Best track day car. . .
jester4
10-07-2002, 10:23 AM
I'm considering buying a track day car but I'm looking for something which is both quick and cheap. I'm not interested in turbo's and 4wd crap, something which is light-weight, torquey and handles well. Best times are not my main aim but a car that is lots of fun at the limit.
Any suggestions . . . . . ?
Any suggestions . . . . . ?
YellowMaranello
10-07-2002, 03:44 PM
Where do you live? How much do you want to spend? I would say that the perfect car would be a TVR Tuscan S. That car is pure sex on wheels. 390 bhp, 310 ft.lbs, weighing in at 1100 kg, 0-60 in 3.9 seconds, and the most unique and beautiful styling I have ever seen on a car. I love this car, but they don't sell them in the USA, so I'm out of luck. More info on the car at http://www.tvr-eng.co.uk/graphics/tuscan_s/new/tus_spec.html
http://www.tvr-eng.co.uk/graphics/tuscan_s/new/8.jpg
http://www.tvr-eng.co.uk/graphics/tuscan_s/new/8.jpg
YogsVR4
10-07-2002, 06:33 PM
You dont want AWD and Turbo "crap?" Then you are selling cheap and fast out the door.
NISSANSPDR
10-07-2002, 10:52 PM
Lotus Elise 190...you can pick one up and use them in the states...I've seen some for sale on eBaymotors.com...here's one of the Elise's...they start at around $45k US
http://www.gino-graphics.com/pics/lotus.jpg
http://www.gino-graphics.com/pics/lotus.jpg
jester4
10-08-2002, 06:37 AM
Didn't mean to cause offence with your VR4 being both 4WD and turbo'ed. It's probably a very nice car but not for me. I'm from the UK and tracks over here are usually small, twisty and have short straights which is why a turbo'ed car isn't suitable as I need something thats quick out of the corners with instant punch rather than waiting for the turbo to spool up.
The TVR is a bit out of my price range but I saw a Chimera TVR at a recent track day and it was trounced on by much smaller cheaper cars with bigger power-to-weight ratios.
Correct me if I'm wrong but do US Elise's come with a 1800cc Type-R engine. Over here you get an 1800 K-Seires Rover engine and pay around £15-20k ($18-25k).
The TVR is a bit out of my price range but I saw a Chimera TVR at a recent track day and it was trounced on by much smaller cheaper cars with bigger power-to-weight ratios.
Correct me if I'm wrong but do US Elise's come with a 1800cc Type-R engine. Over here you get an 1800 K-Seires Rover engine and pay around £15-20k ($18-25k).
YellowMaranello
10-08-2002, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by jester4
Correct me if I'm wrong but do US Elise's come with a 1800cc Type-R engine. Over here you get an 1800 K-Seires Rover engine and pay around £15-20k ($18-25k).
Yeah, welcome to the sucky world of the American car market. What about any of the BMW M-series? Or possibly a Porsche? Then there's always the wonderful market of British kit cars that you could venture into.
Correct me if I'm wrong but do US Elise's come with a 1800cc Type-R engine. Over here you get an 1800 K-Seires Rover engine and pay around £15-20k ($18-25k).
Yeah, welcome to the sucky world of the American car market. What about any of the BMW M-series? Or possibly a Porsche? Then there's always the wonderful market of British kit cars that you could venture into.
SilverLotus340R
10-08-2002, 05:58 PM
it depends on how much you want to spend?
i would suggest a Lotus 340R if you could find one..they are fast...really light..mostly carbon fibre..so they are awesome track cars
or
there is always the Caterham 7/ Lotus super 7 they come with many different engines..they weigh much less than most other cars...
things to think about !!!
i would suggest a Lotus 340R if you could find one..they are fast...really light..mostly carbon fibre..so they are awesome track cars
or
there is always the Caterham 7/ Lotus super 7 they come with many different engines..they weigh much less than most other cars...
things to think about !!!
NISSANSPDR
10-08-2002, 08:58 PM
I dont think they all come w/ITR motors...that's just one that does...we can get the Lotus engines...why not?
:devil:
:devil:
CAptynCrunch
10-08-2002, 09:04 PM
smog if I'm not mistaken.
jester4
10-09-2002, 04:27 AM
Emission laws I think. It's the same deal with TVR's too (I think).
As for the Elise, it's not a Lotus made engine but a Rover engine. Still that car could be powered by a Kenwood mixer and still be fast.
Anybody heard of Caterham? They make excellent track day cars, some of them bike-engined!
I've set a budget of about £12-15k.
Does anybody know much about the new Integra Type-R/RSX?
www.litimports.co.uk
Check out this web-site, they have imported Type-R's for the track at a very tempting price but I don't know much about this car.
As for the Elise, it's not a Lotus made engine but a Rover engine. Still that car could be powered by a Kenwood mixer and still be fast.
Anybody heard of Caterham? They make excellent track day cars, some of them bike-engined!
I've set a budget of about £12-15k.
Does anybody know much about the new Integra Type-R/RSX?
www.litimports.co.uk
Check out this web-site, they have imported Type-R's for the track at a very tempting price but I don't know much about this car.
Moppie
10-09-2002, 05:29 AM
Originally posted by jester4
Check out this web-site, they have imported Type-R's for the track at a very tempting price but I don't know much about this car.
The new Integra is a bit soft for a weekend race car. Its aimed more at the poser raceer than the actualy race car user.
The old Type R integra, Civic, or an older 4g SiR Civic like mine however is a perfect track car. They are designed with the weekend racer in mind, and are quite quick left stock. They are also still avliable for cheap prices as imports from Japan, and the 4g SiR has the advantage of being sold new in the UK as the VTi. (but they are rare!)
The best thing is number of aftermarket suspension kits, and engine upgrade avliable to suit any budget or desired compitition level.
Otherwise something like a Lotus 7 style kit car is ideal, or have you thought about getting an old MK1 or MK2 Escort and doing some work to it? Or an old MG midget/Austin Sprite would be great fun.
Of course the best place for you to start would be to join a local car club that is activly involved in week end racing. With in the club there are bound to be people with cars for sale, or who know someone with a car for sale. They will also be best able to advise you on the best car to get for the level of racing you wish to enter.
There is nothing worse than spending money on a car, only to discover that its only eligable to race in an odd class that only races once or twice a year.
Check out this web-site, they have imported Type-R's for the track at a very tempting price but I don't know much about this car.
The new Integra is a bit soft for a weekend race car. Its aimed more at the poser raceer than the actualy race car user.
The old Type R integra, Civic, or an older 4g SiR Civic like mine however is a perfect track car. They are designed with the weekend racer in mind, and are quite quick left stock. They are also still avliable for cheap prices as imports from Japan, and the 4g SiR has the advantage of being sold new in the UK as the VTi. (but they are rare!)
The best thing is number of aftermarket suspension kits, and engine upgrade avliable to suit any budget or desired compitition level.
Otherwise something like a Lotus 7 style kit car is ideal, or have you thought about getting an old MK1 or MK2 Escort and doing some work to it? Or an old MG midget/Austin Sprite would be great fun.
Of course the best place for you to start would be to join a local car club that is activly involved in week end racing. With in the club there are bound to be people with cars for sale, or who know someone with a car for sale. They will also be best able to advise you on the best car to get for the level of racing you wish to enter.
There is nothing worse than spending money on a car, only to discover that its only eligable to race in an odd class that only races once or twice a year.
jester4
10-09-2002, 06:37 AM
I used to own a VTi Civic but although it was a quick car with good handling, you have to keep it in the rev range all the time. I'm sure it's the same with the Type-R but it is at a good price.
I also think I would't have the heart to thrash an old MK1 or 2 Escort about a track as those are lovely cars and still pricey considering the age of them.
Right now I think my options are:
Lotus Elise (a cheap one)
Caterham (with a 2.0l Vauxhall/Opel engine 150-170bhp)
Caterham (with a Bkie engine of some sort)
New Integra Type-R (track prepared)
VW Golf MK2 track ready (with a VR6 engine - sounds lovely)
BMW M3 (stripped out and ready to race)
Remember, the car I buy is going to be for the track only and doesn't need to be driven there and back. I'm open to nay other suggestions...
I also think I would't have the heart to thrash an old MK1 or 2 Escort about a track as those are lovely cars and still pricey considering the age of them.
Right now I think my options are:
Lotus Elise (a cheap one)
Caterham (with a 2.0l Vauxhall/Opel engine 150-170bhp)
Caterham (with a Bkie engine of some sort)
New Integra Type-R (track prepared)
VW Golf MK2 track ready (with a VR6 engine - sounds lovely)
BMW M3 (stripped out and ready to race)
Remember, the car I buy is going to be for the track only and doesn't need to be driven there and back. I'm open to nay other suggestions...
S Brake
10-09-2002, 06:16 PM
How about a BMW M-coupe
Moppie
10-09-2002, 10:27 PM
Originally posted by jester4
I used to own a VTi Civic but although it was a quick car with good handling, you have to keep it in the rev range all the time. I'm sure it's the same with the Type-R....
If your racing on a track and you let the revs drop below 5,000rpm then your not really racing. The engines will happily goto 9,000+rpm so running it around 6-8 will do it no harm what so ever. Its where they are designed to be driven.
However looking at the list of cars your thinking about one of the B series powered Honda's might be a bit low down in price for you.
Unless you want to get a Type R and spend some money making it faster.
Of the cars you listed I would recomend the Elise first, but only if theres a Lotus Certfied service center in your area.
I work for a local Lotus garage here in NZ (www.lotuscars.co.nz) and there are several Elise's that get regualr track time. All of them stand up to it exceptionaly well, but there are nemeruos service bullitens released by Lotus concerning the rear suspension. There is an eye at the back that is prone to breaking, and several bolts that like to come undone. If your going to race the car its important to make sure these problems have been fixed.
Also join your nearest lotus club. After all the only compition you will get is from other Elise's.
I would stay away from the VW Golf MK2, anything with an engine swap of that magnitude is going to give your trouble. (unless you want to spend as much time off the track as on it).
The Caterhams would be my next choice over the Elise, nice cheap easy to work on, and VERY fast.
The bike engined one could however be a bit dodgy. If not done right the g/box conversion can give a lot of trouble. (but it will have an awsome power to weight ratio)
The new Integra would be fun, and also cheap to race, but the engine is all very new technology, and will be expensive to service or repair. Also for less money you could have an old model that would be faster.
The M3 I would put last on the list.
An awsome car, especialy if its an old M30, but it will be VERY expensive to repiar. And parts are getting harder to find.
And it sounds like all these cars are someone elses old race car.
Find out as much about the history of each car as you can, especialy who did any engine work etc on them. And then verify it with that person.
I know far to many people who have bought someone elses race car, and had something major break on thier first day out. Usualy its the engine.
And of course don't forget to check what events each car is elgiable to enter, and how often they are held.
I used to own a VTi Civic but although it was a quick car with good handling, you have to keep it in the rev range all the time. I'm sure it's the same with the Type-R....
If your racing on a track and you let the revs drop below 5,000rpm then your not really racing. The engines will happily goto 9,000+rpm so running it around 6-8 will do it no harm what so ever. Its where they are designed to be driven.
However looking at the list of cars your thinking about one of the B series powered Honda's might be a bit low down in price for you.
Unless you want to get a Type R and spend some money making it faster.
Of the cars you listed I would recomend the Elise first, but only if theres a Lotus Certfied service center in your area.
I work for a local Lotus garage here in NZ (www.lotuscars.co.nz) and there are several Elise's that get regualr track time. All of them stand up to it exceptionaly well, but there are nemeruos service bullitens released by Lotus concerning the rear suspension. There is an eye at the back that is prone to breaking, and several bolts that like to come undone. If your going to race the car its important to make sure these problems have been fixed.
Also join your nearest lotus club. After all the only compition you will get is from other Elise's.
I would stay away from the VW Golf MK2, anything with an engine swap of that magnitude is going to give your trouble. (unless you want to spend as much time off the track as on it).
The Caterhams would be my next choice over the Elise, nice cheap easy to work on, and VERY fast.
The bike engined one could however be a bit dodgy. If not done right the g/box conversion can give a lot of trouble. (but it will have an awsome power to weight ratio)
The new Integra would be fun, and also cheap to race, but the engine is all very new technology, and will be expensive to service or repair. Also for less money you could have an old model that would be faster.
The M3 I would put last on the list.
An awsome car, especialy if its an old M30, but it will be VERY expensive to repiar. And parts are getting harder to find.
And it sounds like all these cars are someone elses old race car.
Find out as much about the history of each car as you can, especialy who did any engine work etc on them. And then verify it with that person.
I know far to many people who have bought someone elses race car, and had something major break on thier first day out. Usualy its the engine.
And of course don't forget to check what events each car is elgiable to enter, and how often they are held.
Menu dei Motori
10-10-2002, 04:21 AM
http://www.wiesmann-auto-sport.de
maybe thats the right for you...
if you like it...
the site is in german but i can help you if you want more details...
and take a lokk here
http://www.supercarsite.net/roadster_mf_3.htm
greets
Menu dei Motori
maybe thats the right for you...
if you like it...
the site is in german but i can help you if you want more details...
and take a lokk here
http://www.supercarsite.net/roadster_mf_3.htm
greets
Menu dei Motori
Moppie
10-10-2002, 04:31 AM
Originally posted by Menu dei Motori
http://www.wiesmann-auto-sport.de
www.altavista.com has a translation function that will translate that into almost any language for you. :cool:
http://www.wiesmann-auto-sport.de
www.altavista.com has a translation function that will translate that into almost any language for you. :cool:
Menu dei Motori
10-10-2002, 04:40 AM
ok thanks!
so enjoy jester4
so enjoy jester4
crayzayjay
10-14-2002, 03:48 PM
I'm not interested in turbo's and 4wd crap, something which is light-weight, torquey and handles well. Best times are not my main aim but a car that is lots of fun at the limit.
Bearing in mind the "not wanting to spend too much dinero", you can only think about two cars: Lotus Elise (mk1, looks better, drives better) and Caterham 7's, which hold their value tremendously well so you wont lose much when (if) you resell... good luck
Bearing in mind the "not wanting to spend too much dinero", you can only think about two cars: Lotus Elise (mk1, looks better, drives better) and Caterham 7's, which hold their value tremendously well so you wont lose much when (if) you resell... good luck
Moppie
10-14-2002, 10:31 PM
Originally posted by crayzayjay
...: Lotus Elise (mk1, looks better, drives better).......
sorry this is a little OT but I have to disagree here. There is a MK2 (or series 2) in the show room at work, and well its looks are growing on me more and more each day, especialy as its sitting next to a MK1 (or series 1).
And the differnce in handling is more of a personal preferance, the series 1 certianly has a repuation for swapping ends with out warning, and Iv seen them catch plenty of people out. The series 2 is ment to be a bit more refined in this area.
However for a race car I would certianly say start with a Series 1, simply because they already have a history, and there are plenty of extra go fast bits, and suspension kits already avliable that are proven to work.
...: Lotus Elise (mk1, looks better, drives better).......
sorry this is a little OT but I have to disagree here. There is a MK2 (or series 2) in the show room at work, and well its looks are growing on me more and more each day, especialy as its sitting next to a MK1 (or series 1).
And the differnce in handling is more of a personal preferance, the series 1 certianly has a repuation for swapping ends with out warning, and Iv seen them catch plenty of people out. The series 2 is ment to be a bit more refined in this area.
However for a race car I would certianly say start with a Series 1, simply because they already have a history, and there are plenty of extra go fast bits, and suspension kits already avliable that are proven to work.
crayzayjay
10-15-2002, 02:31 PM
to each his own :)
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