spent, for quick answers and avoiding trouble.
If a vacuum reading leads you to suspect a problem, then you have to compression test each hole. When you find the bad one, inject 20cc's of oil into the cylinder and turn the motor over by hand slowly a couple of revolutions, then recheck the reading. If it increases substantially, the problem is most likely a broken compression ring or similar problem...if there is no change in reading then the upper cylinder (valves, head gasket, etc) is suspect. The oil serves to temporarily seal the rings, which raises the reading, but has no effect on top cylinder parts, the oil never gets that high....
Let me ask you this....does it smoke initially when the motor is started cold, or only after warming up? Some things can cause problems that are a bit baffling with mixed symptoms, like a clogged catalytic convertor, which will make it run bad, run hot, and smoke.
Or a bad fuel pressure regulator, which can cause overfueling and hard starting, and make the idle very rough and create a lot of exhaust smoke at idle and on run-up (but the black sooty kind)
Your first place to start is a compression test. If you can verify acceptable and even levels of compression on all cylinders, you can then proceed with trying to find a performance problem. If you have a hole that shows low compression compared to the others, you have an internal mechanical problem, and it won't run right until it's corrected.
EXCESS fuel will make them run bad at low rpm and smoke, but it would be a black sooty smoke that comes out hard when you step on the gas, along with the motor misfiring and possibly backfiring until it begins to clear out as revs increase.
Hazy blue smoke indicates the presence of oil in the combustion chamber, which can only get there a few ways...through the rings, through a bad valve guide/seal, bad head gasket, or through the PCV system. A PCV problem will not generally cause a single cylinder misfire, though. You might check it anyway. It should rattle when shaken.
The person you got it from didn't mention a new timing belt, did they? Sometimes if you run them until the belt breaks, a piston will dink a valve and bend it, and can cause problems like you have...people like to sell cars after having a $600 timing belt and water pump job done, only to find it has valve damage and doesn't run right anymore...
Anyway, you need to confirm that the engine is mechanically solid internally before chasing your tail in circles...any smoke other than sooty black fuel smoke is an indication something is wrong with the motor outside of general performance problems.
A quick and dirty way to check it also is with a vacuum reading...a vacuum gauge costs about $25 and can spot internal trouble pretty quick...I take one with me when looking at cars to buy....
Vacuum reading is just the flipside of compression, a cylinder that can't hold compression can't create as much vacuum on intake stroke as the others either, and it shows up in the reading as a steady dropout in the reading each time that cylinder inhales, which produces a rhythmic shake in the needle at idle, that increases with engine speed and really makes the needle buzz. Other problems can cause readings that are low or wandering, but a dead cylinder's reading is very distinct...when you buy the gauge, they will include a very easy to understand chart that explains the causes of all the possible readings. I find it to be the best $25 I ever spent, for quick answers and avoiding trouble.
If a vacuum reading leads you to suspect a problem, then you have to compression test each hole. When you find the bad one, inject 20cc's of oil into the cylinder and turn the motor over by hand slowly a couple of revolutions, then recheck the reading. If it increases substantially, the problem is most likely a broken compression ring or similar problem...if there is no change in reading then the upper cylinder (valves, head gasket, etc) is suspect. The oil serves to temporarily seal the rings, which raises the reading, but has no effect on top cylinder parts, the oil never gets that high....
Let me ask you this....does it smoke initially when the motor is started cold, or only after warming up? Some things can cause problems that are a bit baffling with mixed symptoms, like a clogged catalytic convertor, which will make it run bad, run hot, and smoke.
Or a bad fuel pressure regulator, which can cause overfueling and hard starting, and make the idle very rough and create a lot of exhaust smoke at idle and on run-up (but the black sooty kind)
n8zdogg
05-08-2007, 05:06 PM
Blue smoke is oil, its not a fuel mixture problem. Hate to say this but you probably wasted money on injectors/plugs/wires/etc. If you want to keep on - jeffco's advice is solid, you need to get a compression test first. If that checks out, then start looking for other oddball problems like converter, fuel pressure, and PCV. If you have really bad compression in one )or more) cylinders, you are probably looking at another engine. F22s like the one in your car can be had at a salvage yard for a few hundred bucks.
89civic_sedan
05-08-2007, 11:28 PM
I wantr to just go ahead and get another motor 4 my car and i want to get to get a DOHC for it....what are some motors that will just slide in and hook up and go? could i put in a v-tec without having to do anything special?
89civic_sedan
05-10-2007, 11:21 PM
Will a v-tec just plug and play if i got a non v-tec engine in now? What year motor will fit into my car from a newer car? And will a V6 from a 01 or 02 accord fit into my 93 accord?
jeffcoslacker
05-11-2007, 05:44 AM
I'm not up on Honda engine swaps. I can tell you a couple of universal things about swaps, though.
First is, it will always take three times more time, money and aggravation than you originally thought. Plan ahead for this.
Second, with any swap where a different motor is going to be used, make sure you get not only the motor, but if possible the tranny hooked to it, the wiring harnesses, ECM, TCU, motor mounts, engine cradle (if feasable) and other peripherals, like hoses, exhaust, throttle cables, etc...nothing is going to match up, most likely, and the more parts you got laying around to work with, the better chance you'll find something that will work.
Walk away from it when it seems like it's never going to work...the solution will come to you once you stop obsessing about it.
If possible, befriend a welder...they are an engine swapper's best friend...
If you have emissions inspections where you live, check the ramifications of a swap before you end up with a really fast car that can't be legally operated on the road where you live (or sold)...I've seen some nice transplants that were being sold at fire sale prices because they couldn't be licensed in this state....
First is, it will always take three times more time, money and aggravation than you originally thought. Plan ahead for this.
Second, with any swap where a different motor is going to be used, make sure you get not only the motor, but if possible the tranny hooked to it, the wiring harnesses, ECM, TCU, motor mounts, engine cradle (if feasable) and other peripherals, like hoses, exhaust, throttle cables, etc...nothing is going to match up, most likely, and the more parts you got laying around to work with, the better chance you'll find something that will work.
Walk away from it when it seems like it's never going to work...the solution will come to you once you stop obsessing about it.
If possible, befriend a welder...they are an engine swapper's best friend...
If you have emissions inspections where you live, check the ramifications of a swap before you end up with a really fast car that can't be legally operated on the road where you live (or sold)...I've seen some nice transplants that were being sold at fire sale prices because they couldn't be licensed in this state....
n8zdogg
05-14-2007, 05:47 PM
While I'm not the best authority on this, I think an h22a will drop right in, you'll need the complete motor and trans, plus the exhaust. If I'm not mistaken you only have to switch 2 pins on the ECM to get everything to work (VTEC) -- do a search here for swaps, you shoud find tons of info
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