The Import Scene

I have been very impressed by the advancements in the sport compact car world, where the bar is being pushed forever higher in tiny four-cylindered cars, as they are continuously lightened and pushed for more power. There are now Hondas on the verge of pushing into the eight-second range in the quarter mile.

Some of those most notable are Stephen Papadakis and Ed Bergenholtz, who are chasing the fastest four-cylindered car in the world, Sakura. This car is capable of quarter mile times in the range of 7.6 to 7.7 seconds.

These cars have their work cut out for them to catch up with the best of the Top Fuel circuit drag racing, but with time, and technology, we may see four cylinders running with the fastest V8's.

Actually I believe Stephan Papadakis is already in the 8's. :)

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Anthony
88 RX-7 GXL 85 RX-7 GS

Edited by: DropGXL

I'm gettin so sick of people talking about the "Import Scene" who gives a flying fuck.
Maybe some of the little rice burners are in the 8's, but how many of them are street legal? There are THOUSANDS of Camaros and Mustangs runnin around the country with low 8 second E.T's I myself am gettin there (9.89 @ 142) And it takes twice the money to get a fuggin rice burner into the 8's as it does a domestic. In conclusion...F.U.C.K Rice!

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oh, dude.... you just started a potentially huge flame... watch em come now. :D

He may get flamed, but Dark Horse is right. There are...and have been for a long time...V8's out there that run sub-2-second 0-60s on the street. Civics are not sports cars and there are a lot of people out there that think they are. They are Econoboxes, not powerhouses.

It just seems silly to me. It's like trying to turn Pearl Jam into Bach. I guess I just don't understand it.

And, I think the Leblanc Caroline is the fastest 4banger to date.

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"Ferrari isn't a car, it's a lifestyle"
-Enzo Ferrari.

Run what you have, thats what its all about, Although i own only v8's i hang around alot of import drivers, and i prefer the import "scene" to hanging around with narrow minded people because the imports are still evolving, there are still things to do, the hot rod of yesterday, while still on top in my book, are just that, hot rods of yesterday, and are no longer in front of the car community, because nothing new is happening to them, not many new things can be done that werent done 25 years ago. While the imports are still in there infancy, and there is just somthing about doing what your not supposed to. Most people think its a waste of time, but doing somthing new is much more rewarding that building another 350 and putting it in a nova.

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67 GTO & 79 Z28

Z28 RACER
i couldnt agree with you more! i cant stand morons that categorize every import car as "rice". the only time the term ever applies is to a civic with 50 stickers and 18 wheels and 5" tip that claims to have run 12s. but, then again most die-hard chevy or ford guys are so ignorant about the power potential of "ricers" that its fun taking their money. walk up to any guy with a big v8 and ask to run em in your puny lil 4 cylinder and its like taking candy from a baby. granted, this doesnt apply to every camaro/firebird/mustang out there cuz they can be made damn fast cars (like anything else) but ive educated my fair share. just my 2 cents,
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

One of the reasons i try to learn about them is that we have to know our enemys :), gotta know what to look for when someone like that comes up to me so i dont get my ass handed to me.

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67 GTO & 79 Z28

hehe. :D
I'm just curious,
has anybody ever raced Skyline GT-R?
Try to find Joseph if you do, he owns one and he lives in the NYC. If you do tell him that "Igor said hi".

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I've seen the future, and all I can say is go back....

Well, I more or less don't have to worry about gettin beat by a little ricer, How many 9 Second 4-Bangers are driven on the street?.....none around my hunting ground :D In my book any jap. 4 banger is rice don't like the way i think? Well...I don't give a shit....Blow Me
-The Anti rice

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For my Message Board Click Here (http://pub42.ezboard.com/bthemustangmessageboards)

nice mature comeback. how many 9 second cars are driven on the street period? and i do mean legally. slicks, open exhaust, wheelie bars and parachutes dont count. oh, and ever here of a supra? theres quite a few daily drivers out there that will piss all over your cheerios. what kind of car do you have again? my vr4 will easily be in the 11s with a full leather interior, a/c, incredible stereo, power everthing, and look damn good all at the same time. want to run on the highway? didnt think so. want to autocross? didnt think so. want to ask 100 women (or in your case men) which theyd rather go out in? didnt think so. yeah, you got a real nice car though. is it even a stick--cuz driving the 1/4 straight is pretty challanging--wouldnt want to have to shift too. i would stick with your domestic pos anyway, cuz if you ever bought an import youd have all that time you used to spend working on your car everyday to actually do something. woudnt want that.
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

I'm talking about my 98 Mustang GT...Full interior, 3 MTX 12" woofers in the back..power everything. The car weighs 3600+
And has a best E.T of 9.896 @ 142.1, And it has a Tremec 6 spd manual, and it doesn't have wheelie bars or a chute. It'll be in the low 9's this spring...when I get my new Blower. And the only probalem I've had out of it was a blown gasket when i ran too much boost without enough intercooler. And how much does your ar weigh?....thats the reason you can get into the 11's easily.

Edited by: Dark Horse

Oh yeah, I don't do that gay shit either...And if it's luxury the lady wants I'll pick her up in my Navigator. Not fast, but plenty of room in the back...

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DARKHORSE,
very nice time (especially trap speed) and sounds like a nice car. im by no means a mustang fan but im more than willing to give credit where credit is due. and a question, youre saying you made that pass with a 3 sub soundsystem? between the subs/box/amps and misc wiring it sure isnt doing your 1/4 times any benefit. my car isnt a 1/4 mile car so i have mine for cruise/show purposes. i (unlike you) am open-minded enough to appreciate any type of car done right regardless of brand or where it was made. now, that being said, a high 9 second car on the track isnt the same as on the street. when i said 11s i meant 11s rolling out of the driveway without spray. you obviously had slicks, more than likely a big shot of NOS, rollcage, very high gearing, and race gas for that pass. ill race you any day of the week with no NOS (or ill run with it too), full exhaust, street tires, and pump gas. track times are nice to wave around but rarely reflect what a car will run on the street. i have no problem saying youd kick my ass at the track cuz my car isnt a 1/4 mile car. but at the same time i have no problem saying youd never catch me on a highway run and never ever catch me on a roadcourse. two out of three aint bad. and the particular "ricer" in question is just a lil 3.0 6 cylinder (bored to 3.1) that tips the scales at just over 3700lbs. of course the two upgraded turbos, upgraded intercoolers/pipes, boost controller, custom ecu, full 3" ss exhaust, upgraded fuel system with twin pumps and lines, alcohol injection, nos, je pistons, crower rods, weber cams, slotted rotors/race pads/ss lines, 18" wheels/tires, and a nice shot of NOS doesnt hurt either. nor does around 23lbs of boost.
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

oh, and you wouldnt need a navigator to pick up chicks if you bought a vr4. with a $49k base price in 98 its more $$ than a vette and more exclusive as well. with a mustang you might cruise the trailer parks or being its a gt maybe some highschool chicks if they can figure out which one is yours in the school parking lot. had to say it.....
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

lol, that was good mr2turb!!

but i like the challenge of having a regular everyday grocery getter and making it faster, handle better and look better

anybody can go pick up a GT and soup it up as it is a sports car made for performance right out of the factory.
and mr2turbo was right there are tons of them everywhere driven my high school girls mainly in my town and GTs are rare they all drive v6's that are 3.8L gas guzzlers that i can take out stock in my accord v6 stock
and the mustangs are super cheap in constructon and materials, even the air scoops are fake even in the GT's which is just pathetic, and there to attract the young high school girl buyers to a "cute"
car.


and tell me what kind of gas mileage do you get in that 9 second beast of yours

civics being a 4 cyl and with all those mods still get better gas mileage

if u dont like the import scene just turn around and forget about it.
u dont have to bitch about it like a lil girl to us so that we'll change our minds about it

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00 Honda Accord coupe EX V6 SS
aem cai, WW 3-piece midwing, clears

yep, id have to say that the #1 reason im an import guy--exclusivity. on any given drive to/from work i cant even count the number of mustangs/camaros/firebirds i see with prob about a 60/40 split on v8 vs v6 versions and most driven by "highschool aged kids". to me its not a sports car if you see 50 just like it on a daily basis. i respect the LT1/LS1 cars and newer gt/cobras as race cars just because they can be made fast but not as true sports cars because there are just too many. how often do you see a vr4 or mr2 (turbo or non) or a supra turbo or a 3rd gen rx7 or 300zx turbo or an nsx? almost never. thats why they attract so much attention. i dont know how many people have come up to me and asked if my mr2 was some kind of ferrari or lotus--cuz you dont see em everyday!!(see for yourself under the "mr2" category of the toyota group in this forum). speed is a whole other issue. just like every other car on the planet, all of the above cars can be made to run incredibly fast but thats not the point. its all about the persona they have. and not to mention its the only way to get that without shelling out over $70k on a viper or ferrari or lambo or true exotic car. and when comparing any of the above mentioned "ricers" to the mustang/camaro/firebird trio stock vs stock its embarrassing. not even in the same ballpark. motor trend got the 97 mustang gt to run the 1/4 in 15.1 @ 92.8 mph!! now thats impressive!! just goes to show you can make anything fast if you spend enough money. hell, guys already have the new celicas running low 14s with n/a "4 bangers". and my laser with its mighty 2.0 ran a best of 12.8 @ 107.2 this year. more than enough to beat 99% of domestic "sports car" owners out there. oh, and while were on the topic, does someone that hates all "4-banger ricers" consider a plymouth laser a ricer? and if so is the prowler too? just curious.
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

I normally dont comment a whole lot on ricer topics considering my own personal ideas about that whole deal...But mr2turb, that whole thing about exclusitivity on your last post, I personally gagged. I totally understood what you meant about the 3000GT, NSX deal...Our 3s's are exclusive, but when he means ricers, he means the civics and accords and integras, not the already nice cars. I see at least 10-20 of those kind of 'ricers' everyday, with at least the clear light kits, wings, exhaust, etc. Ive only seen 1 Camaro SS, 2 Firebird WS6 or whatever theyre number is (I always forget), and 1 Mustang Cobra. Now, I do see some more regular american type muscle cars, but rarely do I see one of the base models of them 'riced' out. Well, I better stop or Ill keep going, lol

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Mike
1991 Black Dodge Stealth R/T TT

well, he did say "any" jap 4-banger--and if his views apply to 4 cylinder cars whats the difference with sixes? i agree (as i said earlier) about the term "ricer" applying to civics or integras with 50 stickers and a huge tip and 18" wheels and the owner thinking its the fastest thing on the road. did i mention such cars as being exclusive? civics are like the #1 selling car in the country for crying out loud!! not to mention the large number or accords, camrys, corollas, yada yada. i said import guy in the performance sense not the "every car the comapanies make sense". im sure there arent too many die hard mustang guys running around trying to support the taurus, tempo, and windstar!! my comparison was strictly the cars i mentioned (3000gt, supra, 300zx, rx7, mr2, and nsx) vs the mustang/firebird/camaro trio. i dont see how there is an arguement there. sales numbers dont lie boys. even import guys use the term "rice" to describe certain cars but not EVERY jap 4/6 cylinder!! hes basing his opinion on country of origin not each car on an individual basis. and as for the ws6 (ram-air) and ss camaro--youre looking for the top model in each cars lineup. ill be the first to say i love the ws6's front end and the LS1 in both cars, but around here i see just as many ss cars as i do z28s. and for the power diff vs price diff thats what id buy if i was a chevy fan. ok, hope i cleared that up. dont want this to continue on about which you see more often the maxima or the lumina. WHO CARES!!!!!!!
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

oh, and what term then applies to the hundreds of 6 cylinder stangs running around with saleen stickers and wings and ground effects on them? or did saleen start building "performance versions" all of the sudden. PLEASE!!!! its 100% about the owner not the car or where it was built.
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

for more info visit riceboy.com

and learn what the real meaning of "rice" is

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00 Honda Accord coupe EX V6 SS
aem cai, WW 3-piece midwing, clears

Yes, I do run slicks at the track, but I don't use spray...I have a Blower pushing 14lbs of boost,and a 12 point roll cage,as for gas mileage...around 15-18 MPG. And i have run the car on just motor (4.6L 281 cid DOHC) and it hit a 10.60 @ ? (can't remember the trap)

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I get disgusted when I see "fake saleens" as when I see a riced out Civic with fony "Type R" Badges

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For my Message Board Click Here (http://pub42.ezboard.com/bthemustangmessageboards)

finally we agree on something
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

DARKHORSE,
where you from anyway? if not too far id like to run you sometime--100% street trim of course.
jeff

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95 vr4 93 mr2 turbo 91 laser turbo

If you want to race, bring it to Brandenton, Fl at the DeSoto Memorial Dragstrip.
I'll give you a set of slicks or we can run em in stock trim...don't matter to me.

Sometime this Spring.

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ive got a few questions. i just picked up a 92 prelude Si with the 2.3 litre non vtec. ibasiclly got to build into a 1/4 mile car/street car. my questions are will the 2.2vtec head off a a late 90's prelude fit and run on the 2.3? ive heard they do. is there anyone on this forum that has done this please let me know how it does. question 2 What is a good turbo kit that will work on these motor? im lookin to run about 18 to 20 psi+nitrous!! and my final question is will the type SH transmissions off the late 90's preludes bolt up to the 2.3 litre engines? if any of you guys have any info it would be much appreciated

if ur gonna build it into a racer i would go with a whole new engine like the h22a since there is unlimited aftermarket support for it

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00 Honda Accord coupe EX V6 SS
aem cai, WW 3-piece midwing, clears

I would go with VTEC V6's suggestion, which is to try and get yourself an H22A. Doesn't even need to be new, a used one should be fine (like a wreck salvo or something). And with this engine, I would go with an F Max turbo (I know more about superchargers than turbos, but I have heard that Rev Hard turbos are the choice turbos for all B series engines, and F Max for F and H series engines).

Edited by: JD@af

thanks for the info.
the big thing here in kc area from what ive seen has been to build those 1.8 and 1.5 litre motors. my buddy has a 1.5 litre honda civic hatchback, nothing fancy body wise, it will just run a high a high 12 in the quarter. will the h22a v6 fit in the early 90's lude's. and ive been checkin around for a price on a used one, i cant seem to get a straight answer. if any body knows of a good website were i can find prices on these motors can they post it? thanks

You can swap an H22A into your 1992 Prelude with the aid of a kit, which you can get from HASport, Place Racing, or HCP.

I've read in Turbo that Stephen Papadakis's Civic is now posting about 8.70 in the quarter. I wonder if he'll be able to catch Sakura (the fastest 4-cylindered car in the world, posting around a 7.65 best ET).

A car being frequently seen doesn't make it not a sportscar. Even if every car on the road was identical, they could still be sportscars if they fit the definition.

Which BTW, none of the cars mentioned fit. Mustangs, Camaros, NSX, MR2, etc None of those are true sportscars by definition.

And about gas milage. I really doubt if these 8 second 4 bangers get better milage than a V8. As soon as you have high revs and boost your gas milage is going out the window. Look at an S2000 compared to an LS1.

All right, I don't really care what definition you are using. A definition that does not acknowledge an NSX as a sports car is bullshit. I suppose there are a couple Ferraris that don't qualify as sports cars by this definition either?

And as for the gas mileage, true, running all out on a highway, you may very well be right that a blown four cylinder may be sucking down as much or even more than a V8. But I challenge any V8 to turn in the kind of gas mileage figures in around town driving that a blown four car turn in. This to me is the beauty of this kind of engine. It is still functional and fairly spritely with gas around town, stop light to stop light. It has little torque down low, true, but it can be a convenience for gas mileage sake in that it can still cruise using little juice and power better than just about ANY V8.

Hey guys!!!!!

Is a 260Z Hybrid with a rb26DETT in it a ricer? I dont think so but it is an import....the motor is stock except engine management and intercooler. running stock booste, DOT drag radials, and 3.90 rear end gears. went thru the traps at 120 mph @ 7500 rpm in 3rd gear !!!! 11.1 E/T

lets see,,, throw some cash at it and bam its in the low 9s with full exhaust, interior.

Like someone said before as long as its done right its fine by me but the little HS kids that put mufflers on there cars too make them fast and tear up the streets giving everybody a bad name really should just go home and play with the PS1 ;>

i hate people that think a 4 banger can't race... and that all imports are "rice"... IMO these people can go to hell

btw, an h22a is a DOHC 4 cyl, i know, cuz i'm gonna be putting one in my car, an accord(not a new one, a 3rd gen, the one with the flip up lights)... it will be a full car... it now weighs 4,000 pounds, it will weigh about 4,500... with all the mods, i predict that i can run 10's in street trim... all of this done tastefully

when i get my car built, i'll take on any american car in street trim, anyday

peace,
ugly

to whoever said an import cant run 9s street legal, u must only be referring to fwd cuz theres quite a good number of street legal imports running 9s and 8s and a few in the 7s. btw has anyone seen norwood racings acura integra funny car? i know its not street legal but it is a 4 cylinder delivering almost 4,000 hp, expected to run mid 5's at 250 mph. tell me a 4 cylinder cant be made fast now.

Originally posted by ugly racer
i hate people that think a 4 banger can't race... and that all imports are "rice"... IMO these people can go to hell

btw, an h22a is a DOHC 4 cyl, i know, cuz i'm gonna be putting one in my car, an accord(not a new one, a 3rd gen, the one with the flip up lights)... it will be a full car... it now weighs 4,000 pounds, it will weigh about 4,500... with all the mods, i predict that i can run 10's in street trim... all of this done tastefully

when i get my car built, i'll take on any american car in street trim, anyday

peace,
ugly

whatever dude:p

different strokes for different folks

Originally posted by ugly racer
btw, an h22a is a DOHC 4 cyl, i know, cuz i'm gonna be putting one in my car, an accord(not a new one, a 3rd gen, the one with the flip up lights)... it will be a full car... it now weighs 4,000 pounds, it will weigh about 4,500... with all the mods, i predict that i can run 10's in street trim... all of this done tastefully


Your 3rd generation stock accord weights 4,000 pounds??? That seems like a bit much.

it's a sedan

peace
ugly

it still seems kind of heavy man. my 98 accord lx sedan weighs just a tad under 3000.

arent they supposed to weigh like 2600? i think thats what my friends 88 accord sedan weighs.

that's what i was told by my uncle, who is a mechanic, but he hasn't weighed the car...


peace
ugly

the hatchback's to the 4 door sedans all weight 2400lbs give or take a little

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
to whoever said an import cant run 9s street legal, u must only be referring to fwd cuz theres quite a good number of street legal imports running 9s and 8s and a few in the 7s. btw has anyone seen norwood racings acura integra funny car? i know its not street legal but it is a 4 cylinder delivering almost 4,000 hp, expected to run mid 5's at 250 mph. tell me a 4 cylinder cant be made fast now.

You must be talking about Bernie Harrington's 527cid blown Chevy big block,GM TH400, ford 9 inch rear end and the chrommolly tube frame with a glass Integra body on it. Is that the one?

Originally posted by bluez28guy


You must be talking about Bernie Harrington's 527cid blown Chevy big block,GM TH400, ford 9 inch rear end and the chrommolly tube frame with a glass Integra body on it. Is that the one?

haha(if this is true)

no its a new car, 268 cu in (4.8 liter) 4 cylinder running 55 pounds of boost and nitromethane. the 1st true import funny car, but definately not the last. in feb 2002 issue of turbo magazine. link to it here http://www.turbomagazine.com/archives/tech/0202_tech01.jsp
i have seen the car youre talking about though.

cool man

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
no its a new car, 268 cu in (4.8 liter) 4 cylinder running 55 pounds of boost and nitromethane. the 1st true import funny car, but definately not the last. in feb 2002 issue of turbo magazine. link to it here http://www.turbomagazine.com/archives/tech/0202_tech01.jsp
i have seen the car youre talking about though.

You cought me with my pants down! I have to say I was inpressed.

Originally posted by enzo@af
He may get flamed, but Dark Horse is right. There are...and have been for a long time...V8's out there that run sub-2-second 0-60s on the street. Civics are not sports cars and there are a lot of people out there that think they are. They are Econoboxes, not powerhouses.

It just seems silly to me. It's like trying to turn Pearl Jam into Bach. I guess I just don't understand it.

And, I think the Leblanc Caroline is the fastest 4banger to date.

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"Ferrari isn't a car, it's a lifestyle"
-Enzo Ferrari.


Civics are not sports cars and there are a lot of people out there that think they are. They are Econoboxes, not powerhouses.


that is what make the times that they are getting to even more impressive than what the V8's are getting

Originally posted by Dark Horse
I'm talking about my 98 Mustang GT...Full interior, 3 MTX 12" woofers in the back..power everything. The car weighs 3600+
And has a best E.T of 9.896 @ 142.1, And it has a Tremec 6 spd manual, and it doesn't have wheelie bars or a chute. It'll be in the low 9's this spring...when I get my new Blower. And the only probalem I've had out of it was a blown gasket when i ran too much boost without enough intercooler. And how much does your ar weigh?....thats the reason you can get into the 11's easily.

Edited by: Dark Horse

http://www.haiparts.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=3089

That guy can take you and he is running the stock bottom end. The car is full interior and full street trim. He isn't even the fastest street driven supra around either. There is another guy that runs 9.5's in street trim.....

Well, the Mustang is one of Ford's fastest production cars. And since most big block V8s have a lot more untapped potential than 4 cylinders, theres no real comparison. Its like comparing the Ford Focus to a Nissan Silvia S15.

And another thing, Japanese cars are way better at Autocross than they are at Drag Racing. It's just the way that they are built. Sure your Mustang outclasses almost every Japanese car out on the drag strip good for you. Just be prepared to eat your words whenever you learn to drive something besides a straight line, and take your Mustang out to go Autocrossing.

Darkness:

Just to correct you on a few things.
The Mustang doesn't have a "big block V8" like you said.
It's actually a "small block" technically.

Secondly, I'll take ONE of my cars out on the roadcourse.
I bet it would fair very well against almost any import (aside from the major exotics). As it sits now, it could rival a Porsche on a road course.

I can also bring out ONE of my cars to the drag strip and rip off an easy 11 sec. pass ON MOTOR and drive it home with full interior, regular old PUMP GAS (none of that "race gas" stuff supras like) and have my stereo blastin'....

well blackbird, get one of your cars out and rally race me. :devil: :D any one i dont care!

Shut up. :D

Maybe my car won't go 9's or 10's but that don't meean it's slow.
Last time I went to the track I ran a 1.7 sec 60ft.
Left home with 4 gallons of Texaco unleaded hi-test in the tank ran several high 12's and drove home.
The motor and trans cost me $500-600 to build and I have less than $2000 in the car. (Not a beauty contest winner either)
I race at Cecil County Dragway, Friday night heads up racing with everybody! I don't win every race, I probably win 80% though. What does this say for all the v-8 guys. They need help just like the slower imports. I was even having big fun when I was running 14's!

Listen, the important part is this:

You don't need to be #1 all the time, I'm having just as much fun as anyone at the track!

Go ahead, flame away!
Robert

actually, mustangs have rally go suspension systems, thats what there know for....i wouldnt talk to mujch shit about them on auto X courses..there not bad, especially GT's,,

it's as simple as this:

domestic owners/enthusiasts compare their fastest cars, to our slower imports. the civic was intended to be a car to just get in, drive to the store, pick up the kids and do it without using a lot of gas. now you can't tell me a mustang or camaro was designed for the same thing. so to me, it is an accomplishment to see an import that was intended to be slow, move fast in a race. think about this: civic vs focus or escort that is more along the lines of being fair. so now move up a bit to say.. a prelude (if we're going to stay in honda) or of course the supra's and rx7's who have a better match to the fast domestics because they are meant to be sportier then the other cars made in those companies.

so basically what i'm saing is, stop with the damn rice wars. yea there may be a bunch of 'rice' looking cars on the road, but most imports are cheap and their the mainstream thing you hear about. so all the little kids who got their licence/car after fast and furious make their uneducated attepts to copy the movie. i agree i see a lot of BULLSHIT imports on the road as you say. but i myself keep it clean, and i don't claim to have a fast car. and i've never even been to the strip myself. but i have one thing a lot of people don't have. respect. don't clown an entire nation of cars because people make SOME look gay, or they're SLOW. i respect domestics just as i respect imports. when i see a nice car from either class... i respect it when respect is due. i dont hate all domestics, i don't love all imports.

i'll stop rambling in hopes that some of you understand the point i'm trying to make. there's no need to add fuel to an argument.

Originally posted by Dark Horse
Well, I more or less don't have to worry about gettin beat by a little ricer, How many 9 Second 4-Bangers are driven on the street?.....none around my hunting ground :D In my book any jap. 4 banger is rice don't like the way i think? Well...I don't give a shit....Blow Me
-The Anti rice

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A Mustang GT running 9's? You mind if I See that time slip and a picture of your engine bay?