clutch fluid leak

Well after browsing the manual, I'm a bit confused. They kinda put the AWD and FWD removal steps all in the same picture, so I get a bit confused seeing everything in one photo. I have a leak. I see it under the driver side front tire, so that rules out the possibility of it being the slave cylinder (also called the clutch release cylinder in the manual?). So my only two options would either be the master cylinder or the actual line, right?

Once again, the manual is a bit fuzzy in some places, especially the instructions on bleeding the clutch. It basically says "you should bleed the clutch sometimes." Is the bleeder screw on the slave cylinder near the transmission?

bleeder screw is on the slave cylinder, on top of the transmission. i've never heard of ppl seeing clutch fluid under the tire, but if its in that region, it could only be the master cylinder. the hard line on that side of the car is all metal, and doesn't leak.

to double check to see if its the master, you can check with a flashlight around the clutch master cylinder reservoir. also, look under the dash around the firewall. there is a rod that goes through the firewall (from the clutch pedal) surrounded by a rubber boot. this is the place from which the clutch master will usually leak. you might also see fluid down onto the carpet.

well after looking around where the master is, i notice it's very wet, even on the cap. I filled it up but I know I didn't miss my target. I guess my plan is to empty the system, take out the master and examine it the best I can. That's gotta be my problem.

What puzzles me is how I have no pressure whatsover. So little that in order to get home this morning I couldn't use the clutch at all. That rod you were talking about, is it the rod on the right with the golden wishbone type end on it?
http://completemotorsport.com/generateimage.php?a=OEM_ClutchMasterGeneric1.jpg&u=MB5552771.jpg

Are you talking about that black boot at the beginning of the rod?

After refilling the reservoir, the level really doesn't go down that much. Maybe too much air has already entered the system? I dunno I can't think of a reason for it to act like this. Anyway, I'm gonna bleed it dry within the next couple of days.

I do need to know how to remove the master cylinder. Is it held to the chassis or firewall?

yup, that's the rod and boot i'm talking about.

don't bleed the system dry. if, indeed, air has entered the system, then you don't want anymore air to enter. so as you are bleeding the clutch, make sure that there is always at least some fluid in the clutch fluid reservoir (master cylinder). if at any time all the fluid goes from the master cylinder down the line, then air will enter the system.

so you did see some fluid leaking from the rubber boot under the dash?

Absolutely did. Thanks for the tip off. That's exactly where it's coming from. I'm releived that it's only the master cylinder. I might upgrade the stock rubber hose (the one going to the slave) to the steel braided hoses on 3sx while I'm at it. I'm stuck as of right now since I don't have a master cylinder just laying around, I'll have to order one. I might gut my precats if I have time, since my cars just sitting in the garage for a few days.

you could also eliminate the clutch damper. it will make future clutch bleeding much easier and faster. and it will clean up the cluttered engine bay. i did a write-up on the clutch damper delete here (http://www.3si.org/forum/showthread.php?t=357075&highlight=hydraulic).

oh, and i got the AC tensioner pulley shipped out wednesday morning. i was out of town and didn't have computer access to let you know. its supposed to arrive tuesday. i'll include more details in a PM.

Thanks, I wasn't sure if you got my message.

I think I might remove that damper. But I shouldn't bleed the system dry? Would this hurt the system even though I'm just gonna fill it back up agaiin?

I also read that you had to remove the brake master cylinder to remove the clutch master cylinder, is this true?

tell me how and why you plan to bleed the system DRY.

you don't want air in the system, logically, you don't want to bleed the system dry. if ur worried about getting old fluid out and new fluid in, its simple. add new fluid, bleed system until all dirty fluid is out (that is, bleed until only new clean fluid comes out the other end).

about replacing the clutch master cylinder, i found on 3Si that some people were able to do this WITHOUT removing the brake master. i'll do some searching, to find more details. it was a bit tricky, but if you can do it WITHOUT removing the brake master, it makes the entire process about 10x quicker, b/c then you won't have to bleed the brakes at each of the 4 wheels.

here's how to remove the clutch master cylinder WITHOUT removing the brake master http://www.3si.org/forum/showthread.php?t=346924&page=1&pp=10&highlight=clutch+master. however, i will tell you that in most cases, those fluid hard line connectors have been on there for the life of the car. and so they will be VERY difficult to get loose. on mine, i've stripped every single one using a 10mm wrench. the only way i found to NOT strip the connector is to use some vise grip pliers. however, there's not enough room for any size vise grips (even the small ones), so i had to remove the brake master to access the clutch hard line with my vise grips.

if i were you, i would try to method mentioned in the linked thread first. try to use a crowfoot 10 mm wrench to remove the clutch hard line. if you strip it, then you'll have to just remove the brake master and use some vise grip pliers.

Here's one with pictures: http://www.3si.org/forum/showthread.php?t=297067&highlight=master+cylinder+replacement

I did mine without removing the brake master. Just take your time and be really careful down there. Without the crowfoot wrench, I don't know how I would have gotten down there so go buy a set. Sears = $50 or go to AutoZone and get a cheap set for about $15. Good luck.

They talk about rebuilding the master cylinder for 10 bucks as opposed to buying a new one. This would be ideal for me. Where can I get a rebuild kit and will this fix the leak where that rod is?

you can get a rebuild kit at your local chain auto parts store.

Well, after removing the reservoir plastic container, I moved on to remove the 10mm hardline bolt... It's still connected, lol. (Don't know why I'm laughing it kinda sucks) I sprayed a lot of PB on it and I'm gonna let it sit overnight to see if it helps. I think I can rule out pliers and wrenches because I'm in fear of stripping the bolt. I guess I'll see how everything goes in a couple days.

Well, after removing the reservoir plastic container, I moved on to remove the 10mm hardline bolt... It's still connected, lol. (Don't know why I'm laughing it kinda sucks) I sprayed a lot of PB on it and I'm gonna let it sit overnight to see if it helps. I think I can rule out pliers and wrenches because I'm in fear of stripping the bolt. I guess I'll see how everything goes in a couple days.

i told you that bolt was gonna be a PITA. a wrench will surely strip that bolt. however, some vise grip pliers won't. with the vise grips, you can make the opening small enough so that when you grab the bolt, the pliers will be on there VERY tightly. so then, when you go to break the bolt loose, it will not strip it b/c its held on so tight. on the other hand, if you were to use a wrench, since its not held on tightly, it will surely strip the bolt if the bolt is rusted in there (most likely it is b/c it has never been loosened in the life of your car).

Well PITA was right. I tried everything I had to loosen that bolt. I ended up cutting the hard line right at the bolt, then using a 10mm socket and wrench and to no avail, came right out with a little pressure. Now that I've rebuilt the cylinder and have it all back in, I have a whole new set of problems. Remember that line I had to cut? All I have to do is flare the end of it, but it's pissing me off more than it should. Mainly because I can't get the fitting (bolt) to slide on the hard line freely... it's like there's some mystery bend in the hose that's not allowing it to go on all the way. But it's dark out now and I can't deal with it at the moment. So far only one broken flashlight from all the frustration...

i don't see how cutting the hard line helped you loosen the bolt?

by the way, did the AC tensioner pulley arrive yet? i think it was supposed to arrive on tuesday.

Wait, you cut the line? The clutch line that connects to the master cylinder? Damn, that's crazy stuff man....did you try a crowfoot wrench before you did that?

Cutting the line allowed me to fit a socket over the bolt. Using the wrenches and vise grip pliers didn't allow me to use the strength I needed to undo the bolt. With the socket, all I needed was the extension to get the bolt loose.

I don't beleieve I got the tensioner yet, I'm in class right now, but I'll check when I get back home.

Cutting the line allowed me to fit a socket over the bolt. Using the wrenches and vise grip pliers didn't allow me to use the strength I needed to undo the bolt. With the socket, all I needed was the extension to get the bolt loose.

I don't beleieve I got the tensioner yet, I'm in class right now, but I'll check when I get back home.

ahh yes, that makes sense. i had a brain fart. so the bolt was on there pretty tight, huh? the reason i removed the brake master cylinder was so that i had room to access the bolt with the vise grip pliers. i can see how it would be quite hard to do so w/o removing the brake master.

PM sent about tensioner.

Well, I finally finished. Everything is fine (except I'm pretty sure I busted my second gear syncro. When the line began to leak about a week ago and I had to try and get the car home, There was one instance where I forced it into second... a little bit too hard. So that sucks.) But now I have a problem, possibly related. My cruise control no longer works. I push the switch on the center console and the green light comes on the dash, but when I flip the steering wheel switch down... nothing. It worked fine before. Might I have disconnected something?

the cruise control is operated by a vacuume, make sure the vacuum hose is connected properly

Where's the vaccum located? A disconnected vaccum wouldn't cause the indicator light on the dash to not function would it? I mean when I activate cruise from the center console, it lights up, but when you flip the steering wheel switch to turn it on it's supposed to light up another "on" light or something like that.

make sure the cruise control unit (just behind the driver side motor mount) is plugged in. also, check to see if the vacuum line (rubber hose, different from other rubber covered wires) going to the unit is connected. there's a plastic nipple to which the vacuum hose connects, this plastic part has been known to break off over time.

Hmm I dunno. I think everythings connected. But now I found one more problem. The other day I was driving in 4th or 5th gear. And my clutch started to slip really bad going up a hill. It sat while I was in class and when I drove it home it was fine. It hasn't done it since but I can say that when it did do it, the clutch pedal felt different, like really stiff. Ever since rebuilding the master cylinder, once in a while the pedal feels very stiff. And then other times there's usually a tiny bit of free play in the pedal, that's how it normally feels. Is there a way of bleeding the system WRONG that would make the clutch not engage all the way?